sorta fake blumlein/soundfield setup?

jnorman · 2nd June 2009

so, you are doing a piano/violin duo. you can do the standard thing of a single ORTF pair out front, or you can spot mic each instrument, or do both and figure it out in post. do you ever try anything crazy?

i was wondering about trying two pairs of mics in ORTF set up back to back in between the players, one pair facing the piano, and one pair facing the violin, with the violin maybe 7-8 from his pair, and the piano maybe only 2 feet from its pair. or you could set up the four mics in XY, facing opposite directions, right on top of each other, sort of like a franken-blumlein.

or, you could take your four mics and aim them like the four mics in a soundfield, and set it between the players, and figure it out in post...

any reason not to try stuff like that? you got any other crazy ideas like this?

staudio · 2nd June 2009

I know that usually when I'm doing a remote recording I just have to make it work and I often have limited time to experiment, so I generally don't get too inventive, but in the studio, or if there is ample time to play, why not try something crazy.

Daniel Stark · 2nd June 2009

i have always wanted to try double m/s recording. this has two cards facing opposite directions and a single fig8 that serves as the mid mic for both pairs.....giving you two ms pairs with 3 mics! that can be mixed to surround.

jnorman · 2nd June 2009

daniel - good one! hadnt thought of that before...

Roland · 2nd June 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel Stark

i have always wanted to try double m/s recording. this has two cards facing opposite directions and a single fig8 that serves as the mid mic for both pairs.....giving you two ms pairs with 3 mics! that can be mixed to surround.

You should, I've done this in several different guises and it is interesting and can yield very good results!

Regards

Roland

andersmv · 2nd June 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel Stark

i have always wanted to try double m/s recording. this has two cards facing opposite directions and a single fig8 that serves as the mid mic for both pairs.....giving you two ms pairs with 3 mics! that can be mixed to surround.

I'm probably not understanding what you want to do, but I would think that setup would give you a lot of phasing problems.

boojum · 2nd June 2009

OP - here is the link for the Schoeps DMS: SCHOEPS double-ms

It is very promising. The main problem I have is a rig to hold the mics. Schoeps also calls for Mk4V's for this app. I am pretty sure it would work with the regular Mk4's. You will need their plug-in to decode and manipulate what you get but that is free with a request. I should really devote some time to making some sort of rig to hold the mics.

I would try a combo of ORTF's but wonder what the results might be. I would think that the leakage/phasing would be the problem. But who knows if you do not try it. It is unlikely it has not already been tried and discarded, but maybe not. I am interested in what happens.

I just recently posted about doing a piano quartet with omni's on the piano, in the crook, and an MS in front of the strings. It came out OK. XY would have worked but I like the MS as it is so unobtrusive and still has the coincident accuracy of instrument placement.

jnorman · 2nd June 2009

booj - thanks for the link - interesting. shmoz kapop to you too...

2nd June 2009	#1
jnorman Lives for gear Joined: Sep 2004 Posts: 1,807 Thread Starter 2 Reviews written	sorta fake blumlein/soundfield setup? so, you are doing a piano/violin duo. you can do the standard thing of a single ORTF pair out front, or you can spot mic each instrument, or do both and figure it out in post. do you ever try anything crazy? i was wondering about trying two pairs of mics in ORTF set up back to back in between the players, one pair facing the piano, and one pair facing the violin, with the violin maybe 7-8 from his pair, and the piano maybe only 2 feet from its pair. or you could set up the four mics in XY, facing opposite directions, right on top of each other, sort of like a franken-blumlein. or, you could take your four mics and aim them like the four mics in a soundfield, and set it between the players, and figure it out in post... any reason not to try stuff like that? you got any other crazy ideas like this? __________________ jnorman sunridge studios salem, oregon Last edited by jnorman; 2nd June 2009 at 04:39 PM.. Reason: unflattering reference to joelpatterson. unintended.

2nd June 2009	#7
boojum Lives for gear Joined: May 2007 Location: Astoria, OR, US&A Posts: 2,308 1 Review written	OP - here is the link for the Schoeps DMS: SCHOEPS double-ms It is very promising. The main problem I have is a rig to hold the mics. Schoeps also calls for Mk4V's for this app. I am pretty sure it would work with the regular Mk4's. You will need their plug-in to decode and manipulate what you get but that is free with a request. I should really devote some time to making some sort of rig to hold the mics. I would try a combo of ORTF's but wonder what the results might be. I would think that the leakage/phasing would be the problem. But who knows if you do not try it. It is unlikely it has not already been tried and discarded, but maybe not. I am interested in what happens. I just recently posted about doing a piano quartet with omni's on the piano, in the crook, and an MS in front of the strings. It came out OK. XY would have worked but I like the MS as it is so unobtrusive and still has the coincident accuracy of instrument placement. __________________ Nov schmoz ka pop.

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2nd June 2009	#2
staudio Lives for gear Joined: Oct 2005 Location: New York City Posts: 1,333	I know that usually when I'm doing a remote recording I just have to make it work and I often have limited time to experiment, so I generally don't get too inventive, but in the studio, or if there is ample time to play, why not try something crazy.

2nd June 2009	#3
Daniel Stark Lives for gear Joined: Jan 2009 Posts: 555	i have always wanted to try double m/s recording. this has two cards facing opposite directions and a single fig8 that serves as the mid mic for both pairs.....giving you two ms pairs with 3 mics! that can be mixed to surround.