Broadcast advice?

[WVUtubadude]

I have been asked to do a CCTV broadcast of a music festival at my old high school. This will be in a gymnasium, and on a standard high school basketball court (somewhere around 90' across) and will be indoor drumlines (think marching band, but without horns), as well as front ensembles. In the past, as a student, I was limited in my options just because the orchestra director that also ran sound wasn't a fan of anything he didn't understand (which was a lot of things). But now, I was basically hired to come in and do this, which gives me more liberty in doing things.

My first thought was to fly an ORTF pair with omni outriggers (that might not be the right word...sounds right, though) above and a few feet behind the home side sideline, but then I realized that I would need to have over 100' of cable just to span from one end to the other, plus the extra cable for stabilizing and adjustment. The other thing is that anything in the air and remotely close to the performance area could be hit by a flag or baton.

For that idea, I would be using my Mk-012s as well as investing in a pair of omni mics.

My second thought was to just put an ORTF or XY pair of Mk-012s on the track that is about 20' above the gym floor and at least 30' behind the sideline. The only thing I am worried about is that the microphones will be picking up a mess of both the performance and the reverberations of the performance.


My third idea is to do the second idea, only closer to the sideline and maybe 12' in the air. The only problem is that there will be a stand right in the middle of the court, which won't sit well with judges or spectators.

Fourth and final idea is to just put two LDCs in front of the home side bleachers with about 1/3 of the length of the bleachers separating them. The only problem I can think of there is the proximity of the mics and cables to people. Maybe I could run a steel cable across the gym and rig up some sort of suspension system to hang them out of the reach of spectators?


This is just what I can think of right now. I figured I would come bounce ideas off of people that may have done some things like this in the past. Any ideas I missed would be more than welcome. The event isn't until Spring, so there is no major rush for me to finalize plans.

[NorseHorse]

For those that aren't familiar with the genre, you can take a look at a video here (copy and paste the text, because the hyperlink doesn't seem to be working for this):

http://realmusicav.com/rmp/realMUSIC_-_Video_Samples_files/AIA%20Percussion-Small.mov


You'll notice two widely spaced microphones in the video above. The sound is crisp, but you'll there is a sonic hole in the middle. This becomes especially obvious when the snare drums cross the stereo spectrum. They jump right from one side to the other without anything in between. Using a more conventional spaced AB pair or an ORTF arrangement would really help to fix this. You might also consider outriggers to help with any instruments on the far edges. I would not use XY for this (or any distant miking really).


Is the CCTV broadcast in mono or stereo?

[WVUtubadude]

Broadcast mono, recording stereo.

I really liked the configuration in the movie and I would really like to do something that is that simple, but simple obstructs sight lines, which the hosts won't go for.

[DannyL]

Do you have access to the rafters in the gym?

YOU can use a nylon or steel cable or a long piece of pipe to put the mics overhead where they won't get hit by flags and WON'T BE SEEN BY THE WIDE CAMERA SHOT. (Directors want to hear perfect audio and hate to see microphones)

By all means use the outriggers with a pair of omnis...maybe a pair of Countryman Isomax II's or similar.

Don't forget to mic the crowd. Crowd reactions will be important and you will want to hear them. So will the director, I'll bet.

Check all mics and cables for phase BEFORE installing. Check again after everything is set up. Remember a bit of extra work to make it right will make it perfect. Being lazy during set up will give you tons of grief while mixing. Take the extra steps needed to do a great job.

Good Luck!

Danny

[WVUtubadude]

Originally Posted by DannyL

Do you have access to the rafters in the gym?

YOU can use a nylon or steel cable or a long piece of pipe to put the mics overhead where they won't get hit by flags and WON'T BE SEEN BY THE WIDE CAMERA SHOT. (Directors want to hear perfect audio and hate to see microphones)

By all means use the outriggers with a pair of omnis...maybe a pair of Countryman Isomax II's or similar.

Don't forget to mic the crowd. Crowd reactions will be important and you will want to hear them. So will the director, I'll bet.

The "director" doesn't care. haha. In addition to being the audio guy, I am also the recording guy, the camera guy, and "director." The broadcast is for the benefit of patrons in the concessions area as well as in rooms where the visiting groups are given to store personal belongings and hang out and if a recording happens, it will only be for the host group and their archives.

This does not have to be an all out thing, I just want to do as good a job as possible with what I can muster up because I take a lot of pride in my work.

I do like the crowd reaction idea, though.

And I do not have access to rafters. Even if I did, it would be far too complicated because of the design of the roof.

Another thing. I have enough cable to wire this, but nothing long enough for a single run. I was thinking either connect multiple XLR cables, or get one of those nifty Instasnakes and taking a spool of cat5 cable I have in my basement. Any thoughts on that issue?

[MaTr1x2051]

What about floor mikes? You'll have to outfit something to protect them from people. I know its a different genre, but I do the live operas out here with 3 floor mikes (L, C, R) taped to the front of the stage floor. Granted there really is no traffic that close to the pit lol, but its still something you may want to consider.

