Norsehorse has something to say!

[chris319]

Important note from Remoteness:

chris319 did not start this thread!
The posts in this thread were moved (split off) from the thread entitled There's no "right" or "wrong" way of doing it until it's a mistake (derailed version)
I felt it was off topic discussing the Norsehorse dialog in that original thread.
Chris posted the following words and Norsehorse replied.
My post (# 5) was the first post published in this new thread.

It's very simple. There's the gearslutz.com-Remote-Possibilities-in-Acoustic-Music-&-Location-Recording way, and there's the wrong way

[NorseHorse]

This message has been deleted by NorseHorse.
Reason: Don't like on-topic posts move to a new thread. Especially not with a condescending title. Respect, please.

[bishopthomas]

First of all, Shadow did not get banned because he didn't have a backup recorder. It seems that you have selective memory. In regards to the rates discussion, there IS a wrong way and that is when lowball rates hurt our industry as a whole. We don't need to get into this discussion again here (or anywhere else probably). I think the nature of this thread is more on the technical side, but in typical NorseHorse fashion you seem to be trying to derail it. Not trying to be rude or get into another flame war, just pointing out that it's happening again. Thank you for your time.

Originally Posted by NorseHorse

HAHAHAHAHA. Sometimes it's true.

Remember Shadow_7? He wanted to record his brass band concerts outdoors with a stereo pair and reliable, weather-hardy recorder and got banned after being flamed and insulted for not worrying about a back-up before figuring out his main rig.

Oh, and remember all those discussions on rates? There were a number of folks told they were doing it "the wrong way", myself included. Business would indicate otherwise though...

[NorseHorse]

This message has been deleted by NorseHorse.

[Remoteness]

From Norsehorse post # 2 before he deleted it...

Originally Posted by NorseHorse

HAHAHAHAHA. Sometimes it's true.

Remember Shadow_7? He wanted to record his brass band concerts outdoors with a stereo pair and reliable, weather-hardy recorder and got banned after being flamed and insulted for not worrying about a back-up before figuring out his main rig.

Oh, and remember all those discussions on rates? There were a number of folks told they were doing it "the wrong way", myself included. Business would indicate otherwise though...

Very interesting...

I call your perception of those accounts "historical fiction."
I guess we see what we want to see.
I saw where I made my mistakes with regard to that Shadow_7 debacle and I have corrected them.
Bringing up all this mock serves no good purpose since we have moved on from this.

I sometimes wonder whether you want to see this forum succeed or fail miserably.
I hope it's just my perception and the true Norsehorse reality is for the betterment of the forum at large.

Originally Posted by Bishopthomas

First of all, Shadow did not get banned because he didn't have a backup recorder. It seems that you have selective memory. In regards to the rates discussion, there IS a wrong way and that is when lowball rates hurt our industry as a whole. We don't need to get into this discussion again here (or anywhere else probably). I think the nature of this thread is more on the technical side, but in typical NorseHorse fashion you seem to be trying to derail it. Not trying to be rude or get into another flame war, just pointing out that it's happening again. Thank you for your time.

I agree with Thomas on this one; We surely did not need to get into all that stuff in the other thread, and it should have been water under the bridge by now, but what the heck -- as long as we can keep it cool and mature let us discuss further if it makes sense to do so.

From Norsehorse post # 4 before he deleted it...

Originally Posted by NorseHorse

Sigh.

"Typical NorseHorse fashion"? I hope that sad generalization makes you feel better.

In any case, my comment is perfectly pertinent to this discussion and helps to keep this from being a totally isolated thread. In fact, your response itself shows that you think there are "right" and "wrong" responses to this thread, no?

PS. Of course Shadow didn't get banned for not having a backup recorder. He was banned because he finally gave in to the personal attacks. HOWEVER, the situation began because a new thread was started because he expressed the position that having one reliable chain was of utmost importance - even more so than having two weak chains. The response to his statement clearly showed that many on this forum feel there is a right and wrong way to approach location recording, even extending to personal, non-commercial pursuits.

I understand how important it is for you to police this forum for us.
Just please consider having an open mind about the forum and its moderator.

