Recording classical cello...

[Mr. Liszt]

I am going to do a session for a 4 minute contemporary classical piece for solo cello. The location is in a state of the art concert hall designed for classical and jazz performance. The acoustics are supposed to be pretty excellent. It is not going to be a live performance. I have 2 hours to set up and do the takes.

I need some advice as to how to go about doing this.

Those of you who have already read my other posts in here know I have shit gear and here is what I have to work with:

Apple notebook.
Garageband software or I might have Logic studio 8 by the time I do this in a few weeks.
Tascam us122 interface or Firepod interface.
Two Samson c02 condensers
One SE electonics condenser, 2200a I think.
Shure sm58
Shure beta 57a
Some audio technica dynamic mic.

The co2's seem like the only mics close to being appropriate.

I was thinking of using the co2s as a stereo pair elevated at about 2 meters and in about the third or fourth row in the seats. I also thought of close micing the cello at a few feet away as well but would that casue some kind of phase issues with the pair?

Any advice would be appreciated?

[Recording David]

I would just use 2 mics for this job. If the Samson mics are the only ones you can use, then they are the most appropriate ones from your list. Are you bound to use these or is there a chance you could rent a pair of something else for the day? The reason I ask is that they are cardioid and won't be able to reproduce the great acoustic of the location as well as omnis. If you can stretch to renting for the day I would go for a pair of DPA omnis (like the 4006) or a pair of Schoeps MK2.

However, if you're sticking with the Samsons, here's what I'd do:

Get the mics on the stage - 2 or 3 rows back is too far. I would use an ORTF array. Start with the mics about 2m back and 2m high from the cello, pointing down onto the instrument. This is just a starting point - fine tune the placement until you get the best sound you can.

Close miking the cello is not to be recommended - you will get nasty, scratchy close-up bow noise.

Also, as a practical measure, ask the cellist to keep relatively still (i.e. not sway the cello about too much). With a solo instrument recording like this there is a danger the imaging might be uneven if the player 'gets into it' too much.

[Mr. Liszt]

Thanks for the info David!

If I can't find a placee that rents high end mics like the ones you mentioned would any other omni directional mic be better at least than the Samsons?

Also, I forgot to ask this. I guess I'll be doning my monitoring with my headphones. Is there anything I should watch out for? I have little monitors but that kind of seems inappropriate and I do not want to distract the player if at all possible.

And, when I am recording pop music I am usually trying to get my loudest signals in the red like everyone suggests. For something liek this What should I be looking for meterwise? The piece is extremely dynamic, PPPPP to FFFFF. Garagebands meters don't seem very informative as far as numbers go. Should I try to get the loudest dynaimcs in the red for something like this or is less hotness ok?

[Recording David]

Hi - yes, I would use omnis if you can find some. Space them parallel on a bar, 30-50 cm apart and experiment from there (start with the placement guidelines above and go from there).

Level-wise there is no way you should be going in the red (red is a warning sign!). If you're recording at 24 bit (and you should be) there is no reason for your loudest peaks to go over -6dB. No need for compression/limiting or any other of the tricks used in the pop studio - careful mic placement is the key to getting good results for a project like this.

I would monitor on headphones while you're placing the mics and double check on the speakers - ideally you should set up your gear oin a room away from the actual recording location. Of course if this is not possible you cannot have monitors on in the same room as the performer.

[amfortas2006]

check this out... he sems to be recording cello.


Albums photos de perchman.com - mon matériel de prise de son d'ambiances sonore

[RobAnderson]

I think you'd be better off with Logic. To my knowledge, GarageBand only exports .mp4 files. I have no idea what format it records, but you would want something that can record 24-bit .wav or .aif files for something like this.

Your levels should be conservative. I am not sure how the meters are calibrated in Garageband, but going into the red is a big no-no with classical music, and with digital recording in general. If the cellist is playing at a medium volume, the meter should probably be reading about halfway up to the top. After he(?) has warmed up a bit and you have your mic's placed, ask him to play his way into and through the loudest passage so you can set your levels. There should still be a little bit of headroom between his highest level and the red light at the top of the meter (because he will probably play it even louder when he actually does the take ;-)).

You can always boost it a little bit later on if it is not quite loud enough, but if it distorts, trying to fix it after the fact could be a problem, especially given your time constraint.

[pkautzsch]

You've gotten some good advice already. So I might just make additional suggestions...

For contemporary so-called "serious music", you might actually try an additional close mic, as some composers and musicians like to work with that scratchiness. Strongly depends on the piece though.
I'd prefer a spaced pair of omnis to anything else if the hall is good. Especially when working with a close mic, spaced pairs are essential to get spaciousness.
You can also set up cardioids in a spaced pair. They will not have that great bass response of SDC omnis, but still the right amount of decorrelation which produces the impression of space.
Telling the player not to move can do harm to some players. My approach is rather to fit my miking technique to the player than the other way round - ie if he tends to move a lot, give him a not-too-widely spaced pair which will be less susceptible to moving talent. A little movement is OK with classical recording, though, as it gives "life".

GarageBand internally records AIFFs, so that shouldn't be a problem.
It just names the files in a funny way if I remember correctly, so you need to look for the time of file creation to find your takes.

[Mr. Liszt]

Thanks for all the great info guys!!!! I think that I am in MUCH better shape to do this recording now!


pkautzsch,

About the close micing, there are very aggressive parts in the piece and as I said the piece is extremely dynamic. Scrathiness of the bow coming through on the recording could actually be a an interesting idea in some parts. Here is a link to the score if it will help you determine some additional thought about the close micing:

http://www.jeromeperry.com/Music%20F...lo%20Cello.pdf

[krs]

+1 pkautzsch

The piece does not contain any uber-quiet special effects, but I would still grab a spot mic which could be interesting for some grit in the aggressive sections.

I would try that SE condensor no closer than a meter away, listen for excessive bow noise. Listen carefully with your main pair that it doesn't collapse. If you do wind up using the spot in the mix, try time aligning it with the main pair.

Clips and photos please thumbsup

[David Rick]

I agree with the idea using the the SE2200a as a safety net spot. But don't waste a lot of time on it that would be better spent optimizing the stereo pair. Listen to the main pair alone and move it around until you have the best possible sound. Be sure to have the cellist play bits of all three sections. Then if there's something that isn't quite satisfying, place the spot to deal with that. There's a lot of left hand pizzicato in the first section, and sometimes a mic placement that sounds great on arco stuff doesn't give you enough oomph on pizz, especially left hand pizz. That's where the spot mic could help.

David L. Rick
Seventh String Recording

[pkautzsch]

What David said: Focus on the great main pair sound which needs to be good enough to stand on its own feet. Then you can play with the close mic as seems best to you/talent.

Looks like it's a great piece of music, btw.