MKH60 sound - opinions please

[Andrew Mottl]

Hello everybody,

I was surprised after working on a film where the production sound was recorded with the Sennheiser MKHX0 series, mainly an MKH60. What bugged me was the fact that I felt like I really wanted to take out a lot in the 1-2k area, as it seemed to be quite sharp sound-wise.

What's your experience? I was surprised as I cannot remember doing that so heavily in the past - and it was the second time with the 60. Then again, it might be our mic here at uni, and it may need serviced...
I love the mic, and it's not as heavy as a 416 :-) Good for booming!

Would love to hear your opinions!

Andrew

[RoundBadge]

Never had a problem with the 60.i use em pretty much everyday
What kind of mixer/recorder was used?


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[Andrew Mottl]

Hey there,

yes, I was surprised myself. I remember it being a Fostex DAT from a Wendt Mixer on one production, and straight into a Deva on another.

I never felt it sounded weird while shooting, though that might have been the HD25 I was using (as they sound quite low and high end strong anyway, maybe softening the mids more)...

Then again, the aesthetics of dialog sound over here in Germany are quite different from the US. Mainly due to our "over clean" German dubs, and the similar crisp sound of our TV films and shows. But still, I was surprised by the 60 (or then again maybe just "OUR" 60)...

[Geert van den Berg]

Originally Posted by Andrew Mottl

I was surprised after working on a film where the production sound was recorded with the Sennheiser MKHX0 series, mainly an MKH60. What bugged me was the fact that I felt like I really wanted to take out a lot in the 1-2k area, as it seemed to be quite sharp sound-wise.

Don't have experience with the MKH60, but the 40, that I've used seemed quite balanced, but that isn't a shotgun but a cardiod.

You can offcourse EQ the sharp region out a bit or if it is only sharp on louder scenes use a compressor with sidechain (or multiband compressor) focussed on the sharp frequencies, so it only compresses when it has to.

[danijel]

andrew,
in december i was in the field for about a month. i was working for a new production, so all their equipment was brand new - including 2x mkh416 & 2x mkh60.
as mkh60 was new to me, i did a half-hour test (comparing it to 416), and as they all sounded great, i started working with mkh60's because i wanted to gain some experience with them. after a month, i left the field to continue with the post production of this same material.
my impression is quite opposite to yours. mkh60 sounds too neutral to me, and i often find myself adding some presence to get the '416 sound'.
go figure!

[RoundBadge]

Originally Posted by danijel

andrew,
in december i was in the field for about a month. i was working for a new production, so all their equipment was brand new - including 2x mkh416 & 2x mkh60.
as mkh60 was new to me, i did a half-hour test (comparing it to 416), and as they all sounded great, i started working with mkh60's because i wanted to gain some experience with them. after a month, i left the field to continue with the post production of this same material.
my impression is quite opposite to yours. mkh60 sounds too neutral to me, and i often find myself adding some presence to get the '416 sound'.
go figure!

Yeah I find the 416's[i own 2 as well as many Schoeps,Sanken and Neumann shotguns] hi's to be a tad sweeter but overall the 60 is a great workhorse and always seem to blend with the radio COS 11's,etc really well.


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[RoundBadge]

Originally Posted by Andrew Mottl

I never felt it sounded weird while shooting, though that might have been the HD25 I was using (as they sound quite low and high end strong anyway, maybe softening the mids more)...

Then again, the aesthetics of dialog sound over here in Germany are quite different from the US. Mainly due to our "over clean" German dubs, and the similar crisp sound of our TV films and shows. But still, I was surprised by the 60 (or then again maybe just "OUR" 60)...

Interesting to hear about the dubs thing..yeah I'd get the mic checked for sure..
I did a show for ARD 1 years ago and got some award[according to the shows producers..is there a German equivalent to the Emmy?]for best sound..never physically received anything but is was still kinda cool to hear about it.

[Andrew Mottl]

Thanks folks, I really think it must be our mic then... or my booming :-)

What was the ARD show you did, RoundBage? Congrats on that!

Maybe I'm wrong with all this, but if you take anything on TV, from Friends to Lost to Simpsons, the US production sound (or kinda-adr-ed in Simpsons) is softer and "muffled" in comparison to our in-your-face dubbed stuff.

Oh well. I ended up mixing a US dub of a German student film a little more mellow :-) Didn't notice, until I compared, and it seemed ok to me.

[RoundBadge]

Originally Posted by Andrew Mottl

What was the ARD show you did, RoundBage? Congrats on that!

Maybe I'm wrong with all this, but if you take anything on TV, from Friends to Lost to Simpsons, the US production sound (or kinda-adr-ed in Simpsons) is softer and "muffled" in comparison to our in-your-face dubbed stuff.

Oh well. I ended up mixing a US dub of a German student film a little more mellow :-) Didn't notice, until I compared, and it seemed ok to me.

Thanks man..it was a while ago..it was a news show very much like 60 minutes..can't remember the exact name though.
I'd be curious to hear a comparison btw some of the US stuff compared to the German stuff.could be enlightening
cheers


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[jacobfarron]

I haven't had that issue. I love our 60's.

[philper]

Never a fave of mine, but certainly very practical: more moisture and cel phone resistant than mics I like the sound of better.

Philip Perkins

[santacore]

I haven't noticed a bump in that region, like the 416 has. I've been using the MKH60 lately for Foley recording and overall it sound pretty natural. In my opinion it's smoother then the 416. The only thing that bothers me is I feel it might be a little light in the bass. Has anyone else noticed this?

[cl516]

i'm interested in picking up one of these mics, either the 60 or 416.
nice to read about these. i don't mean to hijack but do you guys use these for music in the studio?

[RoundBadge]

Originally Posted by cl516

nice to read about these. i don't mean to hijack but do you guys use these for music in the studio?

Yeah i use em all the time as distant mics[strings,horns,etc]
also really cool for direct over a snare about 5-6 feet[sometimes destroyed with distrortion/compression] or kick front [at a distance]or just a general room mic for heavy processing later.



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[Matti]

For audience in live situations

Matti

[RoundBadge]

Originally Posted by MATTI

For audience in live situations

Matti

Yup.


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[danijel]

Originally Posted by cl516

i'm interested in picking up one of these mics, either the 60 or 416.
nice to read about these. i don't mean to hijack but do you guys use these for music in the studio?

416 (and probably 60) is not very good for recording dialogue in small rooms with lots of ER. the holes on the sides (which give it its directionality), pick up the ERs and make an ugly-nasty comb filter. i did A/Bs many years ago, and since then, i always use ordinary cardioid microphones in such situations. that's why i never even considered it for recording music in a small room, but, obviously, there are no rules, so i'll be happy to try it in the studio next time i get to record something.
they're both 'studio quality' mics for sure

[Matti]

Yes, hence Schoeps mk 41 is so used for interiors

Matti

[cl516]

thanks danijel

[danijel]

Originally Posted by cl516

thanks danijel

you're welcome!

matti mentioned schoeps mk 41, so i looked it up, and found this explanation of shotgun microphones shortcomings on the schoeps website:
SCHOEPS mics-gen-characs

sort of what i tried to explain above, but better