vocal mics - to gate or not to gate

JayCrouch · 16th January 2003, 12:55 AM

when recording a gig that perhaps has alot going on, a fairly loud stage volume, and sounds bouncing all over the place - how do you handle getting vocal in the vocal mics?

I've never been a fan of gates, yet I've also never owned them or used them enough to feel that they are or are not the answer...

I've tried to lower the stands a bit and point the mics "up" a tad so that their null faces the wedge areas if possible, yet usually have to abide to the artist's comfort zone and (gulp) hope for the best...

when thinking mix ahead of time, what do you rely upon? especially when using condensor vox mics like the kms-105 or beta-87?

Steve Smith · 16th January 2003, 02:22 AM

Funny thing is, I generally only gate ( or better yet downward-expand) vocals n live stuff whan there is very litte spill, I find it keeps the ambience more constant to keep it in there.. if I do have leakage problems, I try to just edit out the bits between words in a DAW, I find it a way better option than any gate.

**Remoteness** · 16th January 2003, 05:50 AM

When it comes to remixing or mixing the tracks afterwards, I totally agree with steve. Using a DAW or riding the faders truly works best for me.

When I'm mixing live and I only got one shot, I either set the gates with a light attenuation, usually only about -6 to -10 dB of reduction. Sometimes, I make the leakage work for me and ride the vocal faders, rather then use gates. But that's just how I like to do it. There's no wrong way. One thing I never will do is gate the multitracks. Now that's a big time no no!

Steve F · 16th January 2003, 10:48 PM

This reminds me of a gig years ago whan an Australian Producer brought over "his" engineer to track a live three day event. We supplied the Remote Facility (16ft rebuild trailer) and support.
I saw the "engineer" inserting gates on the channels and pointed out to him that he probably wanted them on the returns from the multitrack. But NO - he knew what he was doing !. Well, the inevitable happened - he started complaining that the kick and snare had dissappeared - obviously OUR fault. After hitting the Bypass on the gates they were back in all their glory.
A suitably repentant guitarist (aka engineer) then asked us for any other advice to help with the recording.
They took the tapes back to Oz, don't know if anything happened with them though . . .
It certainly re-inforced the - you only got one chance - reality for us

Cheers

Beech · 17th January 2003, 04:05 PM

It always amazes me how little spill the SM58s pick up. I recorded a hard rock band at Christmas with LOUD drums and 2 guitar players and you know what, when I soloed the vocal mics(2) I could hardly hear the any drum or guitar spill. I guess spill only becomes a problem it the vocalists are very soft or stand off the mic.
Anyway, gates are indeed a no no. DAW is the place to do the cleaning up (or automated mixer of course).

DW

Steve Smith · 17th January 2003, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Remoteness
One thing I never will do is gate the multitracks. Now that's a big time no no!

wow, I hdn't even thought that that is what he may have meant.. super-duper-big-time-no-no here as well ( never bitten, but wayyyyy shy :) )

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16th January 2003, 12:55 AM	#1
JayCrouch Gear maniac Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: CT Posts: 296	vocal mics - to gate or not to gate when recording a gig that perhaps has alot going on, a fairly loud stage volume, and sounds bouncing all over the place - how do you handle getting vocal in the vocal mics? I've never been a fan of gates, yet I've also never owned them or used them enough to feel that they are or are not the answer... I've tried to lower the stands a bit and point the mics "up" a tad so that their null faces the wedge areas if possible, yet usually have to abide to the artist's comfort zone and (gulp) hope for the best... when thinking mix ahead of time, what do you rely upon? especially when using condensor vox mics like the kms-105 or beta-87? __________________ Jay Crouch Crouch@optonline.net 203-521-9520

16th January 2003, 02:22 AM	#2
Steve Smith Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 1,394	Funny thing is, I generally only gate ( or better yet downward-expand) vocals n live stuff whan there is very litte spill, I find it keeps the ambience more constant to keep it in there.. if I do have leakage problems, I try to just edit out the bits between words in a DAW, I find it a way better option than any gate. __________________ Steve Smith - Unorignal, yet commonplace.

16th January 2003, 05:50 AM	#3
Remoteness Super Moderator Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: NYC Posts: 4,880	When it comes to remixing or mixing the tracks afterwards, I totally agree with steve. Using a DAW or riding the faders truly works best for me. When I'm mixing live and I only got one shot, I either set the gates with a light attenuation, usually only about -6 to -10 dB of reduction. Sometimes, I make the leakage work for me and ride the vocal faders, rather then use gates. But that's just how I like to do it. There's no wrong way. One thing I never will do is gate the multitracks. Now that's a big time no no! __________________ Steve Remote AuraSonicLtd.com the home of ASL Mobile & Location Production Remoteness on the Linkedin Network Remoteness on Myspace

16th January 2003, 10:48 PM	#4
Steve F Gear interested Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Auckland, New Zealand Posts: 10	This reminds me of a gig years ago whan an Australian Producer brought over "his" engineer to track a live three day event. We supplied the Remote Facility (16ft rebuild trailer) and support. I saw the "engineer" inserting gates on the channels and pointed out to him that he probably wanted them on the returns from the multitrack. But NO - he knew what he was doing !. Well, the inevitable happened - he started complaining that the kick and snare had dissappeared - obviously OUR fault. After hitting the Bypass on the gates they were back in all their glory. A suitably repentant guitarist (aka engineer) then asked us for any other advice to help with the recording. They took the tapes back to Oz, don't know if anything happened with them though . . . It certainly re-inforced the - you only got one chance - reality for us Cheers __________________ Steve Finucane Chapel Studios Auckland New Zealand

17th January 2003, 04:05 PM	#5
Beech Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dublin Posts: 636	It always amazes me how little spill the SM58s pick up. I recorded a hard rock band at Christmas with LOUD drums and 2 guitar players and you know what, when I soloed the vocal mics(2) I could hardly hear the any drum or guitar spill. I guess spill only becomes a problem it the vocalists are very soft or stand off the mic. Anyway, gates are indeed a no no. DAW is the place to do the cleaning up (or automated mixer of course). DW

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