the last doubt before buying preamp / recorder combo

[evisto]

Edirol r 44+Millenia hv3c

Edirol r 44+Dav bg1

Edirol r 44+DMA2

I need your coments to decide.

Thank you

evisto

[Nobilmente]

Originally Posted by evisto

Edirol r 44+Millenia hv3c

Edirol r 44+Dav bg1

Edirol r 44+DMA2

I need your coments to decide.

Thank you

evisto

Hi

I don't know the DAM2, but I've heard the Millennia and the DAV BG1, and the DAV BG1 is glorious! Honest and musical. Gives the mic a chance.

[evisto]

Yes, I know, but what I don´t know is if the converters of the Edirol r 44 will be good enought for a high quality sound. Anybody knows?

evisto

[Nobilmente]

Originally Posted by evisto

Yes, I know, but what I don´t know is if the converters of the Edirol r 44 will be good enought for a high quality sound. Anybody knows?

evisto

Hi

I guess you've got to give it a high quality signal whatever is the case! Perhaps the question could be angled more toward what the converters are like on the Edirol?

All the best

[matthewd]

I am not sure of the price of these pres but they sound pretty high end - I wonder if the cost of the R44 which is good but at the end of the day somewhat consumer could be better spent it on a Sound Devices 744 on which the pres are excellent anyhow. If you ever needed timecode, then you would have it.

Sorry if you have set your heart on the R44 - I have an R44 myself and it is not a bad machine and in fact for jobs where budget is low and rigging time limited, I use the on board pres with a pair of 4006s and a pair of KM184s which is fine for most basic archive classical gigs.

Matt

[Ozpeter]

"High quality sound" - how would you define that?

If you used the R-44 with its own preamps for recording a classical music CD, I doubt whether anyone would be concerned about the quality of the result. The microphones used and their placement would have a bigger effect on the outcome than the R-44 itself.

[matthewd]

Ozpeter

You are quite right, I didn't want to say, but the type and placement of the mics is probably the biggest factor although on live concerts I do often find there is little choice in placement as there is only one place the venue are happy to plonk a tall stand. I don't know about your region, but here in the UK everyone is health and safety mad which is quite tiring.

The kind of noise floor you get when there are 500 people in the audience and possibly air con running etc negates any real benefit of fancy preamps. As much as I love nice gear, the credit crunch is making me see things slightly differently.

Another amusing anecdote on the subject - yesterday I was at the house of a very well know recording engineer / producer who I shall not name but they were querying why in the 'clip store' of Sadie, their multitrack showed 16 bit when the output of the system was registering as 24 bit on their Prism converters. It turns out as a quirk of Sadie, the bit depth of a recorded file is set in the transport window properties so regardless of the fact the system input and output are set to 24 bit, the RECORDING bit depth is 16 bit. So it turns out this person has spent the last 4 years or so thinking they have been editing in 24 bit when in fact everything has been truncated to 16 bit on the way into the system.

This doesn't change the fact he has done numerous brilliant sounding recordings but it shows how we kid ourselves sometimes........

Matt

[NorseHorse]

I used my R-44 with a Great River tonight. It lowers the noise floor. This isn't critical for many shows.

I don't think spending three to four times as much on a Sound Devices unit will help you significantly in the A/D department. You might as well just buy the NEVE 1073DPD that's on eBay right now. Or any other top of the line preamp with spdif that can run right into the R-44. And are those ADCs even an improvement? I don't know.

Sorry I don't have any advice on which preamp to buy, Evisto!

[videoteque]

Nearly any half decent recorder today is better than anything they used 30-40 years ago. And 30-40 years ago they made wonderful records.

Let's focus on recording, not on 0.001% differences!!!

[Remoteness]

Well said!

Originally Posted by videoteque

Nearly any half decent recorder today is better than anything they used 30-40 years ago. And 30-40 years ago they made wonderful records.

Let's focus on recording, not on 0.001% differences!!!

[just.sounds]

But if the AD is problematic you could consider the DMA because it has build in AD option wich could be an improvement over the stock ones.

[videoteque]

But if the AD is problematic

Why should it be problematic??????

[just.sounds]

Well a recorder in that class probably does not have the best converters. So it could be that the combination of the DMA+AD sounds better than the other options without AD.

Even if the DMA is not the best pre of the three options.
Just another consideration.

[videoteque]

I see it another way. Learn to use the R-44 so much that in the end it can become your limitation. But don't think about gear's limitations first. Think about gear's possibilities...

A four track recorder with 4 preamps and battery operated for 800$ gives so many possibilities that it's hard for me to fault it in anyway. Of course the converters/pres/analog paths/gui won't be the best in the world. But who cares?? Are you the Best engineer in the world?? Are your musicians the Best in the world?? Is the place you are recording the Best in the world?? What does Best mean anyway??

It's just a basic seeing the glass half full or half empty. If you need the best, buy the Nagra at 10x the price.

[evisto]

Thank you very much for your advices. Finally I have decided Schoeps, Dav bg1, Korg mr 1000 and, back up to Edirol r 44

evisto

[just.sounds]

Originally Posted by videoteque

I see it another way. Learn to use the R-44 so much that in the end it can become your limitation. But don't think about gear's limitations first. Think about gear's possibilities...

A four track recorder with 4 preamps and battery operated for 800$ gives so many possibilities that it's hard for me to fault it in anyway. Of course the converters/pres/analog paths/gui won't be the best in the world. But who cares?? Are you the Best engineer in the world?? Are your musicians the Best in the world?? Is the place you are recording the Best in the world?? What does Best mean anyway??

It's just a basic seeing the glass half full or half empty. If you need the best, buy the Nagra at 10x the price.

Even if you could achieve better quality at the same price point?? And f course not everything is the best of the best but I at least shoot for the best possible within my limitations. And if budget is a limitation you should think even more on how to spend it imho.

But i think you spended it wisely evisto! Nice set up.

[Empiria]

Originally Posted by evisto

Thank you very much for your advices. Finally I have decided Schoeps, Dav bg1, Korg mr 1000 and, back up to Edirol r 44

evisto

I use the same combination with a pleasure, backup is different. Good choice!

[Daniel Stark]

Schoeps, DAV, R-44, Mr-1000....Looking at a $6000 investment. Might pay to test the equipment out yourself before comitting based on what people over here have to say.

Maybe start with the mr-1000 and schoeps and see how far that gets you...Backup to whatever for now. Who knows, you might end up wanting a set of omni caps before a new preamp.

[evisto]

Originally Posted by Empiria

I use the same combination with a pleasure, backup is different. Good choice!

Do you use the Korg in DSD format and the audiogate to convert to PCM or you record directly in PCM fortmat?

evisto

[videoteque]

The R-44 seems like very good value. Korg MR-1000 too. Most products competing in the same price bracket are (should be??) more or less same quality. It's difficult to find miracles in new gear...

Originally Posted by just.sounds

Even if you could achieve better quality at the same price point??

[hughesmr]

Originally Posted by evisto

Thank you very much for your advices. Finally I have decided Schoeps, Dav bg1, Korg mr 1000....
evisto

That's my 2-ch rig. It's dreamy ... and easy on your back! thumbsup

[Plush]

Originally Posted by evisto

Thank you very much for your advices. Finally I have decided Schoeps, Dav bg1, Korg mr 1000 and, back up to Edirol r 44

evisto

Incredible and laudable choices! Benefit of possible battery operation. Your sound should be very good indeed. (if you have a good room and good playas.)

[evisto]

Thank you, I will have them here tomorrow and I will use them to record a piano cd on april. I will tell you about them

evisto