Thoughts on mic and preamp elitism...

[didier.brest]

Didier, there is quite a huge difference between these mics and preamps that more than justifies the price difference.

Huge to you, significant to me -fortunately because I paid this price difference-, not so significant for many other people. Moreover it's an extreme test since I compared very low cost mics and preamps to a kind of dream mic-preamp association. But in the shootout, of which I gave the link in my previous post, only the mics were changed. Read the comments: the Samsons were well appreciated by some people, including me who preferred them in this test with respect to the Oktava MK-012s (take 2). Note that the mics in this shootout sample rather well the cost curve above from 50 €/mic (Samson) to 1200 € (Schoeps), wit intermediate points 150 € (NT5, Oktava MK-O12), 300 € (AT 4041), 500 € (C42).

The CMC6 Mk21's with things like DPA 4006's, Neumann KM140's, Sennheiser MKH 40's etc. (...) KM184's midrange stick condensers

There is some debate wether there is a sound difference between the KM140 and the KM184. According to Neumann, there is none. Ever the KM184 electronics would be better. Roland, did you have the opportunity to compare them side by side ?

For close mic placement, a mic which stands out for price/ quality is the DPA 4060. Extraordinary detail and accuracy, with a surprising lack of harsh qualities associated with condenser mics.

I agree partly. They can be a bit harsh and do not sound as good to me like the 4006 from some comparative tests available on this forum, as an opposite to the mind of their author.I recently found the best way for recording my piano in my living room by means of a pair of them: with their boundary layer mounts put on the floor under the piano. Sample here attached.

[mljung]

Originally Posted by didier.brest

I agree partly. They can be a bit harsh and do not sound as good to me like the 4006 from some comparative tests available on this forum, as an opposite to the mind of their author.I recently found the best way for recording my piano in my living room by means of a pair of them: with their boundary layer mounts put on the floor under the piano. Sample here attached.

I have the 4060 and like them, very natural sound [no extra top, no extra bottom, that many sds omnis show] and this Didier is another fine recording it seems, do you have a version without reverb box..?

::
Mads

[didier.brest]

Hi Mads,

yes, here attached. I remember that in a previous test you did not like the EQ (nearly none here) and the reverb...

[Don S]

Originally Posted by Empiria

... and 23dBA of self noise. Too much, hard to imagine several of them on spots.

I'm pretty sure because it has a higher SPL than the 4061. I would presume a mic that is designed for high SPL would have a higher self noise. Unless I working with a 4003

[Roland]

Originally Posted by didier.brest

There is some debate wether there is a sound difference between the KM140 and the KM184. According to Neumann, there is none. Ever the KM184 electronics would be better. Roland, did you have the opportunity to compare them side by side ?

The first studio I worked in we had 5 KM84's and I have used them throuhghout my career. The newer KM100 series, IMHO sound better to me, I'm not sure if I've used the KM184, but I'm prepared to believe that they should sound very good, but, many don't like them as much as the older KM84's, horses for courses I guess!

Regards



Roland

[aracu]

Originally Posted by Don S

I'm pretty sure because it has a higher SPL than the 4061. I would presume a mic that is designed for high SPL would have a higher self noise. Unless I working with a 4003

No, actually it has a lower SPL and lower self noise than the 4061.

I've only used the 4060 a few times placed close up. There were no issues with self noise or SPL. The ambient reverberant sound picked up was exeptionally clear and detailed. The effect it had on potentially harsh sounding instruments such as harmonica or santur reminded me of a Royer sf24. It left out the harshness without exaggerating the higher frequencies (with the grids removed) but with much more detail, transmitting a "human warmth" by sounding so realistic, rather than a mid emphasis.

[rumleymusic]

It left out the harshness without exaggerating the higher frequencies (with the grids removed) but with much more detail, transmitting a "human warmth" by sounding so realistic, rather than a mid emphasis.

That has been my experience with the 4061's. It doesn't matter how brash or harsh the instrument is, it can pick up the sound naturally at close range without sounding hard or overloaded. Beautiful little mics. Granted, not a smooth and sweet sounding at the 4006, but for 1/4 of the price the lavs are quite a performer.

.I recently found the best way for recording my piano in my living room by means of a pair of them: with their boundary layer mounts put on the floor under the piano. Sample here attached.

That worked out quite well. I like them as boundaries on the lid, but if the piano is a little bright, this method might be favorable.

[mljung]

Originally Posted by didier.brest

Hi Mads,

yes, here attached. I remember that in a previous test you did not like the EQ (nearly none here) and the reverb...

True - I prefer it as dry as Luis Buñuel preferred his Martini

A fine recording!