Korg MR-1000 results

[RickZ]

I've completed a couple of pipe organ concert recordings using my newly acquired MR-1000, and am very happy with the results. I used the default recording option, DSD 5.6, the highest resolution available. Mics were a TLM103 pair. I've attached a photo of the church with mics.

Upon arriving home, I connect the USB cable with computer already running, and AC adapter, then power up the unit. It goes right to USB remote mode, and it's disk shows on my computer. A simple copy brings the DSD files over, an hour's concert in about 6 minutes. After copy completes, use XP's Safely Remove Hardware button to disconnect, and
push the select button on Korg, it also disconnects. Power down, and that's it for the copy.

The AudioGate software is used to add the files to a song list, then hit export button, specify 96KHz/32BitIEEEFloat for output files. This process is pretty lengthy. When done, edit as any other PCM file. In my case I use Sound Forge to trim ends, use Voxengo Elephant to adjust volume, and r8brainPro to SRC to 44.1/16.

The resulting CD-R's sound very nice to my ears.

As has been discussed elsewhere, .mp3 encoding does bad things to ambience, so saving to .mp3 might not give a good example, but I set to highest VBR on the attached sample clip.

Thanks to our friend Plush for steadfastly recommending the MR-1000 !

FWIW,
Rick Z

[videoteque]

Sounds great, the church is vey nice!!!

[hughesmr]

Have used the Korg for many concert recordings now myself, and yes, the unit is great ... 5.6 DSD imparts a most clean "analog" type sound. Just got back from recording a 3-day piano festival in Tennessee and the Korg worked like a charm! Highly recommended.

[Gaston69]

Will listen later, I am at work now.

Due to the postive feedback I also ordered yesterday a MR-1000, look forward to hit the road )

Gaston

[videoteque]

Let's team up and do "multi-track" recordings!!!

[Legacy]

Originally Posted by videoteque

Let's team up and do "multi-track" recordings!!!

I'm waiting (as patiently as I can) to see if Korg or another manufacturer will come out with a multitrack DSD location recorder (even 8 tracks would be a great start). (I don't want to mention the company that already did this as that's a quagmire that has already been explored). It would have to be a hard disc recorder like the Korg as I suspect optical media can't deliver the data throughput.

The DAW-based options are pricey (I'm a Pyramix user - the DSD options have become much cheaper as of V6...saving my pennies).

So if its $1200. for a stereo MR-1000, how about an 8-track version for $4500? Would this be appealing to anyone but me? Personally I don't need the on-board preamps but would love to see digital IO on a MT machine.

-Silas

[bluegrasser]

Anyone run though analog out of the Korg to analog processing and record the final mix on a WAV or CD recorder?

[videoteque]

how about an 8-track version for $4500?

Come on, if we are dreaming, let's make it an 8-track version for 2500$!!!

If it costs more than 3K$ people here will start to say it do sound good. And we don't want that!!!

[ghellquist]

Yep, the MR1000 is an impressive unit at a decent price point. I recently did run a head on comparison between the MR1000 and a Sound Devices 722. First test was with external preamp, Dav Bg2. Pair of MKH20 microphones split before the preamp (two channels to each box). Second test was with the built-in pres. Same pair split again. Symphony orchestra playing, different venues though, part of of a four city concert tour.

On location the I used Sennheiser HD280 for monitoring (64 Ohm version). There was a marked difference in sound -- the headphone amp in the MR1000 sounds much better than the 722. I would like to be able to do a proper test, but my impression is that there is a bit of "smiley" curve and perhaps even a bit of compression going on in the headphone amp of the Mr1000. I was not totally confident with that, because if my hunch is right, I might take decisions on a better than real monitoring. This is all non-verified though.

Once at home I converted the 5.6Ghz to 96kHz/24 bit and compared the two recordings head on after carefully balancing volume settings. The result was confusing at first. With external preamp I had absolutely no difference. With internal preamps I had a very small difference, but could not really say which was better. I might add that monitoring was through Benchmark DAC1 and Sennheiser 650 as well as ATC monitors.

