organ, two mid side pairs

[aracu]

An experiment, combining two mid side pairs (stereo mics) at different distances, to record an organ concert. AKG 426 a quartet way out in the hall, with Royer sf-24 half way out in the hall. AKG was eq boosted in the upper mids, and Royer was eq boosted in the lower mids.

http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/8/5/2036809/org1.mp3

[NorseHorse]

I don't have any objections to the idea. I'd do it myself, but if I need a rear-of-hall mic, I generally just use the Crown SASS.

Do you have any pictures of the organ? On headphones, I'm hearing most of the midrange on my left side and most of the low-end on my right side. It could be the way the organ is built, but if you are incorporating a mic(s) near the back of the hall, I feel like everything should be pretty balanced.

I'd double check and make sure you aren't getting any phase issues within the rear m/s pair. Not to preach to the choir, but mid-side relies on frequency differences (EDIT: I mean to say phase differences at different frequences) between the two mics. As you get farther back in a hall and have fewer direct reflection, the differences are going to get smaller - particularly in the low end. When you process the m/s in the back of the hall, it can result in one of the sides losing the low end information.

That said, I have no idea how you processed this, but if I were hypothetically doing a similar set-up, I think I would end up cutting the lows out of the side of the rear mic to prevent this.

Thanks for the sample!

EDIT: Thanks to Ozpeter for some forthcoming clarification...

[aracu]

"On headphones, I'm hearing most of the midrange on my left side and most of the low-end on my right side."

Hi Norse, thanks for the comments. The mic stands were set to one side of the central aisle (and tilted slightly to compensate) so that people could walk easily past them. The stereo balance was kept the same in post, and both images were expanded to 150% , with equal volume levels.

"I'd double check and make sure you aren't getting any phase issues within
the rear m/s pair. Not to preach to the choir, but mid-side relies on frequency differences between the two mics. As you get farther back in a hall and have fewer direct reflection, the differences are going to get smaller - particularly in the low end. When you process the m/s in the back of the hall, it can result in one of the sides losing the low end information.

That said, I have no idea how you processed this, but if I were hypothetically doing a similar set-up, I think I would end up cutting the lows out of the side of the rear mic to prevent this."

The organ has pipes in both front and back ends of the hall, although most of the sound comes from the back (the close pair was close to the
back of the hall). Both mid mics were fig 8. The farther Royer ms mic pair (in the middle, not rear of the hall) picked up fuller and nicer sounding bass than the AKG, and worked better on it's own without eq than the AKG in this case.

[audio ergo sum]

Do you hear the pedal?
Why do you use only microphones with the worst bass response, figure of 8 condenser and ribbon mics, for particularly organ?

[Ozpeter]

Not to preach to the choir, but mid-side relies on frequency differences between the two mics.

Er - really?? Phase differences perhaps, but "frequency differences" sounds a bit wide of the mark.

[NorseHorse]

Sorry about the poor definition. Phase differences is much better than frequency differences. I was preoccupied with the low end frequency thing.

To clarify... because the low frequencies are less directional, you can have phase problems if you are too far away (or too close actually) because there aren't enough amplitude differences between the two mics in the low frequences.

(Better? thumbsup)