Pipe Organ recording - Rode NT55 v MXL 603

[Jonathan Thorne]

Hi there. I have a budget of around £400 and want to make a good quality recording of various pipe organs. I have narrowed some good mics down to two - the Rode NT55 and MXL603. Has anyone had experience of using these side by side and are there any sound samples of them. I have seen some posts about the NT5's but these have been recordings in studios. I'm looking to recording BIG buildings like churches and cathedrals. I wish I could afford some DPA4006's but as I said my budget is around £400. Any help would be appreciated.

Cheers

JT

[Teddy Ray]

the Rode NT-5s with Omni Capsules... Id not hesitate to reccomend them.

The capsule is very good, and very, very omni.

[John Willett]

Røde NT 55 with the omni capsules at your price range.

[Harvey Gerst]

The MXL 603's with the omni capsules ain't bad either.

[Recording David]

So he's still none the wiser then!

Try them both out. I get most of my mics through Digital Village when I buy new and they've always been happy for me to demo stuff (if they know you're a serious buyer).

[jnorman]

a used pair of AKG C391b's (they also make an omni cap (ck92) for this model), or a pair of the new AT4022 omnis would be my suggestions in that price range.

[Jonathan Thorne]

Many thanks for all the help. I guess they are pretty similar to each other. Is there anything I need to watch out for in terms of the specification e.g. sensitivity and impedance bass roll's etc - the last thing I want is a bass roll off for organ music! Oh what about a pre amp I've been told the Alesis IO2 is great...

[Jonathan Thorne]

Many thanks for all the response so far. However I have just realised I made the mistake of mentioning the MXL603 in fact it's the MXL 604 I was after. I've not found a comparative review of the two models I mentioned (Rode NT55 and MXL 604's, which do the same thing), but I believe the MXL has a slightly better spec and is available in a stereo pair at a cheaper price. I have seen separate reviews of both mics, but all they record is drums and high hats in small rooms. Are there any sound samples of organ music or any classical music on the web featuring these microphones?

[Angus]

I've not used the Rode mics you mention as contenders but if you like the 4006s why not a pair of 4060s? I regularly see them in next-to-new condition selling for within your price range. A quick search here will turn up several posts that show what these marvels are capable of. Such as:

Nagra LB - DPA 4060 - Sound Sample of a Forest

see the classical orchestral sample towards the bottom of the page.

Angus

[boojum]

^^^^ That's the winner!

[mathieujm]

Usually everybody recommand omnis to record pipe organ. When you are a pro, have tall stand, time to position your mic, have experience etc. it's certainly the best solution. BUT

In the other cases, you could obtain with omnis some very desappointing soup

To record organ concerts with a quick setup and with honorable results, I use my cardio pair of Beyer MC930. They are surprisingly good to render the pedal of the organs. You can be further from the organ to have a better balance of the different parts of the organ and the good off-axis response give a real sense of the ambiance.

Have a look to this thread
Beyer MC930 for classical distant miking
The last sample is organ

Ok you should have to put 130£ more than your budget to have a pair of new MC930, but I think you would not regret it.

JMM

[pkautzsch]

Originally Posted by Jonathan Thorne

the last thing I want is a bass roll off for organ music!

Right, and that's why everybody recommends pressure omnis.
Cardioids are a bit easier to handle, especially in difficult rooms - but if you have the time to carefully set up and if you know what you want to hear, omnis are the way to go. If there should ever be too much bass, you can easily EQ.
The only cardioids I could imagine for organ recording are the Sennheiser MKHs which have quite a good bass response. I own a pair of old MKH 435, one can get them in the evil bay for about your budget - current MKHs are a bit more expensive.

[d_fu]

If you're not limited to stereo recording, consider 2.1... Two cardioids and a single LP filtered omni for bass, panned center.

I've used a somewhat similar setup, with two Neumann KM 140s and two KM 130s (omni) in the same position in an extremely reverberant cathedral. The omnis alone were too diffuse, so I just added their bass signal to the 140s. Worked quite well.

[mathieujm]

Originally Posted by d_fu

If you're not limited to stereo recording, consider 2.1... Two cardioids and a single LP filtered omni for bass, panned center.

I've used a somewhat similar setup, with two Neumann KM 140s and two KM 130s (omni) in the same position in an extremely reverberant cathedral. The omnis alone were too diffuse, so I just added their bass signal to the 140s. Worked quite well.

Interesting

JMM

[Jonathan Thorne]

Right so if I were to purchase the MXL 604's coupled with the Alesis IO2 Portable 2-Channel 24-bit/48khz USB Audio Interface with MIDI I should be there should I not? I'm faced with a lot of info overload which is all in good faith but I need someone to steer me.

Also if there are alot of you providing alternatives - what in the spec do I need to look out for? The MXL 604's to 30-20KHz where as others do 15 (like the DPA4006) and Rode NT55 20. It's all confusing to me sorry! What do I need to look at?

[mathieujm]

Originally Posted by Jonathan Thorne

Right so if I were to purchase the MXL 604's coupled with the Alesis IO2 Portable 2-Channel 24-bit/48khz USB Audio Interface with MIDI I should be there should I not? I'm faced with a lot of info overload which is all in good faith but I need someone to steer me.

Also if there are alot of you providing alternatives - what in the spec do I need to look out for? The MXL 604's to 30-20KHz where as others do 15 (like the DPA4006) and Rode NT55 20. It's all confusing to me sorry! What do I need to look at?

Don't give too much attention to the specs tutt They don't give you informations about how your mic will sound in a particular situation.

So if you don't have any experience, buy some cheap mic and discover all its qualities and defaults, then you will know where you have to improve.
NT55 (with omni caps) seems to be a better option than MXL to begin.

The Alesis seems to be not a good choice here. I find nowhere (even in the manual) the gain for the mic inputs. So, as this interface is for bedroom studio, I should not expect more than 45 db of gain. And this is often not enough to record organs except if you consider hot mics like the Beyer MC930. For most usual mics, 60 db of good gain is useful there. But in your price range, I don't know what to recommend.

Another option is a portable recorder. You have some recent threads about these.

JMM

[Peter Allison]

Hi all,
as a friend of Mr. Thorne, I agree with everthing that has been said here. I just want to complicate things further if I may. A very good friend of mine has 2 Tandy PZM's which were bought years ago, and never get used. They are original, and come terminated in XLR's ( were they like that new?). He recentley used them to record a pipe organ in Liverpools Metropolitan Cathedral (the wig wam). And the results are really good, and got good reviews in the "organ press".
What are the forums views on theses little crackers???? I have the chance to use them in Durham cathedral in oct to record a live Organ concert using a Canford Audio mic pre amp and a Zoom H2, or a Tascam DAP1 portable DAT

Peter