If you have something to say PM me and we can discuss it further in private.
There's a continuous PM dialog going on almost everyday about this forum.
Many issues have been addressed and fixed behind the scenes.
Why not become part of the solution?
I don't believe you want to be considered part of the problem.

Bringing up old issues in a new thread that have nothing to do with the new subject is a bit of a hassle for me.
I do not appreciate the wasted bandwidth and the extra effort it takes me to clean up the mess.

Do you seriously think we want to look at that sad generalization some folks think of you? I think not! IMHO, you are an extremely intelligent fellow, but at times I cannot figure out your motivation.

No disrespect, but your comment really was not pertinent to that other thread discussion. This is why I moved these posts to their own "Norsehorse" thread.

Just for the record, Shadow_7 asked to be banned.
I've learned a lot from that Shadow_7 experience and will never let that happen again.

Let us do the right thing by each other - respect and forgiveness should be on the top of the list

[noamraz]

I actually do not agree with the way Thomas has raised the "off topic" flag - I hope to see less insulting messages in the future, especially when you are telling a friend/colleague here that he's gone off topic.

[Remoteness]

I cannot speak for Thomas, but I bet his words came from frustration rather than disrespect. If you knew Thomas personally you would know exactly the kind of guy he really is. From what I have gathered, he's extremely open minded and fair. He's the kind of person that will give you the benefit of the doubt before anything else.

IMO raising an "off topic" flag should not be considered a dirty phrase; perhaps the way he said it could have been addressed a bit more diplomatically.

I trust Thomas will give us his point of view and we can figure it out accordingly...

I hope we can use this thread to figure out the forum dynamic rather than creating a place for more flame wars and pissing matches.

I know we are better than that -- let us show each other that we truly care about each and everyone that participates in the remote forum.

Originally Posted by noamraz

I actually do not agree with the way Thomas has raised the "off topic" flag - I hope to see less insulting messages in the future, especially when you are telling a friend/colleague here that he's gone off topic.

[bishopthomas]

Originally Posted by noamraz

I actually do not agree with the way Thomas has raised the "off topic" flag - I hope to see less insulting messages in the future, especially when you are telling a friend/colleague here that he's gone off topic.

I'm confused. You don't like that I posted because you don't think this split is justified? Or you don't like what I have stated? If there's something in particular that has offended you please let me know, either privately or here publicly (I don't mind the scrutiny). If you think my statements are incorrect I guess this is the thread to discuss it.

[bishopthomas]

Thank you, Steve. I certainly wasn't trying to offend anyone (as I stated in my post), merely stating my opinion that NorseHorse seems to chase rabbits on a daily basis. I guess I just felt I should call his attention to that since it happens so often. Sorry if anyone got their feelings hurt.

Originally Posted by Remoteness

I cannot speak for Thomas, but I bet his words came from frustration rather than disrespect. If you knew Thomas personally you would know exactly the kind of guy he really is. From what I have gathered, he's extremely open minded and fair. He's the kind of person that will give you the benefit of the doubt before anything else.

IMO raising an "off topic" flag should not be considered a dirty phrase; perhaps the way he said it could have been addressed a bit more diplomatically.

I trust Thomas will give us his point of view and we can figure it out accordingly...

I hope we can use this thread to figure out the forum dynamic rather than creating a place for more flame wars and pissing matches.

I know we are better than that -- let us show each other that we truly care about each and everyone that participates in the remote forum.

[talbe1019]

Originally Posted by NorseHorse

HAHAHAHAHA. Sometimes it's true.

Remember Shadow_7? He wanted to record his brass band concerts outdoors with a stereo pair and reliable, weather-hardy recorder and got banned after being flamed and insulted for not worrying about a back-up before figuring out his main rig.

Oh, and remember all those discussions on rates? There were a number of folks told they were doing it "the wrong way", myself included. Business would indicate otherwise though...

Before the Shadow_7 discussion I never really thought much about a backup...I am now terrified that I don't really have one. I "got" the whole discussion about a backup and the thread did what it was supposed to do (for me), which was make me realize a backup isnt a luxury, it's a necessity. I cannot really get a full back up now, but it is now on the list whereas before it wasn't really on the radar screen.

