Tracking 8-10 piece acapella in a church

[floydisbest]

Hello fellow slutz,
I am going to be doing my first on-site tracking in a semi-large Russian Orthodox church (not sure of exact size), and am not exactly sure how to tackle the idea.

*It will be an 8-10 piece, vocal-only recording. Around 10 separate pieces.

*They would like some emphasis on the lower register, but there are really no 'leads' per say.

*We will be doing some preliminary tracking for 2-3 hours on an earlier date, mainly to see where things stand/figure out mic positioning



I have these mics available in my locker- any hints/techniques off the top of your heads that I should read up on? Thanks in advance, I'm looking forward to this!!

Beyer M88n
Cascade Fatheads (2)
Oktava MK 012 (2)
Shure SM7
Rode NT1A
Senn. 421 (2)
Senn. 441
Senn. e906
SM57 (4)
A.T. 4041

[NorseHorse]

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/remot...heaply.html#26

Listen to Rich's sample and check out his photo down the line. Will hopefully give you some ideas.

[RobAnderson]

What sort of repertoire?

[JEGG]

Use only two mic's (stereo) for the ensemble. Any balance problems, just tell the leader/conductor/group, etc. Or suggest they slightly rearrange themselves.

Your Octavas may be best, but no reason not to try your cascade pair.

If wanted, you could use one pair for ambient. I wouldn't put a stereo array in the middle and use the other two for "outriggers."

Rather, one pair for the ensemble (preferably).

Only if needed, another stereo array further out for ambience.

[floydisbest]

Thanks for all the input, guys!

I'm honestly not really sure the 'repertoire' per say is, seeing that I'm not too familiar with Russian Orthodox practices... should be interesting!

I will try the 2 pair mic idea, I guess placement of mics VS singers/volume will be even more crucial in this instance than in most. Maybe 'x' marks the spot times 8 people? Hopefully this first 2 hour session will get me there at the least.

Would a borrowed AKG 414 help much?

[JEGG]

Originally Posted by floydisbest

Thanks for all the input, guys!

Would a borrowed AKG 414 help much?

Assuming you would have 2 414's:

It will be different but not dramatically better or worse. I own 2X B/ULS and 2 Octavas with all capsules.

Sometimes they can sound remarkably similar. Other times the Oktavas can sound slightly more open, and sometimes smoother. The 414's have more reach on axis, particularly noticeable in omni pattern. The 414's have lots of little bumps in their response which either helps or harms.

The Octava omni is slightly boosted in the upper end, and it changes (but not increases) sibilance very slightly toward a lisp. It only takes pointing the mic's 20 degrees or so to remedy that if it's a problem.

The sleeper capsule, IMO, is the hypercardioid. That is flat and very, very natural and smooth. That capsule is so good, that it partners very well with the classic MKH mic's. Cardioid is OK, too.

Having both pairs available would give you choices, and the option to use an ambient pair if wanted. And you can do Blumlein with the 414's, and that's an option I'd consider if your room is nice.

The thing with 414's is that when they work for a situation, they work really, really well. And when they don't, they can be a little ratty and unpleasant.

If this is all new to you, just show up with your pair of Octavas. Then you can turn your attention to doing the recording rather than thinking about microphone choices.

What matters most is the placement of mic's and performers in the room.

[Elk]

If possible, record both pairs and then choose what you like best. It's pretty easy to put up a second stereo pair and I love having options.

Plus I learn twice as much in a single session.

[floydisbest]

Hey guys, so I went ahead and recorded the 10 tracks with a pair of Oktava MK-012's about 10- 15' in front of the 8 piece choir in the church, along with one AKG 414 further back in center of the church to pick up some ambience.

Anyway, I really didn't do much at all to the mix other than run it through an Avalon 747 w/o compression or EQ, as I wanted it to stay as 'organic' as possible.

After hearing it, they are wanting me to 'warm it up'. I've attached a sample file.

I think maybe they are wary of their performance, although they had a time limit of only a couple of days, so we could only get so many takes of each.

03- Exapostellarion (Hymn of Light).01_12.mp3

Any suggestions on EQ?

thanks-

[Audiop]

Originally Posted by floydisbest

Any suggestions on EQ?

Start with a shelf high and low (cut/boost) to see what it gives. I agree that it needs some warming up.

Possibly take a look at the measurements graphs of the mic and add an inverse EQ to tame the presence lift (whihc seems not to be needed here). Also cardioids typically are a little thin in the bottom at a distance and some lift from 100-200Hz or so and down may help.


/Peter

[rumleymusic]

Yeah, a little dip with a low Q in the 2500-3000 region would be helpful.

I also think the natural room sound is not all that pleasing. A smooth complimentary reverb might be nice to even things out a little.

edit: yes they probably are wary of their performance. Sometimes clients with so, so performances tend to ask for over processed products to mask their own flaws.

[floydisbest]

AudioP, I will try a light boost in the low-end. I did just double check the frequency response of the mics with this cardoid pattern, and they are pretty flat across, with a dip around 10khz, especially if not straight-on from the source.

rumley, I will try a dip in that area as well. I have been toying with the level of the ambience mic, it is a great space/church acoustic-wise, and I'm not sure if manipulating an additional reverb would benefit, but I may try. Maybe the level of that 3rd mic just needs some further adjusting/eqing... this is the 1st time I've recorded an accapella group, and 1st time in this church also--

thanks guys