[WVUtubadude]

Originally Posted by MaTr1x2051

What about floor mikes? You'll have to outfit something to protect them from people. I know its a different genre, but I do the live operas out here with 3 floor mikes (L, C, R) taped to the front of the stage floor. Granted there really is no traffic that close to the pit lol, but its still something you may want to consider.

Yeah, I thought about those. Floor space is a very high traffic area, plus it is wheelchair and stroller parking. The district is also very touchy about tape on their brand new gym floor.

Right now I am leaning towards something like what is in that video, I just have to find a way to execute it.

[WVUtubadude]

Originally Posted by Audiop

One arrangement I've used when flying mic's:
Attachment 144258


/Peter

I was looking through the Flying Mics thread and saw this. I really like it and am considering doing something like it.

Any thoughts on execution?

[bishopthomas]

Sorry, but I'm a little confused. Do you or do you not have access to some way of flying? i think that's going to be your best bet if you have the points.

[WVUtubadude]

There is a track that is about 20 feet above the floor. If I flew anything, I would use four points of contact, likely railings since track access is restricted. I would also have to find cable good enough for the 100 foot span. This would be my first setup of a flown rig, so any guidance on that topic would be awesome

[bishopthomas]

I think hanging the mics from the handrail of the track (just to clarify, a walking track, right?) will be the way to go, as long as you can get the mics placed where you want them. There's a lot of great info in the flying mics thread about how to accomplish this. If you don't have several hundred feet of microphone cable now might be the time to buy some more.

[WVUtubadude]

Ok. Flying is out. The hosts don't want something that can potentially fall. Darn

[Remoteness]

If they are properly fastened and securely mounted hanging (flying) them should be just fine.

[WVUtubadude]

Just in case, how would I go about flying something like Audiop had going with attachments from the side rather than from above? Because gravity will probably have a measurable effect when the array is 50' away from the main anchor points.

[chris319]

I sympathize with your plight. You have very little latitude as to where you can place the mics so I'd place the mics where you can and let the chips fall where they may.

When I think high school auditorium I generally don't think omnidirectional microphone. Because you can't hang mics and you can't put anything between the court and the bleachers, you seem to be limited to that track behind the bleachers. The only solution that comes to my mind is to rent a pair of long shotgun mics and use them as a spaced pair. Far from optimal and you'll pick up a lot of room but you're in a situation with limited mic-placement options.

[WVUtubadude]

My set up time coincides with the host groups rehearsal, so that will give me an opportunity to experiment with things.

Flying is completely out, now. The final nail in its coffin was that it would be in the sight line of the judges for twirlers and guard, which they apparently don't like.


Across the first two rows of bleachers are blank spots that are used for handicapped seating, I think if I can get a straight stand up tight in there, and get maybe 9-12 feet of elevation, that I can get a decent sound.

I am beginning to wish I didn't agree to do this for free. Oh well. Its good experience.

[bishopthomas]

The free gigs are the ones that can be the most troublesome. I find that free usually goes unappreciated, while charging a "pro" rate gets you pro gigs with pro clients. It sounds like you're doing your best to appease them. Chances are that whatever you do they're going to love it. But in the off chance they don't like the sound then that's your opportunity to let them know why it doesn't sound as good as it could. Good luck with whatever you go with; I hope it turns out well.

[chris319]

Across the first two rows of bleachers are blank spots that are used for handicapped seating, I think if I can get a straight stand up tight in there, and get maybe 9-12 feet of elevation

Pardon me for saying so, but that sounds like a recipe for disaster. Assuming some bureaucrat doesn't chase you away from the handicapped rows, you don't want 9 - 12 foot mic stands in proximity to the crowd. Some clod will complain that he can't see the goings-on and insist that the mic stand be moved, and then some other clod will knock your stand over and it will hit another clod on the head and put a dent in their brand-new gym floor when it comes crashing down and you'll get sued over the guy's head injury and the dent in the floor, all for a gig where you weren't paid a dime.

I'd put two of your cardioid MK-012s behind the crowd and be done with it. For a non-paying gig and a high school at that it isn't worth your $$$ to rent mics. If they don't like the sound tell them it's because you were so severely limited as to where you could put your mics.

My set up time coincides with the host groups rehearsal, so that will give me an opportunity to experiment with things.

That rehearsal time will be over before you know it. If you know how you're going to go about this ahead of time you'll save yourself an immense amount of grief.

[Thomas W. Bethe]

I love post like this. You are asked to do something for nothing then told that you cannot do what you need to do and then someone somewhere will complain that the results are not what they expected.

I normally would not suggest this BUT in your case and with all the restrictions how about three PZMs taped to the floor. No microphone stands to worry about and no judges getting upset with sight lines. Just an idea....

[WVUtubadude]

One thing I have noticed recently is a few mics that appear to be SM58s set up in front of the pep band here at WVU's basketball games. I normally wouldn't do anything like that for recording, but would a few dynamics get the job done?