Oade Brothers Modded Edirol R-44 Portable Recorder Review and Shoot-Out with Clips

[NorseHorse]

Greetings from VA. I recently purchased an Edirol R-44 Compact, Solid State, 4-Channel Field Recorder with the SUPERmod from OADE BROTHERS AUDIO Field Recording Experts. I've had to record a number of shows in the past week using the R-44, and I'd like to report my results thus far, complete with clips and a comparison with a Great River MP-2M

REVIEW AND SAMPLES AVAILABLE HERE: Review of Oade Brothers Edirol R-44 Digital Recorder

I've included two pictures of the unit in use. I tracked the concert with a Crown SASS mic in the hall and two AT4050s in omni up close to the woodwinds (they had to be moved off the edge of the stage to make room for another group - oh well). All four channels were run through the R-44 - you can see it there at the base of the mic stand.

[NorseHorse]

Christopher Adams - piano (small recital hall; SASS mic off the front of the stage)

[NorseHorse]

Does this unit have enough gain for all my mics? Let's find out...

I ran an acappella session this afternoon on my laptop, Saffire 26i/o, and Great River MP-2M. After the session was done, I brought in the R-44 and connected it to my Schoeps CMTS 501U stereo mic. I connected one channel directly into the R-44 and the other into the Great River and then into the R-44. What you hear is the room, +28db gain.

To listen to the samples, go to: Oade Modded Edirol R-44 Review

Enjoy!

[NorseHorse]

After more use and purchasing a second R-44, I have some thoughts.

- The preamps are decent and uncolored, but I don't use them for the main pair in critical location work for what I consider "A-rig" clients. They are detailed, but I find substituting a pro-level preamp will lower the noise floor (you can listen to the sample above to compare). However, I have on many occassions run spots directly into the R-44. I also use it for recitals and other basic recordings. I really like having the flexibility to use it on it's own if needed, as well as interfacing it with different pres. (UPDATE 10/2009: I now feel more comfortable using the preamps on the R-44. Much of the noise I was hearing was coming from the self-noise of the high self-noise Crown SASS and not the R-44 preamps.)
- LINK MODE: I've used my R-44s in tandem synced via 1/8" cable successfully. This keeps them working off of the same clock. If the SLAVE stops because it's run out of space, the MASTER keeps going. I have yet to try the reverse. It would also be good for me to test out what happens if the cable gets pulled. I'll try and remember to do that.
- I would really like it if you could bypass the smaller "LEVEL" knob. It isn't stepped, so it sometimes messes up my matched levels by anywhere from 0 to 1db. I'm going to ask Doug to see if they can be disabled.
- Doug Oade has been great communicating. I had a noise problem on one channel, and he's going to take a look at it for me.
- As others have mentioned, the headphone amp isn't that strong, but I rarely use it anyway. [EDIT: Headphone amp is plenty strong. I was using sucky headphones. Now I use the headphone amp all the time.]
- If you're like me and sometimes have gigs that you can set-up for but can't actually be present for the show, the R-44 makes delegating the RECORD and STOP duties to someone else easy. I've run it for 1hr 45m before on four tracks at 24/48 no problem. I've yet to see what happens when the WAV file hit the 2GB mark.

[leddy]

Originally Posted by NorseHorse

- LINK MODE: I've used my R-44s in tandem synced via 1/8" cable successfully. This keeps them working off of the same clock.

I have a pair of stock R44's. It's my understanding from the manual that they do not sync to the same clock. They just start about the same time. You can clearly see a small delay in the slave unit when starting/stopping/pausing, etc. I've ran tests, and it is usually around 2-3 milliseconds. I fix it in post in needed.

Not ideal, but it gets the job done. Otherwise, I love my R44's.

[mixedupsteve]

Originally Posted by NorseHorse

- I would really like it if you could bypass the smaller "sensitivity" knob. It isn't stepped, so it sometimes messes up my matched levels by anywhere from 0 to 1db. I'm going to ask Doug to see if they can be disabled.

