Brahms Requiem at the Troy Savings Bank Music Hall

[joelpatterson]

Here is bass/baritone wunderkind Keith Kibler singing with the incomparable Albany Pro Musica choral ensemble in one of the finest halls in the country... the world?

Four sets of stereo mics caught the action: a set of Avant CK-1's dangling from the rafters, Oktava MK-012's in ORTF at conductor David Janower's feet, and Earthworks QTC-30's and Groove Tubes GT-55's splayed out across the footlights.

The way the lower ranges of instruments resonate in the hall is wondrous... like the finest Lexicon reverbs, I tell people!

http://www.4shared.com/file/47082806...doch_mich.html

[boojum]

I was going to whine that some guys get all the breaks. But you are there because you have earned it. I am truly envious as I know the hall by reputation. I am downloading the snip now. Cheers

[Larry Elliott]

Glorious sound Joel. And a very ‘interesting’ mic rig.

How much of the flootlight mics did you use compared to the suspended ones

Larry

[joelpatterson]

Originally Posted by Larry Elliott

How much of the footlight mics did you use compared to the suspended ones?

"Interesting" is a very generous way to put it, Larry... I've arrived at this way of doing things purely through instinct, maybe subconsciously I'm building in redundancy in case some mic contact fails? Or maybe I'm just unschooled and, well... bizzare?

Generally, you're hearing all the sets of mics more or less evenly, panned hard left/right, with perhaps the overhead Avants doing slightly more of a lion's share, and when the levels rise there are sidechain compressors that will squash the footlight sets way, way down to avoid overloading things... it just seems like the more mics you have, you are "closer" to everything, and you get more detail overall. And then, during mixdown, "deciding" how lush or clear it all is, that's very much a conscious effort to meet people's expectations. All kinds of mics gives you all kinds of leeway in that department.

[Seth]

Very nice job Joel. That hall sure is somethin' else, eh? I heard a percussionist play an Udu clay pot drum there once, and I still feel it was one of the most beautiful sounds I've ever heard live. Such a great opportunity to record there. Congrats again!

-Seth

[joelpatterson]

Seth, you are the man!

[MichaelPatrick]

Beautiful Joel. Thanks!

[tenor39]

Having heard a couple of concerts in that hall, may I opine and say I wanted more of the "hall" sound in the mix. I don't really hear the acoustic of the building except in the low end, where it adds warmth and heft. I know live concerts are always a challenge, but I think a couple of omni's flown would have gotten more of the room tone and given a bit better depth perspective. I've seen mic's flown in the hall before, but maybe they didn't allow it? As always, YMMV. The Baritone is wonderful and is captured very convincingly. An overall great sound that could use a few mic placement changes to be better, IMHO.

[David.H]

Great sound Joel I liked this sound a lot. Thanks for posting.

[Remoteness]

Joel is the man, mon!

Well done -- keep up the good work!

[hughesmr]

Lovely, lovely sound, Joel.

What were your mic heights relative to the performing forces, if I may ask? And no spots on the chorus ... but still a very natural pickup of them behind the orchestra.

You should take this approach to piano recording! (Sorry, couldn't resist!)

Great job!

[joelpatterson]

Originally Posted by hughesmr

What were your mic heights relative to the performing forces, if I may ask?

Well, the peculiar thing about it all was they'd built a vast extension to the stage, and that's where the orchestra sat, right over-top of where the first six or seven rows of seats were, with the chorus packed back onto the stage proper. The dangling overheads (Avants) were maybe fifteen feet squarely over the instrumentalists. The Oktavas and Earthworks got a bird's eye view of everyone's feet, with the GT 55's eye level with the singers-- or slightly higher than that, maybe top hat level.

The room where you set the recording gear up is right astride of first booth, which is also reserved as part of the whole deal, so once everything is rolling along swimmingly, I'll park myself there and take in the show... impossible not to think of President Lincoln at times like this!

[Omicron_9]

Joel,

Am listening to the clip now; nice work. Which caps were you utilizing on the CK-1s, and what were your pres?

Thanks for posting this; nothing like some Brahms first thing in the morning.

Kind regards,
-0.9

[joelpatterson]

Yeah, Mr. Brahms did some worthwhile stuff, that Intermezzo in A of his is pretty spooky and otherworldly...

