Recording a jazz band, a big band, oh geez!!!

[EquabileStudios]

I will admit im a bit worried, its going to be the first jazz recording i have encountered. here is the band.....

piano
bass
guitar
drums

four trumpet players

4 trombone players

5 sax players

16 people. but im thing the track count will be 10.
stereo on the piano
2 overheads and the bass frum on the drums maybe?
then each section/player with a mic.

you might be wondering why im worried.
well. my mic closet for one.
this is what i have.

AKG perception 100
AKG C 535eb
Sennheiser 609e
peavey 520i


and an audix drum mic kit as follows...

four adx51's
i5
two D2's
D4
D6

depending on how my ebay auction goes i might be winning an AKG solid tube


so i dont think my 10 tracks will work like i want.

my studio gear, mostly ITB.
i only have the mic pre's that are on my
Digidesign 002r and my
presonus digimax FS

Starting to see? lol.

so yeah, im running pt on a mac ibook G4 (its portable )
i will be doing the mixing on my desktop.

any suggestions?

[JoeDeF]

Originally Posted by EquabileStudios

I will admit im a bit worried, its going to be the first jazz recording i have encountered. here is the band.....


AKG perception 100
AKG C 535eb
Sennheiser 609e
peavey 520i

four adx51's
i5
two D2's
D4
D6

Here's what I would do:

Drums:
ADX51 Stereo pair overhead
i5 on snare
(nothing on bass drum; this is not rock 'n roll)

Piano:
Two D2's - one over the treble strings of the piano, one closer to the the tail where the bass and tenor strings cross over each other. It'd be better if you could borrow a matched pair of condensers, though....

Bass:
Audix D4 on the amp (or the e609 if you prefer)

Winds:
Saxes/bones: ADX51 spaced stereo pair (6-8 feet apart) down at about belly height, about 5-6 feet in front of the saxes, aimed horizontally. This will pick up the saxes nicely, and the trombones will come through fairly well. When a trombonist stands to solo, this pair will capture that adequately.

Trumpet: AKG C 535eb on a taller stand (say, 8 feet high), three feet in front of the *saxes*, aimed somewhat downward at the second trumpet player from the left (from the audience's perspective), over the saxes' heads. This will pick up both the lead player (left) and the main trumpet soloist (if different from the lead guy, as happens in some but not all jazz ensembles). It will get some trombone as well.

For the winds, you are going for a blend. Mic'ing one member of each section will yield the opposite of that. Soloists will know how to "stick out" appropriately by the way they play and project, and don't necessarily need their own mics (this assumes competent, professional players).

That gets you to nine channels. For the tenth channel, you can either take the bass direct (better to have both, and a blend sometimes sounds nice), or you can use the AKG Perception 100 out front on a high stand as a (left) mate for the 535eb, pointing down to pick up the lower trumpets (it's a heavy mic, so use a sturdy stand with an extra weight at the base). I wouldn't "spend" my tenth channel on bass drum; you'll get more returns on the other two investments I suggested (unless it's the drummer's band, or if the drummer is incredible and the charts are Buddy-Rich-like). You'll be surprised at how much the kick bleeds into other mics, which will probably suffice.

In mixdown, keep the soundstage fairly realistic. Use the sax pair of ADX51's as your main wind pair (panned somewhat left and hard right), and then mix in the trumpet mic(s) to taste (if one trumpet mic, pan centered, if two, pan like the sax mics). Pan the rhythm section somewhat to the left (piano and overheads: Left mics hard left, Right mics just shy of centered).

Use very little processing. You might need to use EQ to flatten the piano mics (big peaks high and low on the D2 frequency response chart that might need to be tamed), and to get a bass tone that sits well.

That's what I would do, though other approaches might work for other engineers.

Let us know how it turns out,

Joe

[Remoteness]

Perhaps it's too late, but I moved your thread to the proper forum.

How did your recording workout?

[ajfarber]

This is how you do it.

Big Band session @ Clinton

[EquabileStudios]

its going good so far, despite everything i have said they decided to record section by section, i debated alot with them against the idea. 15 hours later the rhythm section is done. but i cant really complain. im going to make more money this way. i had to find the cash to buy a head phone distribution amp and 4 more sets of cans. but i needed them anyways.

[EquabileStudios]

and thanks for moving it to the right spot, im new here still getting used to it.

[ajfarber]

Originally Posted by EquabileStudios

its going good so far, despite everything i have said they decided to record section by section, i debated alot with them against the idea. 15 hours later the rhythm section is done. but i cant really complain. im going to make more money this way. i had to find the cash to buy a head phone distribution amp and 4 more sets of cans. but i needed them anyways.

Obviously NOT real jazz musicians. There is no way to properly swing and/or blend sections in an overdub situation. Jazz must be played live without isolation or headphones. There is no good musical reason to track section by section.

On the other hand, the studio can sell more time and the engineer will have many more hours of work. I guess, in this case, the studio is you with a laptop, right?

[EquabileStudios]

exactly, and i told them that. i explained all the reasons not to record it like they are a rock band. BECAUSE iT'S JAZZ!!! the minimalistic approach to recording big bands and orchestras have been around for decades because thats what works. and sounds the best.

but yeah, its just all my rack gear and me for the studio. i only charge 30an hour and already they are backing out. we have 15 hours into the recording and they want to stop, i just got off the phone, so now what? do i eat it? take it in the shorts? i don't have the energy to deal with these people. this is a way for me to make some money, im not trying to get rich. im typing this at the library, i cant afford internet. i can't even buy food right now. as soon as i mention the word "invoice" their tune changes. all these guys are in their 40's "a respectful average" i'm 24. Im young but im not an idiot and i will not be taken advantage of.

-----venting sequence complete-----

[ajfarber]

Originally Posted by EquabileStudios

exactly, and i told them that. i explained all the reasons not to record it like they are a rock band. BECAUSE iT'S JAZZ!!! the minimalistic approach to recording big bands and orchestras have been around for decades because thats what works. and sounds the best.

but yeah, its just all my rack gear and me for the studio. i only charge 30an hour and already they are backing out. we have 15 hours into the recording and they want to stop, i just got off the phone, so now what? do i eat it? take it in the shorts? i don't have the energy to deal with these people. this is a way for me to make some money, im not trying to get rich. im typing this at the library, i cant afford internet. i can't even buy food right now. as soon as i mention the word "invoice" their tune changes. all these guys are in their 40's "a respectful average" i'm 24. Im young but im not an idiot and i will not be taken advantage of.

-----venting sequence complete-----

They should pay you for what you've done thus far. In the future, you should have some type of contract or form which the client signs, and under NO conditions should you release any files without full payment. Anyway, it sound like they're a bunch of losers, so ****'em.

I hope you start making some good bread soon so you can buy groceries, internet service and "slutty" gear.