My conclusion is that I could live with the MR1000. I still preferr the 722 as it is a bit more robust in construction, metal vs plastic. It also allows MS decoding for monitoring while still recording the MS, the MR1000 does not directly support MS decoding. There are various extra options on the 722 which I seldom use, but that are nice when needed. The difference in sound between DSD and PCM might be there, but once I move into real-world usage, making CD-s and so on, it simply is not there anymore in my workflow.

Gunnar

[videoteque]

Of course the Sound Devices is much better built, it also cost much more.

I mean if you are using it everyday, I would buy Sound Devices, if you use it once or twice a week, a Korg seems to be able to last long...

[Mats H]

Originally Posted by ghellquist

Yep, the MR1000 is an impressive unit at a decent price point. I recently did run a head on comparison between the MR1000 and a Sound Devices 722. First test was with external preamp, Dav Bg2. Pair of MKH20 microphones split before the preamp (two channels to each box). Second test was with the built-in pres. Same pair split again. Symphony orchestra playing, different venues though, part of of a four city concert tour.

On location the I used Sennheiser HD280 for monitoring (64 Ohm version). There was a marked difference in sound -- the headphone amp in the MR1000 sounds much better than the 722. I would like to be able to do a proper test, but my impression is that there is a bit of "smiley" curve and perhaps even a bit of compression going on in the headphone amp of the Mr1000. I was not totally confident with that, because if my hunch is right, I might take decisions on a better than real monitoring. This is all non-verified though.

Once at home I converted the 5.6Ghz to 96kHz/24 bit and compared the two recordings head on after carefully balancing volume settings. The result was confusing at first. With external preamp I had absolutely no difference. With internal preamps I had a very small difference, but could not really say which was better. I might add that monitoring was through Benchmark DAC1 and Sennheiser 650 as well as ATC monitors.

My conclusion is that I could live with the MR1000. I still preferr the 722 as it is a bit more robust in construction, metal vs plastic. It also allows MS decoding for monitoring while still recording the MS, the MR1000 does not directly support MS decoding. There are various extra options on the 722 which I seldom use, but that are nice when needed. The difference in sound between DSD and PCM might be there, but once I move into real-world usage, making CD-s and so on, it simply is not there anymore in my workflow.

Gunnar

I agree on most things here. I took the same test and must confess to not hearing any difference between the files after using the DC cut function and downsampling the DSD file to 96 KHz with Audiogate.

After measuring (Remember I used the DC cut option in Audiogate), the frequency response of the MR-1000 file dropped from below 8 Hz to around -20 dB at 0 Hz and around 0,2 dB at the top end. Otherwise the frequency responses were identical. Though I listen through less impressive equipment (Fireface 800 - > Yamaha NS-1000M or Grado SR-125) I heard no difference between the units.

When using the units' own preamps I heard maybe a hair more dynamic response from the MR-1000s preamps. I couldn't tell which one was the best though.

All levels were matched to 0,05 dB.

The Sound Devices is clearly a more pro oriented unit with far more functionality. Linked gain, very flexible monitoring, M/S decoding, channel selection, the choice of separate mono files instead of stereo files, separate line out on mini XLR and mini TRS are just the tip of the iceberg. It's the choice for film/tv/production work. However, for straight music recording, the MR-1000 is very competent sound wise. At 5.6 MHz it sounds fabulous.

I disagree about the headphone amp, it reveals details deeeeep into the recordings very clearly and smoothly, though I do feel it might be a bit on the warm side in the lower mid range. Or it's just that the converters are better than the Fireface I'm used to.


Mats Helgesson
LIVING SOUND

[Factory101]

Any thoughts on the Korg preamps? I find the SD702 has excellent preamps...very clear/uncoloured/low noise.

[RickZ]

I used the Korg preamps in lo-gain setting with TLM103 pair, sounded very true to my ears. The sound clip in my thread starter was done that way.
Rgds,
Rick Z

[knightrupert]

How does the Korg compare with the SD units when played back at 5.6mhz thru the line out?

[mr.gefell]

Originally Posted by videoteque

Of course the Sound Devices is much better built, it also cost much more.

I mean if you are using it everyday, I would buy Sound Devices, if you use it once or twice a week, a Korg seems to be able to last long...

thumbsup

[ISedlacek]

Can you please give me some short basics of this device ?

