on location recording question on power

[KBOY]

I'm currently in the midst of selling everything I own including my home studio and am moving back to PA to be with family and concentrate on another form of income (yea, and if you think that's crazy, I'm almost 40). I've done decent at this recording/production game but do not want to do it for my sole source of income anymore. I want to get something else going and get back to doing music and production simply for the love of it.

First I want to attack my own musical artistic ventures. Mostly acoustic based with an urban back. I'm going to be driving back from Los Angeles to PA and then when settled will be making an east coast trips to all of the places that I lived as a child. I will be doing this with an acoustic guitar in hand.

My question is a power issue. Power meaning electrical.

I'm planning on using the crown stereo mic as an ambiance mic and some sort of small condenser for close acoustic recordings. Im wishing to pick up the atmosphere of what ever surroundings I'm in to match the feeling of what is written. I'd also like to be able to if I want to set up a vocal mic as well when ever I want. Maybe even at the same time.

My question is this. How would I power such things without noise, ie car running? And if I could power things, how long would the power last? I know I can plug a laptop into my car lighter and maybe run a small audio card off the bus but it would almost positively drain the battery after a while.

Needs.....

Laptop, can use internal drive for the small amount of tracks.

Portable non volume click (to be able to watch maybe a light beat in order to fly tracks in later that are tempo based)

Audio card with 4 really good mic pres that can be powered off of the firewire bus, or an audio card with an external 4 channel pre. Quality more prefered

Power source..... Car will always be around. Maybe a second battery tied into it's own outlet but rechargeable by a better alternator..

God, I don't know.. Just wondering if any of you have any suggestions.

Thanks so much for any help.

[KBOY]

By the way, I'm looking for a metronome that has a bright maybe red light for timing that can be seen at night say like in the desert or middle of no where.

[The Byre]

Honda do a series of small generators that are almost completely silent. The very quiet ones are powered by propane gas and if you run them from ten yards away, or from behind a baffle, you will not hear them at all.

[w_stylz]

Xantrex XPower Powerpack 400 Plus - Portable AC Power
Power Supplies



Something like this should help. They also make versions for people in the video industry who need them even smaller I believe but they are more expensive.

As for the audiocard, you could get a motu traveler which will use its own battery pack therefore not draining the laptop or external PS.

MySpace.com - The Morning Stares - Chicago, Illinois - Experimental / Rock / Indie - www.myspace.com/themorningstares




BTW, my band has been trying to figure out what we are going to do to create our next album - and I think you have just given us a great idea. What better inspiration than creating music while traveling around the country.

[KBOY]

Thanks guys, No matter how quiet a generator is any mechanical noise will be a no no, and without a doubt creep into compressed tracks. It will also reside in the background of the audio whether you hear it or not and effect the emotional impact of the recording. so the generator will not work.

The motu traveler looks great. But, how quiet are the pre's and analog section? I don't know how to read spec sheets that well. I lived up in topanga recently and tried to do some outside recordings. Only finding the internal noise of some components to cover up the finer details of the outside sounds. lack of intimacy.

I know I'm probably being extreme. But, I've experienced some of these things already and don't want to invest in a set up that is sub par.

Great suggestions so far though. The Motu traveler with the battery pack seems Ideal. And I guess that along with a laptops battery could give me what? an hour? or 2? Thinking a 17" mac book pro. How long does that battery last while using something like the Motu with something like Nuendo?

No problem on the inspiration. I'm thinking this is going to be a beautiful next 6 months. Tracking in inspiring locations will lend itself to the overall feeling. Which is what music is about anyway.

thanks guys.
Kelly

[The Byre]

Don't knock those generators until you have heard them! They are designed for film work and are about as loud as loud breathing. Add a few meters of cable and they cannot be heard.

But a set of car batteries is what I would go for as it is just cheaper and is 100% quiet to be honest. Put them in the trunk and wire them to the main set and they should recharge as you drive.

[KBOY]

That Xantrex stuff looks great. i'm sure there are a lot of companies offering such devices.

Does anybody know how to equate the power output of these devices to actual amounts of time? Like say I know the laptop needs this much power, as well as this and that. How do i calculate how much time I'll get using such devices with what ever I'm loading it down with?

[KBOY]

Originally Posted by The Byre

Don't knock those generators until you have heard them! They are designed for film work and are about as loud as loud breathing. Add a few meters of cable and they cannot be heard.

But a set of car batteries is what I would go for as it is just cheaper and is 100% quiet to be honest. Put them in the trunk and wire them to the main set and they should recharge as you drive.

I'm sure they are very quiet. But in parked in a place with nothing but nature noise and the night and even the smallest sound gets picked up. Even at extreme low levels mechanical devices have a tempo to them that dictates un natural. and I believe will make it into the recording. At least the recordings I'm thinking will happen. Say like really light finger picking on the guitar to where the ambiant is more dominate. i simply want the ambiant to be completely pure, and I don't want to get home and start compressing things and be even slightly urked by something mechanical coming into the picture that was my doing.

But I hear you though. Can you point me into a direction that might tell me more about adding xtra batteries to a car? I have a Nissan Pathfinder 4x4 by the way. not sure if that matters.

Thanks again. Going to sleep now, it's 5am

[w_stylz]

They each have an AMP hour rating.

20 amp hours means that they can power a 1 amp power supply for 20 hours.
Most laptops are from 2-4 amps so you would probably want one to give you 40-60 amp hours to get 20-30 hours of recording time.

As for the motu, it is very good stock but if you want to make it even better, Black Lion Audio (search them on GS) modifies the input stages to make them sound even more open.

[The Byre]

Car batteries for mobile recording -

You can either just go to the local auto store or K-Mart and get a second battery and wire it parallel to the present one, or replace the present one with something with twice as many amp-hours. The problem in modern cars is finding space under the hood. I have a merc 4x4 (G-Waggon) and you would think that something that size would allow for God-knows how much extra stuff like turbo chargers and AC, that one has to find space under seats and things.

You could do the ultra simple thing and get a charger and a new battery and just charge it up at home and wire a car plug (i.e. cigarette lighter plug) to it and to plug in the laptop PSU (Duct Tape to the rescue!)

Another way to go, is to wire it to the same circuit as the lighter plug and it should charge up whilst driving.

If you are really in the dark on this stuff, its always better to get a auto-electrics guy to do it for you. Getting plus and minus befuddled is a great way to set fire to the car!

[KBOY]

I'm going to check into the car battery thing... Thanks for that info. I'm still trying to wrap my head around the whole watts per hour thing. Do most manufacturers post figures that can be used to judge this?

Thanks all.
Kelly

[The Byre]

Batteries are rated in amps per hour!

A car battery lasts about three years, before it drops to below half given rating (varies, depending on quality of course) so the chances are, your car may need a new one anyway.

[Jim Williams]

Look at the sound carts the location film guys use. They have this battery conversion deal down.

I would never rely on Motu and laptop recording systems, I've been burned by them once too many times. It only takes one glitch to ruin a live recording.

My location rig is a Soundcraft Delta 200 16x4x2, small enough I can carry it around. This feeds a Alesis HD24XR, the most reliable portable recording HDR. The console provides 16 mic or line inputs and the groups provide the remaining 8 inputs for monitoring. The last 8 channels are my High Speed mic preamps or a modified Yamaha MA7 8 channel mic/line preamp. The whole rig is small and lightweight. It gives first rate results. The console costs $550, the HDR $1650 and the Yamaha was around $100.

Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades