Recording grand piano in a church

[achabloop5080]

I have to record my next classical solo piano recital (Mozart, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff) in a small-medium sized church, in which reverb could be a problem.
The piano will be a steinway concert grand and I have at my disposal 2 neumann km 183 (omni) matched, 2 schoeps cmc5 mk4 (not matched) and 2 schoeps cmc5 mk 21 (not matched).
I think I should go for a schoeps pair plus neumann for ambience, but I'd like to avoid multitracking for a variety of reasons, the first being I only have 2 channels of high-end preamps, and the other preamps are the ones on my Motu Traveler or in my Mackie 1202 vlz pro.
What approach to this recording (mic choices and techniques) do you suggest?
Thank you for your help

[videoteque]

Hi Gianluca!

I would love to help you, I am Xavier, spanish, but live near Rome!

Where are you??

[peter-pan]

I always keep a SM91 stick over the hammer for the attack... you dont have to use but it can save your life at the mix.
JFN

[Legacy]

Hi achabloop,

There isn't any reason that you can get a very nice classical piano sound with a single pair of the Schoeps Mk21s or the 183s. Not knowing the space I'd start with the MK21s because they are a little more focussed than omnis and are nice on solo piano in my experience (I also don't know the 183s very well). It would be smart to have both pairs on hand as you never know till your ears get there. If there isn't a chance to listen first I'd set up a spaced pair of the MK21s.

Hope this helps,
Silas

[springer]

This should prove to be a very fine recording if the piano is in good shape. You have some stellar equuipment so don't worry about that...
Take your time and get the main pair (schoeps 21s) right. I usually find about 4 feet out from the curve of the piano and just a little (1 foot?) more towards the tail is about right to get a mix of bass and upper in a roomy church. then I angle the mics back towards the hammers maybe 10-20 degrees. Spread between mics maybe 30-40 cm.
With the remaining channels (VLZ pre's are pretty good for supporting roles) stick one of the MK4's at the tail just peeking in. And I like to put one under the piano to catch that part of the sound board and hopefully NO pedal stomping.
Good luck - you are well on your way...
Patrick

[pkautzsch]

For that kind of repertoire (except maybe Mozart) I'd start Fouquet-style, ie. spaced omni pair (KM183 are great for that) at the tail end, about 2 m high and, depending on the reverb, maybe also 2 m back. Add a hammer spot (MK4) to taste.
A bit on the bombastic side maybe, but that's what Rachmaninoff and Liszt will take well.

[themaidsroom]

rent the film "carnival of souls" - there is a woman character who is practicing the
organ in a church and she is taken by mildly psychotic spirits as she is playing -
an onlooking priest is shocked and angered.

highly recommended
good luck with the piano



be well


- jack

[fifthcircle]

You've gotten some good advice so far. My thoughts:

I'd keep all mics out of the instrument. For classical, it just isn't a sound that works well for the music. I'd start with your Schoeps MK21s. I'd place them from 4-8 feet out from the instrument spaced about 3 feet or so apart in an A-B configuration. I'd start with them at about 7 or 8 feet high.

Careful positioning will give you a great sound for solo piano. Be aware, too far apart and you end up with a hole in the center. It is better to be a bit close together than too far apart. Also, the angle of the mics will affect your sound a great deal. You can angle down to get more articulation or angle up to smooth out the sound...

You've got the tools to do a great job. Have fun.

--Ben

[David Rick]

I agree with everything Ben said. MK21's would be my first choice from your locker for the application and environment. When placing the stand, a fine place to start is directly in line with the hammers. Then move in or out and up or down. I don't know what you have for stands and bars, but I'm kind of partial to the Manfrotto stereo bar in this application, because it makes it quite easy to tilt both mics at once.

David L. Rick
Seventh String Recording