So far I understand that it is a stereo DSD recorder with its own preamps and convertors ? Is it also possible to use an external preamp with it ? Speaking of external convertors probably does not make sense, since the technology is different ? But how would it compare when for example recording the same thing with Lavry convertors ? Only two channels seem to be a serious limitation for mobile recordings ... (?)

Sorry for my basic question, but I still have not much idea about this unit ...

[Recording David]

Originally Posted by ISedlacek

Can you please give me some short basics of this device ?

So far I understand that it is a stereo DSD recorder with its own preamps and convertors ? Is it also possible to use an external preamp with it ? Speaking of external convertors probably does not make sense, since the technology is different ? But how would it compare when for example recording the same thing with Lavry convertors ? Only two channels seem to be a serious limitation for mobile recordings ... (?)

Sorry for my basic question, but I still have not much idea about this unit ...

OK, I haven't used this unit yet but I have done a lot of research. From what other users are saying the preamps and PCM convertors are nowhere near as good as outboard units.

However, they also say that when recorded at the highest resolution DSD (using outboard preamps and the Korg's DSD convertors), then converted to PCM using the Korg software, the results are better than the very best PCM converters.

If I remember correctly I think it was Plush who found this.

On the down side people also say the build quality, while OK, is not massively robust.

[ISedlacek]

Originally Posted by Recording David

However, they also say that when recorded at the highest resolution DSD (using outboard preamps and the Korg's DSD convertors), then converted to PCM using the Korg software, the results are better than the very best PCM converters.

Hmm, this sounds quite interesting. Could someone confirm and elaborate this point ?

[videoteque]

Ivo, the people who can afford the better PCM converters is difficult they are interested in anything with "Korg" written outside.

I think the preamps are good as long as you use them with condensers (gain has two settings, LOW and HI, if you keep LOW they are pretty good).

The build quality is not for a 24 hours, 7 days a week use. But it's not plastic, it's mostly metal and the buttons are on the soft side, but not a toy.

Sorry, my english doesn't go further!!!

[ghellquist]

Originally Posted by ISedlacek

Hmm, this sounds quite interesting. Could someone confirm and elaborate this point ?

In my test the sound is exactly the same as the 722 converters running at 96/24 - not better, not worse. Those are not the worlds best, but quite useable. See my previous post.

Gunnar

[bcgood]

Originally Posted by RickZ

I've completed a couple of pipe organ concert recordings using my newly acquired MR-1000, and am very happy with the results. I used the default recording option, DSD 5.6, the highest resolution available. Mics were a TLM103 pair. I've attached a photo of the church with mics.

Upon arriving home, I connect the USB cable with computer already running, and AC adapter, then power up the unit. It goes right to USB remote mode, and it's disk shows on my computer. A simple copy brings the DSD files over, an hour's concert in about 6 minutes. After copy completes, use XP's Safely Remove Hardware button to disconnect, and
push the select button on Korg, it also disconnects. Power down, and that's it for the copy.

The AudioGate software is used to add the files to a song list, then hit export button, specify 96KHz/32BitIEEEFloat for output files. This process is pretty lengthy. When done, edit as any other PCM file. In my case I use Sound Forge to trim ends, use Voxengo Elephant to adjust volume, and r8brainPro to SRC to 44.1/16.

The resulting CD-R's sound very nice to my ears.

As has been discussed elsewhere, .mp3 encoding does bad things to ambience, so saving to .mp3 might not give a good example, but I set to highest VBR on the attached sample clip.

Thanks to our friend Plush for steadfastly recommending the MR-1000 !

FWIW,
Rick Z

Thanks for the post but why not post an mp3 at 320 kbps or provide a link to a wave file on a site that will host it for free such as this site:

Free File Hosting Made Simple - MediaFire

When talking about the subtleties that most of us are interested in mp3's really don't cut it to be honest.

[Mats H]

Originally Posted by bcgood

Thanks for the post but why not post an mp3 at 320 kbps or provide a link to a wave file on a site that will host it for free such as this site:

Free File Hosting Made Simple - MediaFire

When talking about the subtleties that most of us are interested in mp3's really don't cut it to be honest.

EDIT: Answered to the wrong post.


Mats Helgesson
LIVING SOUND