Olympus LS 10 or Edirol R09 DR ?

[chet.d]

trying to decide between the two. Mostly for song ideas that might / could be used ITB later.

I just sold the H4 mostly because I'm kinda blind and the display annoyed me. If I'm going to get another, I'd like to get a slightly better quality one. The Edirol display and remote is nice though the Olympus display looks fine and may ? sound better.

Considering the Sony PCM D50 as well though might but a bit more than I'd like to spend. And again, the display may not be as good as the other 2 mentioned.
thanks for any take.

[John Willett]

All three you mention were my short-list.

I bought the Olympus LS-10 - I'm very happy with it.

[chet.d]

Thanks for chiming in, that's kinda what I'm leaning towards.

[ray dsr]

Tascam is making one too.

[asciidv]

I bought an LS-10 primarily because it received a good report from a regular contributor to the Gearslutz forums. I found it very easy to use, but thought the mics and noise level were poor.

Perhaps the man who buys a Nagra VI with a BERGUNDY front (!!!!) might like to comment on the noise level of his LS-10?

[John Willett]

Originally Posted by asciidv

I bought an LS-10 primarily because it received a good report from a regular contributor to the Gearslutz forums. I found it very easy to use, but thought the mics and noise level were poor.

Perhaps the man who buys a Nagra VI with a BERGUNDY front (!!!!) might like to comment on the noise level of his LS-10?

Careful, Plush has a Burgundy Nagra VI as well. And it's more classy that the purple HHB stuff.

I am happy with my LS-10 and have not noticed a noise problem.

Comparing it with the same thing recorded on the Nagra VI with an ORTF pair of MKH 8040 I could easily hear the difference, especially at the bass end - but you don't compare a recorder costing £250 with a setup costing about £7,000.

The primary reason I got the LS-10 was the perfect "feel", the quality construction and the fact that it is easily pocketable - so easy that ther is no problem carrying it around all day on the off-chance and not actually using it.

For serious stuff I use the Nagra VI.

But I have no complaints about the results with the LS-10 at all.

[ergalthema]

So, besides the well-known display and interface problems with the H4, are there any other complaints?

I'm trying to decide between the H4 and LS10 myself. I have to say I like the XLRs and slightly cheaper tag of the H4.

I would be recording band practices and some doing some field recording for samples and possibly nat sound for video... possibly recording some live shows.

Any opinions?

[Corran]

This is the first I've read of those problems with the H4. I personally find the display fine, but what exactly is the interface problem? Just wondering if I should be watching out for something in specific.

The XLR inputs have changed the way I think of "portable recording." I personally suggest the H4 to anyone, but I haven't had any experience with the LS-10 myself.

[dlmorley]

Extremely happy with my Edirol R09HR. Sounds REALLY good. Battery life is very good. Remote included. Support up to 32GB cards now I believe.
Just does what it should.

[John Willett]

Originally Posted by bradhebert

So, besides the well-known display and interface problems with the H4, are there any other complaints?

I had heard that there were low level noise problems with the H4 that, as they were hardware based, could not be corrected.

OK on 24/96 but showed up at other settings.

Bus some people found them so low level they ignored them.

Just reporting what I have read about this on various Forums.

[Corran]

Originally Posted by John Willett

I had heard that there were low level noise problems with the H4 that, as they were hardware based, could not be corrected.

I read about that in conjunction with recording in mp3 mode, that it was picking up the sound of the electronics or something. But still, not something anyone would care about, since if you are doing an important recording you probably aren't using the mp3 mode...

I certainly haven't heard any noise problems, either with the internal or external mics at all gain settings. I have not recorded with 96khz though.

[ergalthema]

Originally Posted by Corran

This is the first I've read of those problems with the H4. I personally find the display fine, but what exactly is the interface problem?

I've just read multiple times that the screen isn't very good, and that the menu system is difficult to use.


Thanks for all the input - sounds like I'll be getting the H4.

[John Willett]

Originally Posted by bradhebert

I've just read multiple times that the screen isn't very good, and that the menu system is difficult to use.

The screen and menus of the LS 10 are excellent - it's very instinctive and easy to use.

[t_chance]

Another happy LS10 owner. I never "A-B"ed them, but love the ease of use, totally intuitive. It sounds great too.

[JoFo]

I know this thread is a bit old now, but I am looking at the 09hr and the olympus as well, and I found this very handy page at wingfieldaudio.com which has sound samples of the edirol, olympus, zoom, sony, tascam, and a few other portable recorders.

Portable Recorder Sound Samples

it's a very handy reference point if you are interested in a budget portable recorder, and you need help choosing the right one for you.

[John Willett]

I like my LD -10 - ergonomic pocketable and easy to use.