[noamraz]

I have PMed Thomas basiclly explaining that as i see it -
It doesnt really matter if you are correct or not facts-wise, It is about wether you are leading to a solution, In my opinion, splitting the thread has just brought the focus back to the original thread and opened a new discussion/road with a personal-focus which is potentially leading to a collision with a fellow.

Dont take it too hard, These are just some of my thoughts..

[Remoteness]

Just because some one wants to throw some dirt into my brand new (just cleaned) swimming pool does not mean I cannot take my (brand new) pool rake and clean out his mock.

Yes, he can throw whatever he wants into my pool; spoil my party and such, but he also has to deal with the consequences.

First time, shame on him; I'll grab my rake and clean his mud from my pool.
Second time around, shame on me if I don't do something to prevent it from happening a third time.

Originally Posted by noamraz

I have PMed Thomas basiclly explaining that as i see it -
It doesnt really matter if you are correct or not facts-wise, It is about wether you are leading to a solution, In my opinion, splitting the thread has just brought the focus back to the original thread and opened a new discussion/road with a personal-focus which is potentially leading to a collision with a fellow.

Dont take it too hard, These are just some of my thoughts..

Yes, and what would have happened if Norsehorse PM'd me instead?
Where would the focus be then - on the OP or Norsehorse's agenda?
Would I have needed to split the "off-topic" discussion to another thread?

Did I need to split the posts? Yes.
Did I want to split the posts? No...

FYI, there are many folks that PM me with their ideas and thoughts about improving this forum.
There were even a couple of complaints, but one thing was always apparent with their communication...

I got the impression that they actually wanted to improve the forum without causing a raucous in public. They seemed to not want (need) to publicly address their concerns; they just wanted to make it a better place for all of us.

[Thomas W. Bethe]

This use to be a great forum and Steve does and has done an excellent job of moderating and I have been learning a lot from reading this forum. Recently it seems like every other post is a negative post and we have whole topics that are nothing but one big flame war. Could I ask that we get back to the business of remote recording and get away from all the flame wars? Thanks!

[huub]

True..

It's not very hard to just ignore some people and move on...

[Fuzzy Logic]

its interesting that norsehorse can come on to a thread derail it call it on topic and then complain that his posts were moved to a new thread.

most mods would have deleted those posts but this mod created a special thread.

you said in your reason why you deleted your own post that "Don't like on-topic posts move to a new thread. Especially not with a condescending title. Respect, please. " how is saying Norsehorse has something to say a condescending title? i thought you had something to say or was it just you causing trouble?

i read those shadow threads and it seems like your selective memory got the best of you. i dont necessarily agree with how that was handled but i do feel shadow was also to blame for the mess. maybe even a bigger part than you lead us to believe.

i bet if you signed in with your real name you would not act the way you do on this forum.

[bishopthomas]

It's also interesting that in blatant defiance of the moderator he has reposted his off-topic rant in the thread from which this one came.

[Remoteness]

Unbelievable!

I am very disappointed with this news!

Originally Posted by bishopthomas

It's also interesting that in blatant defiance of the moderator he has reposted his off-topic rant in the thread from which this one came.

[LX3]

How long before we get the "If you don't like what I do or say, please go ahead and ban me" post?

[d_fu]

This message has been deleted by d_fu.
Reason: Misinterpretation on my part, I was wrong about temporal sequence of postings by Norse...

[bishopthomas]

Sorry, Daniel, but I believe you are incorrect. Norse posted here so he obviously saw that the thread had been split. I think it's pretty cut and dry what happened without making any assumptions at all.

[Roland]

I would personally like to stand up for Thomas here. That maybe he is forthright in his opinions isn't (at least for me) an issue, however I don't believe that anything I've seen written by him is not reasonably fair comment. Personally I'd rather have a little bit of edge to threads as long as it doesn't get nasty.

Regards to all


Roland

[d_fu]

Originally Posted by bishopthomas

Sorry, Daniel, but I believe you are incorrect.

I am indeed - I've removed my posting.
Sorry.

Originally Posted by Roland

Personally I'd rather have a little bit of edge to threads as long as it doesn't get nasty.

