What gear for a documentary production in the desert

[jbjoubaud]

Hello,

I've been asked to join a team to make a documentary in Senegal (Africa). I don't own any recording equipement yet and I was woundering if anyone had experiences to share with me.
What gear should I buy (that would be the pay for my participation) with a 3500$ budget. And what should I buy to protect it and take care of it while I'm in this dusty country. (I'll probably go for used gear)
Thanks in advance
JB

[travisbrown]

What do you need to record? Field recording? Voiceover and interview bites? Do you need more than stereo tracks or do you need to overdub? What sort of power will you have or does it need to run off batteries? I assume you will do editing and post production after the trip, or will it be done during? Are they critical recordings, or will you have a chance to retake if something goes wrong? Do you need a redundant system?

Pelican cases are pretty good for toting stuff around in questionable environments.

Some of the boys in the remote recording forum probably have lots of experience with this stuff.

[Matti]

Discussions - rec.arts.movies.production.sound | Google Groups

Your budget seems desperate, is it for the sound or for the production?
In both cases...

Matti

[yoink]

Originally Posted by jbjoubaud

Hello,
I'm not sure where to put this thread.
I've been asked to join a team to make a documentary in Senegal (Africa). I don't own any recording equipement yet and I was woundering if anyone had experiences to share with me.
What gear should I buy (that would be the pay for my participation) with a 3500$ budget. And what should I buy to protect it and take care of it while I'm in this dusty country. (I'll probably go for used gear)
Thanks in advance
JB

We typically rent a kit with:
- Sennheiser 416mkII
- Shute FP33 (Field Mixer)
- Boom, Zepplin and Muffle
- Headphones

The kit is $50/day, but this doesn't include a recorder - however if your crew/production is shooting on video you can track straight to the camera (which a lot of budget productions do) provided it has XLR inputs. This will typically limit you (depending on the format) to 16 bit/48kHz audio but is adequate for location dialog.

You could rent a Tascam HD-P2 solid state recorder for about $40/day and bump it up to 24bit capability.

However your needs aren't entirely clear, but I'm sure with a little more clarification of what you're going to be doing I'm sure someone here (or a couple folks) can help point you in the right direction.

[soundbarnfool]

Get a couple of sennheiser 416s and a couple of Nagra IIIs. That's assuming you are not recording directly to the camera (video). And lots of 91% alcohol and canned air to clean the heads, etc.

[jbjoubaud]

Hi thanks for your replies.
I'm not sure about the couple of nagras, I admit I haven't been to the gym everynight these past months...
The documentary is roughly a portrait of Casamance (a region of Senegal) though the eyes of a local band.
So there are going to be interviews, ambiances, and possibly very small concerts. So yes a lot of field recording. To get electricity we'll have to go to a town, we'll probably be able to do that every two days.
I wanted to go stereo but the budget being so small I'm not sure it's an option.
I would not do the editing there.
I think that with 3500$ (for the sound) I indeed will have to rent, but then once the production's done I'll go home with not even a couple hundred dollars in my pocket, wich is kind of cheap for a month and a half of work. (things are way more expensive on this side of the atlantic, just the mkh416 is 80$ a week).
I don't know...
Anyway thanks again
JB

[espen askelad]

hi there. i'm a documentary photographer in my "real job" (music production is my occasionally-paying labor of love.) I haven't done field recording in a while, being almost exclusively a still photographer, when I did was back when DAT was an everyday thing, and I used a portable Tascam DAT with two ins. Still an option, I suppose - particularly given the budget, though I'd hope there are digital recorders cheap enough to be considered (provided there's enough memory.)
You'd be surprised how low-tech the equipment of a lot of higher profile documentary stuff is... I know on this site there's a definite bias towards the high end, be it the latest and greatest or vintage classic, but I've worked on projects with some of the top documentarians in the world where the interview audio and field recordings are made with a cheapie handheld Edirol recorder or straight to the XL-1. Surviveability (and as an aside, ease of redundancy) is the main thing with docu field equipment. My (sound/video) field work has always been for my own fun, and therefore not in harder conditions, but PM me and I'll try and get some tips from some guys who do/did this stuff in Kosovo, Afghanistan, Darfur, etc... pretty much as rough as conditions get!
By the way, sounds like a great project.

[Matti]

"Get a couple of sennheiser 416s and a couple of Nagra IIIs. That's assuming you are not recording directly to the camera (video). And lots of 91% alcohol and canned air to clean the heads, etc."

Now that I have taken some alcohol I still can`t see the logic there.
In real, please raise the budget and make sure you know what you are supposed to do. The editing might be endless with no decent material...
And take care of your supposed role on the shoot, I mean everybody
understands your position at the site. ETC...

Matti

[jbjoubaud]

I'd love to own two nargra III though or even better a Nagra IV-S !!!

[Matti]

Started with Nagra III in the early 70`ties.
Many stories about nagra durability.
Nowadays it would be Deva or Cantar.

Matti

["DB"]

The Mojave Mic seems a logical choice.

[chrisso]

Originally Posted by MATTI

In real, please raise the budget and make sure you know what you are supposed to do.