Hi Christian,
I'm not sure that would be a good idea. According to the block diagram the sens knob is the gain and the level is an output attenuator. By using both you can change the "color" of the sound if you want to.
I

[Ozpeter]

It's my understanding from the manual that they do not sync to the same clock. They just start about the same time.

Oh. My understanding from the manual and from those using pairs is that the clocks are in sync via the cable (ie no drift) and that start/stop isn't precisely in sync - but reports from the field say that the difference is consistent so it's easy to align the tracks in your DAW (and then they stay aligned).

The noise floor of the R-44 is about 30dB below the noise floor of this city's quietest performance location, and their frequency response is effectively flat, so I've not found it necessary to use external preamps. Having everything in one small box is such a convenience when setting up, and when carrying in the stuff from the van!

I would characterise the headphone output as 'beefy' - and also very low noise - I've not seen adverse comment on it elsewhere. I never need to have it more than half way up. Of course it may depend on the cans you use.

Running on battery power and thus dispensing with the need to find a spot where the mic cables can be routed to with minimal tripping hazards, and also where there is a power point, makes life so much easier.

Monitoring and replaying four channels in panned and balanced stereo is the one basic thing the R-44 can't do. You have to have the channels LRLR or in mono. The Naiant four channel monitoring amp continues to be a great solution, though it's a pity to have to add that extra box to the setup. If you are content just to ensure audio acquisition is fault-free, then the R-44 monitoring is well thought out for that and it can stand alone.

The promised firmware upgrade to fix a few bugs is getting a bit overdue - I do hope they haven't decided against it....

All in all, I cannot imagine justifying the purchase of any other recorder between now and the time when I'm too deaf to be allowed into a concert hall. Others who have purchased one (or two!) on my recommendation have been similarly delighted. The reported cost/satisfaction ratio for this device seems very high.

[NorseHorse]

To clarify, I was refering to the inner knob which is the output attenuator. Just refered to the manual and it's called the LEVEL knob (you're right, the other one is the SENS, sorry!). For recording purposes, I'd prefer to have the LEVEL at UNITY gain (12 noon) all the time. Anywhere else just seems to get in the way. Interesting thought abut the "beef" control though.

And linking the R-44s allows for "clock-synchronized recording". The aren't guaranteed to start at precisely the same millisecond, but the cable ensures they move in lock step once they're moving.

[leddy]

Thanks for the clarification on the clock thing.

[Ozpeter]

The inner knob is just digital gain - it's been claimed elsewhere that there's more to it than that, but given that if you put it to the bottom you get digital silence (all bits zero) then it seems to do nothing you can't do later in your DAW with no risk.

[Tommy-boy]

I'm loving my R44.

One thing I was wondering the other day - I wonder what would happen if you used a Y cable and tried to hook three R-44s together (1 master and 2 slaves) Would it work? Not that I need all of the inputs for the stuff I record. Just a curiosity.

Norse - also outta curiosity, have you listened to the stock pre in the R-44 or have you always just used R-44s that were modded?

-Tom

[Ozpeter]

Using three - no problem! See this story on the Edirol site, which implies official approval for the method -

Black Dog Productions Uses Multiple R-44's on Location

[Tommy-boy]

Originally Posted by Ozpeter

Using three - no problem! See this story on the Edirol site, which implies official approval for the method -

Black Dog Productions Uses Multiple R-44's on Location

That's cool. That really adds to the versatility of the unit as you can keep expanding as needed.

[leddy]

If they sync to the same clock, why can't they start and stop at the same time?

Wouldn't that just be a reasonable software fix?

[iluvatar]

Originally Posted by Ozpeter

I would characterise the headphone output as 'beefy' - and also very low noise - I've not seen adverse comment on it elsewhere. I never need to have it more than half way up. Of course it may depend on the cans you use.

Really? I've got an R-4 Pro that I typically use with Sony 7506's. I have to turn it up quite a bit and it sounds like I'm at the f'in ocean.

-Dan.

[Tommy-boy]

I use the R-44 with 7506s and it's just fine. I don't find it thin or ocean like, and I certainly don't crank the volume all the way up. I agree with Oz's assessment.

