25th February 2008
|
#1 | | Gear addict
Joined: Jul 2005 Location: miami, fl
Posts: 398
Thread Starter  |  more power questions for remote rig
hi. i'm doing mostly remote classical concert recordings and have been (slowly) putting together my rig. for power, i've been borrowing a friend's APC Line-R 1200 and it seems pretty stable. however, it offers nothing in the way of backup power and it makes distinctive clicks when it's regulating power. both of these are to be expected, i suppose, but i wondered if there was something else that regulates well without relays clicking so audibly? anything in that same price range (~$50) or near??
my big question is how do i calculate the apparent power (in VA) for my gear?  i've read loads of power conditioning / regulating / ups threads here and some Wiki pages relating to power but i cannot seem to find a straightforward answer. i've read the manuals only to find the power consumption or max power consumption specs (in Watts). even a ballpark figure would be helpful, as then i can research ups options that are within my budget.
if it helps, i'm currently (no pun intended  ) running a Benchmark 4ch. mic pre, Tascam DV-RA1000 recorder and Sony PCM-R300 DAT for backups. these all spec out at around 35W each. actually the Tascam does spec "max inrush current" as 7.5A. for the sake of future-proofing, i will eventually upgrade my recorder(s) and hope to integrate in a high end A/D. i also occasionally bring a laptop and external HD to get data straight into the computer after the concerts and i may record straight in utilizing a firewire interface (hey Prism, want to donate an Orpheus?  ).
cheers,
-c
__________________
charlie post | PostProductions Audio | remote recording and live sound reinforcement | specializing in acoustic music
[COLOR="Purple"]selling: DSub cables, Word Clock
likes: quiet, great sounding spaces, good instruments and talent; gear and lots of it!
Last edited by charlienyc; 25th February 2008 at 09:17 PM..
Reason: tiny spelling error. i'm OCD like that.
| 
|  | |
27th February 2008
|
#2 | | Gear addict
Joined: Jul 2005 Location: miami, fl
Posts: 398
Thread Starter | VA vs W power
guess no one has found this interesting enough to reply to yet... nonetheless i found at least one answer. here's a pop-up from APC's site:
VA (Volt-Amp) ratings are also a common method for measuring power but provide less accurate results. On APC.COM, VA values are often shown for convienience and may be entered as input data. However, VA values are always translated into Watts. This translation is done using an approximation formula which assumes that low VA loads have a power factor of around 0.6 and high power loads have a power factor of nearly 1.0, which is representative of typical, (but not all) computing equipment. For highest precision, use Watt values where available.
i guess determining the VA ratings is not beneficial, even though some other power accessory manufacturers base their models on this number.
still recommendations on quiet power regulation and UPS units is welcomed, if anyone is reading... 
Last edited by charlienyc; 27th February 2008 at 04:36 PM..
Reason: grammar
| |
| | |
27th February 2008
|
#3 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Apr 2005 Location: New York Friggin' City
Posts: 2,571
|
Hey Charlie-
I have rarely found useful information from a manufacturer about actual amperage draw. I tend to load things up and measure it. It surely helped when I was using my own remote truck every day, as I measured & then knew what inrush voltage each piece of gear needed, and what thair average amperage draw was, and could scale back to the critical gear when something went awry.
I used a specialized transformer that allowed me to dial back the voltage to test what gear would work at less than 120V AC, which was very useful for the times I worked the truck off solar panels or D/C battery power converted to A/C.
| |
| | |
27th February 2008
|
#4 | | Gear Head
Joined: Oct 2006 Location: Franklin, Tn.
Posts: 73
|
I use a Tripplite Pro Rack Mount UPS and a Furman for my power distribution....Works great, low noise.....Something like 5 to 7 mins of back-up power if there is an outage.....enough time to boot down most devices....I found mine for around $100...
Cheers!
| |
| | |
27th February 2008
|
#5 | | Gear Head
Joined: Nov 2007 Location: CT, USA
Posts: 69
|
I don't know about some of the other brands, but some of the APC UPSes I've looked at have a non-disableable VERY LOUD alarm in them that beeps if it detects any glitches, and then if it's operating off of batteries beeps every 60 seconds. Have to get the wire cutters out and get rid of that problem I guess...
| |
| | |
27th February 2008
|
#6 | | Super Moderator
Joined: Aug 2002 Location: NYC  |
Why not install an on/off switch instead of completely removing the piezo tweeter?
You may need that alarm when you're away from your rig.
Furthermore, you could consider installing an LED or lamp in addition to or replace the transducer completely. If you go with the add on light you could install a on/off switch for quiet operation during the recording session. Quote:
Originally Posted by Testing123  I don't know about some of the other brands, but some of the APC UPSes I've looked at have a non-disableable VERY LOUD alarm in them that beeps if it detects any glitches, and then if it's operating off of batteries beeps every 60 seconds. Have to get the wire cutters out and get rid of that problem I guess... | | |
| | |
27th February 2008
|
#7 | | Gear Head
Joined: Nov 2007 Location: CT, USA
Posts: 69
|
Great ideas, Steve. It wouldn't be that hard to install a switch and or LED. I suppose the target market for companies like APC isn't the recording industry, so they don't see the need to do that in the design.
