recording folk trio

[miqer]

I had a session today with a folk trio.

All three where singing, all three playing an instrument. 2 Guitars, mandoline, flute. Sometimes accordion (loud) and violin (soft). They wanted to sit near to each other for that special magic. Quite close. Mhhhh.

In my experience small or large condensers grab the strumming guitars best. Also the mandoline. Now the voices came in loud into the condensers I used. So I ended up using only them to record both voice and instrument. 2 dynamic mic's on the acordion and one on the flute.

I also added a dynamic with the singer that sang the most.

Still in the end with loud voices there is spill everywhere, and it sounds quite good, but I have some lots of phase problems. I don't mind that with folk stuff. Makes it sound old. Weird stereo image.

How would you mic this? Dynamics only will not sound as good in my experience... ?!

They are coming back Friday, so I can have another shot for the next 6 songs.

I have had no problems with big funk bands. This is more subtle... mhhh.

thanks,

M.

[zemlin]

If they balance themselves well, might try a stereo pair and leave it at that - MS perhaps. Maybe a spot mic or two for balance.

[RCM - Ronan]

This is a really tough one. One of the hardest things to record well. Two bits of advice:

1) go ahead and try some of your dynamics. Sometimes an SM57 can sound great on a guitar or mandolin (even fiddle some times)

2) Try to set up a stereo pair of condensers that will give you a good stereo image of the whole group and bring in the close mics for extra presence. If the group plays well together you might be amazed how good just the stereo pair can sound.

[NathanEldred]

Dylan recorded with 2 or sometimes 3 mics. One for voice, and sometimes one for his acoustic or two for the acoustic. If you want it to sound modern (like post 1960), stick with the close micing of the instruments with a seperate mic on the voice. Even though he was a solo act those recordings on the first few albums sound as good or better than anything today and I think that applies to any music in this genre. I'd personally make my first reach for when recording the voices with large diaphragm condensers and small diaphragms on the instruments. The mics, in my experience, will pick up 100% of the voice and 50% of the instrument, so the close small diaphragms are really there just for tonal enhancement or for extra dynamic control of the instruments. Generally I find that the large diaphragm (on the people with voice and instrument) at any given time will be 70-100% of the signal. You can get away with dynamics on certain acoustic instruments and even some voices, but the preamp has to be really good - quiet and articulate IMO.

[china jam]

Yes, dynamics could help you out here.

[vernier]

Peter Paul & Mary perfected folk trio recording in '62, and theres a pic somewhere on the net of them in the studio. I'd look for it.

[miqer]

Thanks so much for the quick answers!

This helps. Even reading rcm say it's a tough one helps.

[waxx]

i did rather a lot of folk recordings lately, and the best way to take a group like this is tread it like a classical recording. A good stereo or ORTF setup (I used an stereo AKG C426 stereo or an Aevox Classic M Stereo sdc (wich is very cheap btw for the quality it brings - a sleeper in my opinion), maybe with some extra dynamic close mic'in for some minimal adjustment in the mix. (an beta57 can sound good on violin btw). Placing the players in the space is the key to a good recording then.

let them also do the instruments seperate from singing. You can't get singing right with a stereo ldc setup, you need to close mic them, preferable with an good LDC (except when it's a choir singing)

[David Spearritt]

Amazon.com: 40 Days: The Wailin' Jennys: Music
This must be one of the recordings you will aspire to, its stunning quality. Doesn't sound like an ORTF pair to me.

[Chunky But Funky]

How about LDC's or ribbons in figure 8? Instrument mics pointed downward 45 deg. with the "null" at the voices, and Voice mics pointed upward 45 deg. with the "null" at the instruments positioned about chest high. I don't know If your mic locker covers that scenario or not. It's worth a try! (Overdub the accordion if possible)

Doug

[miqer]

I did use a r84 for them to sing in from 2 sides, canceling out a strumming guitar. I only have one figure of 8. Need at least one more.

For other songs, most of them, I ended up using 2 ldc's the main voices, this does work out better than dynamics on these type of folky voices. It's all about the voices, so.


m.