[Ozpeter]

Really? I've got an R-4 Pro that I typically use with Sony 7506's. I have to turn it up quite a bit and it sounds like I'm at the f'in ocean.

Hmmm - the R-4 Pro mic preamps are supposed to be the same as the R-44 preamps, according to Edirol. But I don't know about the headphone amp.

I did some tests the other day recording in a new empty concert hall some dog clicker sounds outside its 'airlock' doors - the sound would have been barely audible inside. The recording level was set to the level for the chamber recital I was there for. Those clicks could be heard faintly but clearly - with hall reverb - when playing back with the headphone gain at maximum, and with the hall general noise floor being much more significant than the R-44 preamp noise or the headphone playback noise. That's using Sennheiser MKH series MS mics and Sennheiser HD25 Mk 2 headphones. And 16 bits.

Actually I've prepared a short file (less than one minute) containing recordings from that hall, which starts with applause peaking to full scale, fading into empty hall noise with some clicks from outside the hall, fading into preamp noise recorded with 150 ohm termination - all recorded at the same level, no normalising or other level changes apart from the crossfades.

When replayed, in the hall noise section you should just about be able to hear a slight 2kHz whine - only just, when you are in the hall you wonder whether you are hearing it or not - and the clicks should be barely audible. If you have it so that the whine and clicks are clearly audible, you are playing back unrealistically loud (which with music content would in effect skew the perceived frequency response). If replayed at the 'authentic' level, you should find the applause about as loud as you'd care to listen to it, the whine and clicks should barely be heard, and the system noise should be inaudible. I think it's a good test of real world location noise levels vs system noise.

http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/9/...44%20noise.wav

[JEGG]

I'm liking this discussion of the Edirol.

Why didn't they use standard "XLR" and BNC for time code?

Does anyone know exactly what is being communicated between the units while synch'd?

Can they be linked to an (industry standard) external clock? (Sorry if that's already be covered, I'll go back and look.)

Where is the 2 kHz whine coming from, and I'm curious to know if it's there when the unit was powered from batteries? That would probably take care of dither. (I'm joking, no flames please.)

It would also be nice to hear a comparison of the modded version with the one that comes from Edirol.

Finally, I do not understand what they did with the battery powering of this unit. 4 AA's seem not to be enough. The HD-P2 I have runs from 8 AA's (NiMH), and provides well over 5 hours using quite thirsty mic's and using the headphone output as well as the LCD display.

An external mic pac would be easy enough to assemble for the R-44, just using AA's and a battery holder from, um, Radio Shack.

Please take this as curiosities and not criticism of the unit.

Thanks to all of you with the R-44's.

[Ozpeter]

The way they implement time code (or clock sync which I think it simply is) reflects the need to keep the price down - the R4-Pro is there for people who need a larger more fully featured unit.

The 2kHz whine comes from a rack room near the hall. An unfortunate late mod to the hall's design, apparently. Most people at a concert would be unaware of it, as it's only just audible when the hall is empty - typical audience breathing and shuffling noise would cover it, as would the sound of the performance.

I'm unaware of anyone who has reported a meaninful comparison of an Oade-mod unit and a stock unit. He simply sells by reputation it seems.

Battery life is ok for a typical classical concert, but to be sure I use a small external rechargeable power pack, while keeping a fully charged set of batteries in the R-44 too. You can freely disconnect and reconnect external power without upsetting the R-44 while recording. The other approach is to change batteries in the interval.

I've just done some simple bench tests of the R-44 gain structure vs noise and the results can be seen at Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)

[JEGG]

Originally Posted by Ozpeter

The 2kHz whine comes from a rack room near the hall. An unfortunate late mod to the hall's design, apparently. Most people at a concert would be unaware of it, as it's only just audible when the hall is empty - typical audience breathing and shuffling noise would cover it, as would the sound of the performance.

Sorry, I completely misunderstood this. I thought it was coming from the R44.

Originally Posted by Ozpeter

I'm unaware of anyone who has reported a meaninful comparison of an Oade-mod unit and a stock unit. He simply sells by reputation it seems.