Maybe some of the higher end units can disable the alarm, I don't know. The switch might even be better though, since you can look at a glance and see what state it's in. Quote:
Originally Posted by Remoteness Why not install an on/off switch instead of completely removing the piezo tweeter?
You may need that alarm when you're away from your rig.
Furthermore, you could consider installing an LED or lamp in addition to or replace the transducer completely. If you go with the add on light you could install a on/off switch for quiet operation during the recording session. | | |
| | |
27th February 2008
|
#8 | | Gear addict
Joined: Jul 2005 Location: miami, fl
Posts: 398
Thread Starter |
these mods sound like a good idea. yet what do they do to the warranty? 
anyone noticed how poor TrippLite's website is? 
thanks for your input Jim, but i'm in the land of small potatoes. adding everything up with generous considerations for upgrades leaves me below 250W. any rack mounted *quiet* online UPS suggestions?
| |
| | |
27th February 2008
|
#9 | | Gear Head
Joined: Nov 2007 Location: CT, USA
Posts: 69
| Quote:
Originally Posted by charlienyc these mods sound like a good idea. yet what do they do to the warranty? | <=== Yep, probably that.
| |
| | |
27th February 2008
|
#10 | | Super Moderator
Joined: Aug 2002 Location: NYC | Quote:
Originally Posted by charlienyc these mods sound like a good idea. yet what do they do to the warranty? ... | Nine out of 10 times doing that sort of thing will blow your warranty to pieces, but that never stopped us from modifying our equipment.
I'd rather have the gear working the way we want it to than worry about warranty issues. YMMV
| |
| | |
27th February 2008
|
#11 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Oct 2005 Location: Pennsyltucky
Posts: 2,690
|
The bottom-end TrippLite (the SMART500RT1U), doesn't provide a pure sine wave when in battery mode. These modified sine waves aren't supposed to be used with sensitive equipment.
Has anyone had a bad experience (distortion, etc) using one of these when the battery kicked in?
__________________
| 
| | |
28th February 2008
|
#12 | | Gear addict
Joined: Jul 2005 Location: miami, fl
Posts: 398
Thread Starter | Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimbo The bottom-end TrippLite (the SMART500RT1U), doesn't provide a pure sine wave when in battery mode. These modified sine waves aren't supposed to be used with sensitive equipment. | Jim, you're a mindreader! i brought up the EXACT same point to a colleague/friend this evening. only i might have it backwards. i thought the more expensive ones purposefully routed all power through the battery to maintain the correct voltage output. while the dfegad cheap ones run off-line, bypassing the battery until it's needed. can someone please clarify?
either way, i think others share the perspective that if you're going to invest in a UPS it had better be a good one!
| |
| | |
28th February 2008
|
#13 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Oct 2006 Location: Rome, Italy
Posts: 829
| Quote: |
i thought the more expensive ones purposefully routed all power through the battery to maintain the correct voltage output. while the cheap ones run off-line, bypassing the battery until it's needed. can someone please clarify?
| I also thought it worked like this. If I remember well (difficult!) they are called online (when they make the sinusoid) and offline (when they work just when the mains power fail).
Last edited by videoteque; 28th February 2008 at 07:46 AM..
Reason: technical add-ons
| |
| | |
28th February 2008
|
#14 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Oct 2005 Location: Pennsyltucky
Posts: 2,690
| Quote:
Originally Posted by charlienyc only i might have it backwards. i thought the more expensive ones purposefully routed all power through the battery to maintain the correct voltage output. | You don't have it backwards, and we're on the same page  : With the SMART500 it's a regular sine wave until the battery kicks in (due to loss of main power). Then it becomes a modified sine wave.
Yes, the more expensive units run all power through the battery to condition the signal, BUT the output on these pricier, and significantly heavier, units is a pure sine wave.
| |
| | |
28th February 2008
|
#15 | | Gear addict
Joined: Jul 2005 Location: miami, fl
Posts: 398
Thread Starter | Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimbo Yes, the more expensive units run all power through the battery to condition the signal, BUT the output on these pricier, and significantly heavier, units is a pure sine wave. | ok good, making progress here in my mind - thanks!
now... how high does one have to go to get to happy power and pure sine wave love? | |
| | |
29th February 2008
|
#16 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Oct 2005 Location: Pennsyltucky
Posts: 2,690
|
The next model up in the Tripp Lite SMART series is the 750. I don't know if all power runs through the battery or not, but the output of the battery is a pure sine wave.
| |
| | | |
New Reply 
Facebook
Twitter
LinkedIn