Well said, as long as it applies to everyone - bit o' controversy at times can't do any harm, as long as comments don't get personal.

[bishopthomas]

Thank you, Roland. And thank you, Daniel, for the apology - no offense taken whatsoever. Roland, you're probably right: sometimes what I write can come across as harsh, but it's because I tend to get right to the point and not waste words. Maybe no one asks for my opinions but I guess that's what online communities are about so I offer them anyway. I'm sorry to those I have offended.

[Remoteness]

Originally Posted by bishopthomas

Sorry, Daniel, but I believe you are incorrect. Norse posted here so he obviously saw that the thread had been split. I think it's pretty cut and dry what happened without making any assumptions at all.

Daniel,

I don't know...

The jury is still out on your observation.
The timeline would suggest a different story.
IMO, Norsehorse knew exactly what has transpired.
The fact that he re-posted dialog that was removed from that thread I started is actionable.

Furthermore, saying that the title "Norsehorse has something to say" is condescending is only relevant if Norsehorse intended his posts to be condescending in the first place. I never meant for the title to be pompous or arrogant; He had something to say and that's what the new thread stated.

How can you or I (or any of us) for that matter know the title was condescending unless you knew the original posts were intended to be exactly that?

Norsehorse asked for some respect.
I say, give some respect and you shall receive some respect.

[Daniel Stark]

While Norsehorse does not post under a real name, he has a tag with a name of his business which has a (very nice I may add) website that is easy to locate.

[Remoteness]

So, it appears that I took a lot longer to post my last reply than it took for you folks to delete, respond and reply to each other.

In any event, I still believe that I'm on point with what I stated.

We have some seriously awesome folks that hang around here.

IMHO, self-important posts can get in the way of the forum's progress.
Please choose your words carefully and if a moderator deletes or moves your post please don't re-post it with the mindset that you're fooling us with your "lost post" concept.

[Remoteness]

Originally Posted by Daniel Stark

While Norsehorse does not post under a real name, he has a tag with a name of his business which has a (very nice I may add) website that is easy to locate.

Ah, yes indeed, but he has made it perfectly clear (publicly and in a PM to me) that he does not want his name on GS because of the advent of (Google) search engines.

We can use his first name, but not his last name.

I bet he would not include a link to his website if the various search-bots that crawl this site found a way to connect his posts to his website.

[Chris Wilson]

Originally Posted by Remoteness

Ah, yes indeed, but he has made it perfectly clear (publicly and in a PM to me) that he does not want his name on GS because of the advent of (Google) search engines.

We can use his first name, but not his last name.

I bet he would not include a link to his website if the various search-bots that crawl this site found a way to connect his posts to his website.

Urban Dictionary: internuts


How can someone who is unwilling to be held accountable for his statements and opinions expect to be taken seriously in the company of professionals?

I'm not saying I'm a shinning example of a professional, just saying I'll take responsibility for what I say, and do. Online or in person.

[chris319]

Recently it seems like every other post is a negative post and we have whole topics that are nothing but one big flame war. Could I ask that we get back to the business of remote recording and get away from all the flame wars?

I second that request. I'm relatively new to this forum and there sure seems to be a lot of bickering if not outright bashing going on here. I don't know what Norse said that got everyone's knickers in a knot, but I have dealt with him privately and he is one of a small number of people who actually "gets it" and he has been very supportive of me recently.

The REAL chris319 (in stereo where available).

[d_fu]

Originally Posted by Chris Wilson

How can someone who is unwilling to be held accountable for his statements and opinions expect to be taken seriously in the company of professionals?

Pointless rhetoric, IMHO.
There are threads here about anonymity on this forum, and the various reasons people have for the wish to remain anonymous. You could add your opinion to these discussions, but the above statement is of no real value here, I would say. If someone's postings indicate competence, then the fact that he's anonymous as such does not take away aything from that.

I'm not saying I'm a shinning example of a professional, just saying I'll take responsibility for what I say, and do.

Considering the fact that Norse is much easier to identify personally than you are, this isn't entirely logical. Whatever one may think of his postings, he's certainly no anonymous forum troll, unlike others who have recently gone on a rampage here.