Strings...

[drundall]

So those of you who record trios and quartets, what mics do you prefer? Are Royers among your top choices?
Had good luck with Neumann tube mics but trying to keep options open.
Thanks in advance.

[Killahurts]

Earthworks, and Earthworks pre's for me.

Anything fast...

[NathanEldred]

Strings sound really lush with Royers, probably wouldn't go anywhere else with it unless the room sounded pretty bad. I'll be experimenting with Soundfield this week on Piano with Digitmus...they're supposed to be one of the ultimate in condensers for the accuracy department.

[e-cue]

Originally posted by drundall
So those of you who record trios and quartets, what mics do you prefer? Are Royers among your top choices?

Yes. Low noise... I like them with the NTI Nightpro pre or the A design's MP-2 (phase flipped) with the BACK of the mic pointed at the string instrument, which has a little more brightness. The room sound has a LOT to with my mic placement. Actually, I'm usually not so much mic'ing the instrument as much as mic'ing the sweet spot that picks up the instrument in the room.

The earthworm's mic are very nice too, but I can't comment on the mic pre's other than postive conjecture. I like the Coles ribbons for stings too, especially on the cello and bassier stuff with the Sytek pre's (stock, non modded), or the Neotek mic max.

[dave-G]

Are you talking about a pair to pick-up the whole trio/quartet? or spot mics for the individual instruments? or both?? .. There's more variables to consider in overall approach to recording string groups than just mics...

That said, I love Sennheiser MKH-80 condensers for main pair or spot duty, B&K 4003's with APE spheres as main pair, Neumann M50s (if you've got access to a pair), or Schoeps subcardioids. ... Coles 4038 mics can also make for nice spot mics, and I'd imagine the Royers would be good for that, too

What's this for? If you're tracking a string part to blend into a pop-tune, the gentle rolloff of the highs that the ribbons would provide could be really nice to help the section sit in a busy mix. If however, I were recording a string quartet for a string quartet record, I'd probably look first for a pair of condensers as a main pair.

of course, your mileage may vary.

-dave

[drundall]

Thanks everyone for your replies.

Dave-G

This is not a pop tune, just the "shtrangs".

Got Jensen/Hardy twin servo pre's and thinking of using the Royers to spot, condenser main pair. Wish I had some f@*#'in M50's.

Thanks all

[jajjguy]

As Dave-G said.... I've been miced successfully (cello) with a Coles, but it wasn't a classical session, more of a warm sound sculpturey thing. The classical sound usually wants much more high frequency detail, and not so much thickness in the lows and mids.

[NathanEldred]

IMO the Coles are a little darker than the SF series from Royer, so putting the thin ribbon Royer's on a source in that application is not as accentuated in the lower frequencies (to my ears anyway).

[jon]

For the string & orchestra sessions here, the most frequent engineer requests have been for Neumann U47/48/67/87/89 and KM84/183/184 series, Scheops CMC series, and B&K/DPA. Omnis for the room, cardiods for the spot mikes.

Royers and Coles and Earthworks are great, but are less commonly-found in studios and hire firms in this neck of the woods.

Fortunately, there are quite a few good mics out there that can get the job done.

Jon

[C.Lambrechts]

KM series neumann and CMC series schoeps (prefer those) ... for the bigger instruments ... cello / bass : U87 or C414 can be good to have

Neumann M50 for the couple yes but who has those lying around in bunches ....


B&K but have never worked with those.

[groundcontrol]

Depending on the room/section size/song-arrangement, I've had good success with:

Main pair: Brauner VM1/B&K 4011/Schoeps CMC6+MK4/M149
Outrigers (omni usually): C12/U67/B&K 4006/M149
High strings spots: Schoeps CMC6+MK4/KM84/R-121
Low strings spots: Coles 4038/fet47/U87

So much depends on the room and the section... Unfortunately those dates are few and far between these days! madd

BTW, a friend of mine really likes the Soundfield mic system for his main array. I've never have the chance to try it unfortunately.

[Roland]

The Soundfield is fair, the latest one seems to be a good deal quieter than some of the earlier ones. Not my sort of thing sound wise.

Expensive vintage Neumans work, but so do DPA's Schoeps Sennheisers. The Schoeps will give you a little more bite, but tend to be a little lacking in the bass end, they also need decent pre-amps as their current draw is significantly more than most standard mics.

Regards


Roland

[groundcontrol]

Originally posted by Roland
The Schoeps... ... they also need decent pre-amps as their current draw is significantly more than most standard mics.

Quite true!

[studjo]

For a realistic string sound I take the Sennheiser MKH 80 everytime. If it's for a pop tune - I listen what suits the track.

Jo

[NathanEldred]

Originally posted by Roland
The Soundfield is fair, Not my sort of thing sound wise.

Alphajerk, Digitmus and myself tried out the stereo Soundfield 422 this past weekend on piano and mostly drum overhead. I think everyone in the room was quite impressed, especially with the mic in stereo wide cardiod (Blumlein was good, but sub cardiod was a shocker IMO), with the stereo spread at around 3 o' clock.

[Roland]

Originally posted by NathanEldred
Alphajerk, Digitmus and myself tried out the stereo Soundfield 422 this past weekend on piano and mostly drum overhead. I think everyone in the room was quite impressed, especially with the mic in stereo wide cardiod (Blumlein was good, but sub cardiod was a shocker IMO), with the stereo spread at around 3 o' clock.

Yes it can sound quite good, but it is, for me at least, one of those mics that whenever I have tried it I could always think of a better alternative, bit "jack of all trades". The sound though fairly neutral tends to have a slightly boosted "Hi=Fi" sound to the top end and the mic is on the cool side. Personally I find classical recordings that err that way slightly uninvolving musically. I have also used the ST250, which I managed to get distortion off on a Brass session. There is a new 5.1 controller was released about I believe 18 months ago. I had a chance to try this out on a session whilst it was being reviewed by a friend of mine for Audio Media. They have included a Bass crossover, to my way of thinking this shows a complete lack of understanding of bass management in 5.1. The .1 in 5.1 is an FX channel, and as one sound expert from the film industry put it, "Is none of any music engineers business".

All the above has to be weighed up against the cost and I believe with the "5.1" controller you are approaching £5,000, ($7,500). If I desperately need one I would hire one, but then again, I can't remember being that desperate!

All the above being said in a situation with limited rigging options I would conceed that it could give you many options for post production, particularly if you record the B format.

Peace and goodwill to all!

Regards

Roland