Fostex FR2-LE vs Marantz PMD661

[bloodyh]

Hi all,

I'm looking to buy a portable recorder, for recording dialogue and sound effects. I've got a AT8015 shotgun and I'm using Beyerdynamic DT 770 M headphones; they're not great to run in a field but do have kick ass isolation

I've been trying to make up my mind about these recorders but I can't seem to find very detailed comparisons. I've come across a few review though and here's what I've found out. I am looking for further advice

The FR2-LE has slightly better pre-amps and I read this does for recording backgrounds. I don't have a stereo mic yet but it's an option for the near future. So the -129dB noise floor of the Fostex is said to be more suitable than the -125dB of the Marantz.

The FR2-LE has a trim and a level knobs as opposed to only one gain knob on the PMD661. The trim knobs set mic levels independently and then the big "master volume" knob is for global gain on both channels as well as monitoring levels, that's what I understand anyway.

YouTube - Coffey Sound's Video Vault - Episode 1 - Fostex FR-2LE

These are the only advantages I see on the Fostex. Beyond that, the Marantz seems to be better rugged, have better bigger knobs - it's true that the trim knobs of the Fostex look stupidly small but if it's been engineered that way it must be ok to use... the navigation in the menu of the PMD661 also looks much more pleasant and the pad is intuitive.

My dilemma is that the Fostex seems to offer finer adjustments and better sound quality that the PMD661 but is less rugged and has a crappy navigation system with buttons all over the place. What do you think, does the Marantz ergonomy win over the Fostex sound quality?

[chris319]

I don't like the FR-2LE. The navigation system is OK and it has those low slew-rate JRC opamps as mic preamps, but the output section is a disaster.

How about this?

TASCAM

[bloodyh]

Originally Posted by chris319

I don't like the FR-2LE. The navigation system is OK and it has those low slew-rate JRC opamps as mic preamps, but the output section is a disaster.

How about this?

TASCAM

Thanks but it doesn't have LED level meter and I've read very negative comments on that one :(

[chris319]

Originally Posted by bloodyh

Thanks but it doesn't have LED level meter and I've read very negative comments on that one :(

What's supposed to be wrong with it?

[bloodyh]

Originally Posted by chris319

What's supposed to be wrong with it?

Poor and useless built-in mics and I don't remember what else, didn't keep the pages open... I'm not trying to be rude

[chris319]

Originally Posted by bloodyh

Poor and useless built-in mics

The FR-2LE's built in mics are quite poor. I can't imagine the Tascam's being worse.

[bloodyh]

Originally Posted by chris319

The FR-2LE's built in mics are quite poor. I can't imagine the Tascam's being worse.

Awwwrrr!!! But I read a lot that they were rather quiet... and Ric Viers recommends it in his book The Sound Effects Bible. Right, I just don't know... Marantz, Fostex, Tascam...

[chris319]

In your OP you said you were going to use this recorder with an AT8015 shotgun mic, so is it really important how the built-in mics sound?

If you want good built-in mics you probably want a Sony PCM-D50, but it lacks balanced mic inputs. Between the Tascam and the Fostex I would give the Tascam a try. No opinion on the Marantz.

[bloodyh]

Originally Posted by chris319

In your OP you said you were going to use this recorder with an AT8015 shotgun mic, so is it really important how the built-in mics sound?

If you want good built-in mics you probably want a Sony PCM-D50, but it lacks balanced mic inputs. Between the Tascam and the Fostex I would give the Tascam a try. No opinion on the Marantz.

Ha ha thanks Chris you're absolutely right, but if I can get one with good preamps AND good built-in mics that'll be my deal I mean it's fairly disappointing to spend £400 on a device that you can't even use fully if you need to. Built-in mics would mostly be for slating but in case of a breakdown of my mic it's good to know i've got some back up...

I haven't got my head around all this yet it's gonna be my first recorder but i gotta start with something, and I'm ready to pay for the Marantz... it's the one that people seem the most enthusiastic about!

And yeah the PCM-D50 doesn't do XLR or phantom power (unbalanced only) so out of the question. I'm gonna keep looking for reviews of the Tascam though

[chris319]

You seem to be giving a lot of weight to that one review of the Tascam (I think I found the review in question and have read it).

[jnorman]

i just did lots of research on these units, and wound up buying two of the tascam DR-100s. i just recieved the first one today, and will be testing it over the next couple of days, comparing the preamps with my regular studio stuff, etc. i will post some comparative clips asap.

[bloodyh]

Originally Posted by chris319

You seem to be giving a lot of weight to that one review of the Tascam (I think I found the review in question and have read it).

Well yeah because what's said to be wrong is a bit scary... I'm gonna wait for jnorman's review ok Also I must say I like the Marantz S/PDIF for an eventual mic preamp...

[bloodyh]

Originally Posted by jnorman

i just did lots of research on these units, and wound up buying two of the tascam DR-100s. i just recieved the first one today, and will be testing it over the next couple of days, comparing the preamps with my regular studio stuff, etc. i will post some comparative clips asap.

Very good news I'm looking forward to it!

Cheers

[bloodyh]

I watched this review: YouTube - Tascam DR100: Oral History and Digital Technology

The guy doesn't say anything about preamps quality apart from "good sound quality"... otherwise I really like all the switches, file renaming, the wheel looks pretty handy...

I still can't figure out why there seems to be two gain/volume knobs on the right side but they also seem to rotate together... can you manage XLR inputs levels independently? I guess not since he doesn't point it out in the video...

Otherwise it seems a fair choice for me. But for £50 more I can get the Fostex with the trim knobs... I am not using two mics at the moment but what if I want a long term solution. That's it, the Tascam doesn't seem like a long term solution :( I guess this is just between me and myself now!