Omni caps on the Avants, and everthing was running through my "classical" rack: Sytek pres, ACP 88 as a safety compressor. Mogami cables... (that's the secret, right there.)

[Omicron_9]

Originally Posted by joelpatterson

Yeah, Mr. Brahms did some worthwhile stuff, that Intermezzo in A of his is pretty spooky and otherworldly...

Omni caps on the Avants, and everthing was running through my "classical" rack: Sytek pres, ACP 88 as a safety compressor. Mogami cables... (that's the secret, right there.)

Thanks, Joel. +1 on the Mogami cable. I see you didn't use your CK-40 on this gig. Might as well sell it....<cough>....

Regards,
-0.9

[joelpatterson]

Originally Posted by Omicron_9

Might as well sell it....<cough>....

There's a selflessly altruistic sentiment if Ive ever seen one... wrapped in an aura of ulterior motives!

[Omicron_9]

Originally Posted by joelpatterson

There's a selflessly altruistic sentiment if Ive ever seen one... wrapped in an aura of ulterior motives!

What?! I had a cough, that's all. <avoiding eye contact>

-0.9

[Dr. Fringe]

hey, this is great. I've always wanted to do some real field recording but I'm not there yet,

if you don't mind me asking, what else did you use besides the MICs. All stellar choices I'd say but I guess there's some more cool gear at work. 0 Noise, but this is stellar and beautiful

[Corran]

Oops I seem to have missed this thread while out of town on Saturday.

Will check this out tomorrow mornin'!

[John Hedger]

Sounds wonderful!

[joelpatterson]

Originally Posted by Dr. Fringe

... there's some more cool gear at work.....

Well, once it's safely captured on the Alesis HD-24 (it still makes me terrifically nervous that it doesn't 'remember' anything until you hit STOP-- if you lose power while you're still in RECORD, oops, sorry, all gone, no refunds!) I'll put it all in Digital Performer. A multi-band compressor on the master channel, there's the secet weapon: I always end up clamping down on the top end, and then boosting that clamped-down-ness way up. Somehow... it really really heightens the clarity without a whiff of harshness.

Great crew at the Hall... really a joy to do work there!

[Corran]

Yeah, wow man, really sounds "lush". Compared to the orchestra, the baritone seems a little reverberant. I don't know if that's due to your mic positions or what. That's my only "criticism" but I definitely like the recording! Thanks for posting.

[Dr. Fringe]

Originally Posted by joelpatterson

if you lose power while you're still in RECORD, oops, sorry, all gone, no refunds!) I'll put it all in Digital Performer. A multi-band compressor on the master channel, there's the secet weapon: I always end up clamping down on the top end, and then boosting that clamped-down-ness way up.

Thanks Joel, I appreciate the response and the cool knowledge. I have a similar setup, but the Mics aren't quite as nice, but I think it says it all when you can get a much better sound through your rig. Amazing, really I'll have to hear some more stuff that you've done but I appreciate everything.

[hanuman]

Joel, electrifying, Brahm Requiem is something, I don't play it anymore but after the first time I kept playing it for weeks.

[tarabok]

that sounds great! let me know when you get the 3rd symphony!

[Dr. Fringe]

I should mention that I know all too well about loosing data. Save and save often if not neurotically! Not too practical during a concert I guess but I can't emphasize that enough. I guess if it's a recording like this a UPS backup could help but I've never had a scenario that was crucial.

Cheers.

[jabney]

Originally Posted by joelpatterson

Well, once it's safely captured on the Alesis HD-24 (it still makes me terrifically nervous that it doesn't 'remember' anything until you hit STOP-- if you lose power while you're still in RECORD, oops, sorry, all gone, no refunds!)

If you pre-record even a track or two of your 8, 16, or 24 track song, (with silence - or better yet, some LPs :-), then losing power on the HD24 is not so bad. You'll have all your song up to the point where you lost power (or where your pre-recorded track runs out).

Also, hitting stop and then re-starting during applause can be extremely quick and often impossible to detect.

best,

john

[joelpatterson]

That is a brilliant idea... and plus, you would have something to listen to during the concert!