The reality is the budget is the budget.
This is the new reality in TV land.
One has to go with whatever budget is offered, or these films just don't get made.
TV production companies are well aware what they can get away with, and very aware how much money they can sell a niche documentary like this for.
Yes, it's disappointing.
And yes, you can find yourself working for a month for virtually nothing.
But I think in reality it's up to the individual to decide what they are prepared to do.
In essence, it's more professional to make a personal decision to do the project or not (with conditions as they are), than to start asking for more money.

Edit:
It's OK I think to work out what you need equipment-wise and make the production company aware of the costs.
It's also OK to set out what and what not you are prepared to do. How long and how hard you are prepared to work.
My experience is they will agree to work conditions, but once the project commences, all bets are off.
Pressure will be firmly put on the composer or sound recordist to deliver, no matter what. However long it takes, however small the recompence.

[jbjoubaud]

Originally Posted by "DB"

The Mojave Mic seems a logical choice.

funny guy !

[Matti]

I wouldn`t move under union rates.
I know I miss some gigs, but I don`t miss the extra hassle
of lo-fi productions.

Matti

[vernier]

With Nagra III you'll be changing tape every few minutes.

[Matti]

Before tape recordes they made sound on a separte film ( optical
obviusly ) recorder. That was bulky... and every film loading took some ( 3- 5 minutes) time.

Matti

[surflounge]

Here are some field reports from Metric Halo users doing what you need done.
Get a macbook and hard drive and a couple good mics. Hope it helps.
http://www.mhlabs.com/metric_halo/news/

[pkautzsch]

I'd go for a used Nagra and a 416. That's what you can do like 95% of all documentary sound with (and a large part of small feature sound, too), and they go for like EUR 1,500 on evil-bay. Oh, and a good and reliable boom - maybe VdB or Ambient. Peli cases and Portabrace bags or similar to keep the sand out as much as possible. Sand goes EVERYWHERE.

Originally Posted by espen askelad

I used a portable Tascam DAT with two ins. Still an option, I suppose - particularly given the budget, though I'd hope there are digital recorders cheap enough to be considered (provided there's enough memory.)

This Tascam thing is OK as long as the weather conditions are "moderate". No good in taking it out into the mountains in Winter, or to the desert. Remember: Sand goes EVERYWHERE. I'm not even sure I'd take the Fostex PD-4 out there. DAT is just too sensitive to damage. Same goes for HD recorders, I'm afraid, although you don't need to change tape twice a day.
Did I mention: Sand goes EVERYWHERE.

[soundbarnfool]

Yeah you right. That's why I said Nagra III (legendary durability is correct) and 416 (and boom) - This is assuming you know how to boom. If you don't, uh... You did say documentary, didn't you? That means "no frills".

[Nu-tra]

On the cheap you can get the Shure FP33. I use a wendt for most shows along with a CANTAR on bigger shows when I am supervising. I think the best bang for the buck is
This

Or http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...3_Channel.html

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...ble_Mixer.html
The 3 channel sound device is the same price and will destroy the shure fp33 in sound. Buy used if you can.

And go straight into camera. If it a DV CAM or a smaller camera I would hardline to it and monitor off of the headphone out of the camera. A lot of docs are shot on a dvx 100 and the headroom sucks and the gain knobs are sensitive so I usually tape them down. You can get one or two of the evolution lav/body packs for about $500 each.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...00_Series.html

The lav mic it comes with isn't the best but it will work.

[Nu-tra]

We have an old nagra we used to use on features. They don't even want us to use them any more. IT costs money to transfer the nagra to digital. Production companies want it fast and cheap. They don't want to wait for you to change tape 2 minutes seems like an hour when the crew and producers are waiting on you. If it is a doc or reality I am hardlined to the camera. if it's a film or a bigger reality form show with a budget I run 8 channels of lectro 411's to a Cantar.

[jbjoubaud]

Originally Posted by Nu-tra

The 3 channel sound device is the same price and will destroy the shure fp33 in sound. Buy used if you can.

And go straight into camera.

I just did exctly that this w-e for a short film (with a 416) and it sounded really nice even though the camera only had a 16 bits 44.1. (it was a hdv but a semi-pro model). The sound device 302 is really awesome.

I think that's I'll do if the cam is good enough (it's a hdv one too be I'd like it to be at least working in 48k.)
I'm also gonna buy an ediol r-09 or something like that just to see if it works since it's so small and so cheap and probably the lavalier system to mentionned Nu-tra (thanks for the links by the way)

Thank you all for your comments and suggestions, it's nice of you.
Cheers
JB

[Nu-tra]

Just remember you will have to wear the damn thing over your shoulder. I usually put Lavs on Channel 1 L of camera and Boom on channel 2 of the camera. If only two people laved are on camera I usually split the two lavs on left and right to isolate them.
Most shows rent us Wendt x5's and they sound like crap but it is what it is. You get the best sound you can get and call it a day. Sometimes producers stress they want room tone because post complains about not having enough. I mention at the end of a scene or interview that I want to get 15-30 seconds of roomtone but sometimes they refuse because they don't have the time. I'm sure you all realize how much of a thankless job it is. The only time they care is when the post department calls and asks why this or that happened. I always slate when something goes wrong or if a producer decides to let us do another take or veto room tone that way my ass is covered. Just remember to monitor off the camera the whole time.