I'm still waiting your review jnorman

[jnorman]

hiya bloo - hey, i just got this thing yesterday afternoon, so give me a minute on the review, okay?

yes, you can control the LR signal levels independently. so far, the unit seems well built and sturdy, controls are smooth, and it is quite attractive and a good size. more later...

[chris319]

Again, I really can't recommend the Fostex.

[bloodyh]

Ha ha I was not putting any pressure on you jnorman, just keeping the conversation going

I'll be on the lookout for your review, good stuff!

[jnorman]

short update - i did a couple of quick recordings yesterday using the internal mics on the DR-100 and also using a pair of KM184s on some solo flute material in the studio. while it was obvious that the 184s produced a much nicer recording, the internal mics on the tascam actually made a useable pair of tracks - a bit lifted in the top end, but overall fairly smooth response, and low self noise.

i dont plan to ever use the internal mics, but it did speak to some level of overall quality of the unit. defintely not bad for the money. the km184s performed admirably with the dr-100 preamps (there was plenty of gain - input was set at about 6), and i did not hear any untoward noise from the preamps. it was a breeze getting the files from the unit to my DAW. the unit powers up and down very quickly, which is nice.

saturday, i have a long session of flute/piano duo and i will try to do a more comprehnsive comparison, and get some short clips to post here. i will probably start a new trhread for a short review of the DR-100 sunday or so.

[Vytis]

I had the exact same dilemma up until last week!

Decided to go for the Fostex FR2-LE. Mainly based on the fact it's got slightly quieter preamps than the Marantz (only a few dBs) + good recommendations from two highly regarded sound recordists + personal experience with it while at university.

Since I haven't intended to use the built in mics anyway, I am extremely pleased with the results. Have tried it with both Sennheiser MKH-416 & Rode NT3. Absolutely love the sound. Listened to some foley sounds I've recorded (water, doors opening) as well as speech on my monitors - sounded very natural and even convincingly realistic.

If I have to think of something negative about it, then perhaps I'm not in love with its size and slightly plasticky construction of the battery compartment. That's it. But it's in terms of performance and SOUND (and that's what ultimately matters for me), it's an absolutely high quality piece of equipment.

The Marantz is perhaps slightly smaller and has more usable built in mics, but otherwise I think the Fostex is a great unit!

[bloodyh]

Do you have the possibility to slate with the built-in mic on the Fostex?

[mosrite]

Can a Fostex FR2LE user answer the following please:

Is it possible to monitor from both the RCA monitor outputs and the headphone out at the same time?

From the manual it seems that one cancels out the other.

I am looking for a way to send a mix to camera and be able to monitor from the FR2LE at the same time.

[chris319]

I am looking for a way to send a mix to camera and be able to monitor from the FR2LE at the same time.

Heed my previous post:

the output section is a disaster

In addition to a well-known hiss at the output, if you turn the output level control too high the signal clips. If you plan to use a recorder as you describe, you would do well to find one with a better output section. The Sony PCM-D50 has an optical output, useful if your camera has an optical input. The drawback of the Sony is the unbalanced mic inputs.

[bloodyh]

I might sound stupid but I'm confronted to a serious problem: the Tascam DR-100 doesn't seem to have anything to attach a strap to it. I was pretty much happy to buy that one, but if I can't carry it with a strap it is out of the question!

Anyone to prove me wrong? Can the DR-100 actually be a suitable field recorder for a running man?

[chris319]

Maybe you could fabricate something that would attach with hooks to those metal things that surround the on-board mics?

[Maxjames]

Originally Posted by bloodyh

I might sound stupid but I'm confronted to a serious problem: the Tascam DR-100 doesn't seem to have anything to attach a strap to it. I was pretty much happy to buy that one, but if I can't carry it with a strap it is out of the question!

Anyone to prove me wrong? Can the DR-100 actually be a suitable field recorder for a running man?

The DR-100 has a standard tripod mounting receptcle (screw). So you can just mount it on a tripod (or a mic mount with an adaptor), which is totally secure and FAR BETTER than a strap which tends to allow the unit to swing.

[jnorman]

bloo - the dr100 comes with a small padded case - you might could attach a strap to the case. or you can attach a strap to something with a tripod screw on it. are you really planning to record something while you are running?

[bloodyh]

I won't necessarily be running but walking around yeah, and I am obviously not gonna get a tripod just for the recorder. I already have a custom boom pole that doesn't collapse to less than 1.10m and I'm not gonna get any more cumbersome gear/hardware; I spared £85 making my own boom pole, I can spend this money on a recorder with a proper native attaching system or try to fiddle something else, a mod for the Tascam...

[bloodyh]

I was re-reading the thread and find it hard to believe how much of a pest I made myself and I apologize...

I eventually went for the Tascam DR-100, it's not performing so well with my AT8015 but it seems that the impedances are not matching so well. I should look for a lower impedance mic (around 100 ohms) since the Tascam has a 1.2kOhms input impedance.

Other than that it's performing quite well, I just need to crank up the gain so much that my recordings are a bit noisy but that should go away with a better matching mic.

Thanks for all the advice, I'm very happy with the Tascam DR-100!

[chris319]

The AT8015 is a hot mic (-38 dBV @ 1 Pa). You're doing something wrong.

[mathieujm]

Originally Posted by bloodyh

Other than that it's performing quite well, I just need to crank up the gain so much that my recordings are a bit noisy but that should go away with a better matching mic.

Thanks for all the advice, I'm very happy with the Tascam DR-100!

This is the biggest difference with the FR-2LE. The last version of the firmware (V1.30) adds an option of a 12db boost of numerical gain for quiet situations. Because of the quality of the preamps, this is usuable with no noise.

JMM