But the R-09HR is the only one with a built-in recovery program if something goes wrong.



Posted via the Gearslutz iPhone app

[violinbf]

I just spent a lot of time researching these units and I can say without a doubt that the best unit on the market is the Sony PCM-M10.

The LS-10 rolls off bass 6db per octave starting at ~100Hz and is more than 30db down at 20hz. This roll off is present on the internal mics and the external mic connection and can not be turned off.

The PCM M10's specs blow the competition out of the water. It boasts the longest recording time (50hrs on 2 AA), quietest external mic preamps (-122db), quietest internal mics (17db), lowest THD, mic and line level are highly resistant to overload, line in supports professional levels (2V peak) etc etc.

Built in mics are very quiet and sound good, but the sound stage is not ideal becuase they are closely spaced omnis. Frequency response is natural but sound stage approaches mono in this configuration.

I have coupled this machine with a pair of Sennheiser MKE-2 mics that run off of the PCM-M10's 3V PIP. The separate mics allow for many different stereo configurations AB spaced, Jecklin Disk, binaural etc. The result is sound quality that rivals some studio setups and is so compact that it fits in your pocket. I have used this setup to record symphony orchestra and chamber ensembles with great sucess.

No it doesn't have Digital I/O or XLR phantom power. Yes the Lavalier MKE2 mics are a little noisy (25db) but usually the halls ambient noise is louder than that. The next step up in terms of I/O and preamp performance and is the Fostex FR2-LE...but unit is much larger and battery life is dismal by comparison.

Price is $255 from B&H at the moment.

A pair of MKE-2s terminated with a 1/8 stereo jack is $250 from microphonemaddness.com

[John Willett]

The new LS-11 is better than the LS-10 with less of a roll-off. These are the best pocketable machines.

The R-09HR is the best for safety as it's the only one with a recovery program.

But I would always take the PCM D-50 over the D-10 anyday.



Posted via the Gearslutz iPhone app

[hbphotoav]

Another happy R09 user here. Primarily used for backup (stereo analog out from Mackie Onyx or Apogee Ensemble) but occasionally for surreptitious location recording (daughter's choir concert several years ago). Most happy with it in both usages. Rechargeable NiMH Energizers last 5-6 hours.

HB

[mathieujm]

Originally Posted by violinbf

The next step up in terms of I/O and preamp performance and is the Fostex FR2-LE...but unit is much larger and battery life is dismal by comparison.

tutt I had 10h of continuous recording with phantom + screen light + headphone on my FR2LE with an internal 4000mah Tamiya battery.

JMM

[Schaap]

Originally Posted by John Willett

The new LS-11 is better than the LS-10 with less of a roll-off. These are the best pocketable machines.

But I would always take the PCM D-50 over the D-10 anyday.

I moved from LS-10 to LS-11 and to me it was an upgrade, esp/ in the bass region and more '3D'. The PCM D-50 is a great sounding unit IMO.
I have a Zoom H2 too, nice but not in the same league as the Olympus and the D-50

[violinbf]

The LS-10 rolls of at 150hz and the LS-11 at 90hz but at a steeper angle

LS-11 | Linear PCM Recorder | Olympus Imaging Asia

You can not defeat the roll off in either the LS-10 or LS-11. This unacceptable to me for any critical recording where you want full frequency response. You can use an external pre to achieve full frequency response. However the line in on both these units will not accept Pro level 4dbu, only -10dbv and thus limits your choices. The M-10 is flat 20hz-20Khz using both the internal and mic pres (high frequency response extends well beyond 20Khz on the mic input.)

Sony D-50 is great too. The D-50 offers more rugged construction than the M-10, card internal mics vs omni (albeit with more internal noise), digital I/O, and a nifty -20db dual recording limiter function. However the D-50 is 3x larger than the M-10, requires 4AA batteries and only achieves 1/2 the battery life of the M-10. Preamp/Line in/ADC performance is almost identical.

RE: FR2-LE I didn't say that the battery life was BAD just that it was bad in comparison to the 50+ hrs of the M-10. The Fostex is a great unit and prob the best sounding, cheapest "pro" level unit out there. Only drawbacks are no BWF time code and that it is physical very large.

[violinbf]

The H4 and H4n have major problems that are discussed in detail here:

Field recorder harmonics

Field recorder noise

THD figure is atrocious.

[hbphotoav]

Originally Posted by mathieujm

tutt I had 10h of continuous recording with phantom + screen light + headphone on my FR2LE with an internal 4000mah Tamiya battery.

JMM

'Bout right. I ran my R09HR test with a pair of freshly charged 1600mAh NiMH that are probably five years old. New 2500mAh batts will probably get right close. Six hours is way longer than I'll trust anything on a battery for a single take anyway...