Micing a Jazz Kit

[imacgreg]

Yo slutz,
I've got a little Jazz session coming up on Friday and I think I'm, gonna be dealing with a Jazz quartet conisisting of drums, bass, guitar, and maybe piano, or a horn or something.

Anyway, what would the recomended micing setup for the drums be? I know it all depends on what sounds good, but I'm a rock guy and I need a place to start. I've got a Tele U47, some Gefells, 421's, 451's, two Coles, 57's, D112's, RE20 and a few assorted little dynamcs, etc.

Any ideas?

Thanks,
Ian

[cajonezzz]

If the player is good they should be able to self mix their limbs. I'd start with the 47.....walk around the kit while they play and see what sounds good.

I've had good luck (at the old room) with a royer over head and a m147 about 4 feet in frot of the kit....ya got move it around and listen.

I don't own the coles but maybe you could get the same effect?

If it's straight ahead jazz, a couple few mics oughta get ya straight if the drummer has touch and good sounding gear....

If that dosen't work gimme a call and I'll replay the tracks with my Drumkat and vintage! Roland R8m Jazz card (just kidding..)

Have fun, and remember if they turn into "jazz snobs" take a deep breath before you tell'em to **** off (or get paid first)

[Jay Kahrs]

If you want authentic trio or quartet jazz sound then minimal mic is the way to go. If it's Brecker Bro's. type fusion then you need to treat it like a rock gig. With the mics you have there are a few options so I'll avoid specific stuff. Keep a mic low to the ground at least 6" to a few feet in front of the kit. That's your kick and rack tom, move it around until you get a sense of moving air and a balanced picutre of the kit. The U47 or Coles might be great here, maybe a 421 but probably not. Then from there one or two overheads (Coles? Geffel?) and a spot mic on the snare. If he's doing a lot of brush work a 451 can be an amazing thing. If it's a combination and you have tracks to burn set up a 57 and the 451 and get them as phase aligned as you can by moving the mics back and forth. You can probably put most of the dynamics in the closet for this gig, especially the D112. If you need to close mic the kick the RE-20 would be my first choice.

If you don't already have some jazz albums go out and get some Monk, something like "Straight, No Chaser" is good and Miles Davis "Kind of Blue". If you can get close to that vibe your doing great.

[Wiggy Neve Slut]

Thats a great starting point with those mics!thumbsup

I would go Coles on OH
Tele 47 for frontal kik ambience
57 and 451 for snare... jay's tip of brush work for 451's is straight on the $$.

That should sort u out for the general picture of the kit and then add your 'usual' rock mic suspects later if u feel u need more impact, clarity etc..

Good luck and watch the phase!

PEACE
Wiggy

[Beezoboy]

Personally I would just go with a 3 mic technique for an ultra-natural picture of the set. U47 out front and maybe the gefells placed one over snare high enough not to be hit and one over the floor tom hig enough not to be hit.

Flip the phase on the u47 and you should be good to go. If you aren't getting the clarity you need on the snare then add another, a 451 might be good or some other SD condenser.

Look at mercenary for Fletchers 3 mic technique if you have more questions.

Beez

[imacgreg]

Wow! Good stuff guys... I'm kinda getting a picture of what I should aim for. Anymore ideas are welcome.
Thanks!

Ian

[Fuzzy Logic]

Coles overhead with the U47 out front...

Now you're in business

[Fibes]

Originally posted by imacgreg
Wow! Good stuff guys... I'm kinda getting a picture of what I should aim for. Anymore ideas are welcome.
Thanks!

Ian

It depends on if you're going monoesque or wide... I agree about the 47,451 and coles placement as stated earlier. With jazz I usually end up with three mics at mix but since the last few jazz gigs I've done had no setup time because they came in after the Jazz festival or gig they played just in time for the downbeat at midnight. My last session went down like this:

M269c out front-
SM-2 over the kit-
184s on the outside- I used a cable to get the SM-2 and 184s equidistant from the snare in a sphere over the kit with the Sm-2 over the top and the 184s flanking it.
451 omni on the snare high hat area-

I used the 184s for the tracks that had vocals and the sm2 for the tracks that didn't. The 451 was used on one tune mainly for a controlled send to Altiverb. The M269c combined with the overhead was mostly all I needed. I was glad to have the 451 as an option.

BTW the Royers were on horns...

[fifthcircle]

When it comes to doing jazz stuff, I'm all for a "less is more" attitude. I treat the kit pretty much as a single instrument and mic it that way.

My choice is usually to take a good stereo microphone and place a couple feet in front of the kit in an x-y configuration. Occasionally, I'll put a second mic out for the kick, but that is purely optional.

My mics of choice for the stereo mic are the Neumann SM-69 tube or the AKG 426. If you prefer small diaphragm, a C-34 or a SM-23 can work really well... As for the kick, I like the Sennheiser e602, a M88, or a 421.

--Ben

[imacgreg]

Ok, had the session the other day. The sound wasnt as jazzy as I had thought, although still very organic and a rock setup wouldnt work. Here's what I ended up doing:

Kick In: RE20- Oram w/some EQ-Distressor
Kick Out: D112- Oram w/EQ
OH: Manley Gold Stereo- Millennia Media HV-3
Snare Top and Bottom: SM57-Oram

The sound was pretty good. Very balanced and sorta roomy.
Attatched is a pic of the kit.

Thanks for the tips!

[imacgreg]

Here's the kit

[ExistanceMusic]

Love the 13" hats, did the drummer keep time with them with his foot much, and if so, were they a bit quiet? This is something I've found when using smaller hats, myself, but I've never recorded them with someone else playing, so I'm not sure if it was me or what.

[imacgreg]

Actually, the hats were not too quiet. The drummer had pretty good balance and if the mix was a little off, he would adjust his playing. If the hats were too quiet he'd hit them harder.

Ian

[Jay Kahrs]

So the drummer did all the work and you just put up good mics and take the credit?

Sounds like a decent gig.

[imacgreg]

Originally posted by Jay Kahrs
So the drummer did all the work and you just put up good mics and take the credit?

Sounds like a decent gig.

Hell yeah! Wish all drummers were that easy.

Ian

[drummertom]

Originally posted by imacgreg
Here's the kit

Nice kit! Looks like a 20" kick, 12" rack and 14" floor. 60's vintage? I have the same kit, same finish...

Can you post an mp3 of the drum tracks?

[imacgreg]

Hmmm... Mp3's. I will see if I can talk to the band about that. I'm bouncing some rough mixes today, we'll see what I can do, but I gotta clear it with the guys...

Ian

[Messiah]

Ian, is that a Rogers kit?

It looks exactly the same as the Rogers I had for years.... I wish I hadn't sold it now too!!

I sold it cheap to the drummer from a young UK band, because they were unsigned and keen, etc.. I sold it to them as a favour. They signed a deal with Sony for over £million, probably because of my kit....at least he's still using it and it's gone to a good home.

[Fuzzy Logic]

Originally posted by Jay Kahrs
So the drummer did all the work and you just put up good mics and take the credit?

Sounds like a decent gig.

An engineer is as good as the musicians he(she) keeps.

[Remoteness]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy Logic

An engineer is as good as the musicians he(she) keeps.

Hey, long time no chat Fuzzy George!

I figured you might dig this...

Buddy made engineers sound good.