First time video shoot of a choir...I could use some advice.

[Dickens]

I'll be using a Pro Tools Le rig to record the audio. This is a low budget project.

Please suggest an inexpensive but reliable camcorder for this task. We don't have $2k for a camera.
Any camcorders have good quality stereo mics that can be sent to Pro Tools for the audio?

What is the best way to sync up the pro Tools audio to video...claps before performance perhaps?

Thanks in advance.

[d_fu]

Originally Posted by Dickens

Please suggest an inexpensive but reliable camcorder for this task. We don't have $2k for a camera.
Any camcorders have good quality stereo mics that can be sent to Pro Tools for the audio?
What is the best way to sync up the pro Tools audio to video...claps before performance perhaps?

If you don't need HD video, you could look for a (second hand) Canon XM1 or XM2. Inbuilt mics are ok, but not good enough, esp. considering the camera position. I'd try to exchange the audio in the video with something recorded near the choir with a good stereo pair or so.

"Manual" sync with a clap works up to a point.

[Dickens]

Originally Posted by d_fu

"Manual" sync with a clap works up to a point.

Can you suggest the next best method for sync?

[d_fu]

Nothing within your budget will have Time Code, so there isn't really a Plan B...

[danijel]

Hmmm.... You want to use the on-board camera mic and record it into PT? I don't think any camera has a decent mic. You'd be better off the other way around - getting a separate stereo mic and recording that into a camera that has two phantom powered XLR inputs. No need to sync afterwards.

[Thomas W. Bethe]

Originally Posted by Dickens

I'll be using a Pro Tools Le rig to record the audio. This is a low budget project.

Please suggest an inexpensive but reliable camcorder for this task. We don't have $2k for a camera.
Any camcorders have good quality stereo mics that can be sent to Pro Tools for the audio?

What is the best way to sync up the pro Tools audio to video...claps before performance perhaps?

Thanks in advance.

We did one of these types of concerts last night. I do the audio recording of the choir and orchestra and my videographer does the video. He combines them in Vegas with no problems. You want to get the best possible sound from the choir and camera mounted microphones are not going to give that quality of sound to you. Best to get someone else to do the audio and you worry about the video shoot. Any of the new mini DV cameras will give you acceptable results but of course the more you spend the more features and quality you will get.

There are a lot of cameras out right now that are good quality for very reasonable prices. Suggest calling the people at B&H for suggestions or go to your local Best Buy and look to see what is available. it is a buyers market right now and you can get some crazy deals. I just had a friend go to the local Best Buy and get a 52" Samsung TV for an unbelievable price and they threw in a $300 stand for nothing. Most stores are hurting and NOW is a good time to pick up some real bargains.

If both the camera and the recording are done digitally there should not be much of a drift. If there is the editing process should take care of it.

Best of Luck!

[Dickens]

Originally Posted by d_fu

Nothing within your budget will have Time Code, so there isn't really a Plan B...

So...single camera (tripod), Pro Tools audio, 6 microphones, manual sync...clap! clap!

[Dickens]

Originally Posted by danijel

Hmmm.... You want to use the on-board camera mic and record it into PT? I don't think any camera has a decent mic. You'd be better off the other way around - getting a separate stereo mic and recording that into a camera that has two phantom powered XLR inputs. No need to sync afterwards.

I will have a Pro Tools rig with 6 to 8 microphones available for the recording. Just wondering if there was a better way to lock up the audio to the video other than claps (manual sync).

[Remoteness]

That sounds like a good plan based on your budget.

[Legacy]

Some people use a flash from a still camera (find one that makes an audible pop).

I'd say forget any on board camera mics or audio recording capability - they seem to all sound pretty gnarly until you spend thousands.

I'd recommend the Canon HV30 for low budget, nice quality. They can be had for well under $700 new.

There is a forum with lots of great info (not as good as this one of course ;-) on the HV20/30/40 models:

Canon HV20, HV30 & HV40 User Forum - Powered by vBulletin

-Silas

[philper]

Originally Posted by Dickens

I will have a Pro Tools rig with 6 to 8 microphones available for the recording. Just wondering if there was a better way to lock up the audio to the video other than claps (manual sync).

Not really. Cheap cameras don't have any way to sync themselves to anything else (timecode or video sync), and in truth you don't really need them. Make sure the onboard mic on the camera is on (for a guide track), try to find the most stable clock source you can to drive your PT rig, try to establish some kind of sync mark before the music begins (like a clap slate or mic-tap) that video can see and your mics can hear, and then shoot the whole concert or part of same w/o cutting on either sound or picture. If the show is so long that you have to reload camera before an intermission, then try to keep rolling AFTER the music and get a tail mark. The sync will hold ok, but just ok--after 10 min or so there will be some drift but nothing that you can't compensate for in your edit. In concert video sync is in the eye of the beholder, so if you can make it look in sync it is in sync.

Philip Perkins

[fallforward]

I have an HV20 and have done a couple of recitals with it. The results were pretty decent. I use pinnacle to do the video editing. I sync everything with the old slate, clap clap, method. Though I use a metronome plugged into the board that goes to PT and also to the mini jack input of the camera. Then just mix down the entire audio file in PT. without editing any of the timeline, then load the .wav into pinnacle (or whatever you use) sync up the spikes at the beginning, and edit the video as you want. You just want to make sure you have video software that has seprate tracks for camera audio and music. Most of them do.

Have fun man!
Robby

[videoteque]

The Canon HV20/30/40 are the nicest HDV tape cameras. They record interlaced and progresive, even DV if you don't want to mess with HD.

The tape has the advantage of serving as a cheap backup. If you know your NLE you can have a complete back-up with just the tapes plus a CD/DVD with the projects/graphics. The tape biggest issue is that it just lasts 62 minutes, then you have to change tape. Editing HDV requires a more powerful computer than DV editing.

If you will have just one camcorder and have a powerful computer for editing, you can buy an AVCHD camcorder. The hard disk models can records several hours at maximum quality, they are full 1920x1080 (unlike HDV's 1440x1080). There are also solid state camcorders, no moving disk and I think even less noise.

The problem is the backup, you need a lot of hard disk and the editing. You need a really powerful computer to edit and a NLE that accept AVCHD. You can also transcode from AVCHD to another easier editable codec, but it needs time.