I'm surprised no one has done that.

Originally Posted by Ozpeter

Battery life is ok for a typical classical concert, but to be sure I use a small external rechargeable power pack, while keeping a fully charged set of batteries in the R-44 too. You can freely disconnect and reconnect external power without upsetting the R-44 while recording. The other approach is to change batteries in the interval.

Wasn't sure you could change power supplies without upsetting something. That's helpful to know. Still, couldn't they have provided for at least 8 batteries?

Originally Posted by Ozpeter

I've just done some simple bench tests of the R-44 gain structure vs noise and the results can be seen at Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)

And thanks for that and for your other information.

[Dave Ferris]

Anyone with any Jazz piano/vocal short clips?

Very interested in hearing.

Thanks

NorseHorse, your recording of the Gershwin Prelude sounds good.

[NorseHorse]

I'm going to have to retract my earlier evaluation of the headphone amp as "not that strong". I'd been using cheapo headphones most of the spring while I waited for replacement bands for my Extreme Isolation headphones. Once the EIs were back up and running, I realized Ozpeter was definitely right - whatever noise floor the headphone amp has is well below the noise floor of all the rooms I record in, even the quiet ones.

PS. Thanks for the compliment, Dave!

[LX3]

I'm enjoying my (unmodified) R-44 as well. It doesn't get a vast amount of use - most recordings I do use ten times as many tracks! - but occasionally it's the perfect device. Just the other day I was asked to record some piano for a friend, so rolled up with just a bag of mic stands and a Peli case with everything else in. That was a novelty!

I'll post a clip if anyone would like to hear the result. Four mics on a 6ft "parlour grand" in the owner's dining room. 30 minutes of music recorded in an hour and a half, including setup and tear down. I like that

[Dave Ferris]

Originally Posted by LX3

I'll post a clip if anyone would like to hear the result. Four mics on a 6ft "parlour grand" in the owner's dining room. 30 minutes of music recorded in an hour and a half, including setup and tear down. I like that

Please.

My DPA 4011s arrived today and my tuner is here working on the regulation on the D. Just have to nail this format thing down.
Standalone -Sound Devices, Nagra LB vs MBP/ ULN-8.

[LX3]

Here you go. A bit of piano, recorded fairly quckly on an R-44. Probably a more up-front sound than you're aiming for, if you're doing classical... to be honest, it's a little more up-front than I was intending!

[fondone]

what exactly is the "mod" you are talking about.....is it to the analog section.....opamps?


thanks

[fondone]

my mistake just found the link .....sorry

[Dave Ferris]

Originally Posted by LX3

Here you go. A bit of piano, recorded fairly quckly on an R-44. Probably a more up-front sound than you're aiming for, if you're doing classical... to be honest, it's a little more up-front than I was intending!

Thanks Paul, sounds good. Be curious to hear a modded Oade vs Non. Also the modded Oade pramps vs External pre. I think Norsehorse mentioned he recorded the Gershwin piece with a Great River.

[NorseHorse]

The "real-life" samples I posted were through the R-44 preamps, so you can hear how they hold up. I've found them uncolored with lots of clean gain. As you can hear in the comparison between the GR and R44, the GR has a slightly lower noise floor. If you have top shelf preamps (GR, MM, Grace, etc), you can put them on the front end and the R44 plays nice with them. However, as the samples and AB comparison demonstrates, the R44 pres can stand on their own, especially in situations where portability is key. Ozpeter regularly records with the internal pres, and probably has some samples from nicer groups and venues than the ones I posted.

[Tommy-boy]

Originally Posted by Ozpeter

...Monitoring and replaying four channels in panned and balanced stereo is the one basic thing the R-44 can't do. You have to have the channels LRLR or in mono. The Naiant four channel monitoring amp continues to be a great solution, though it's a pity to have to add that extra box to the setup. ...

I didn't know that Naiant had a four channel monitoring amp (or any amps for that matter). I'm kinda curious about what your using. Any info or links would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Tom