Nice weekend :)

[huub]

Hi all..
I mixed the norwegian band A-ha live to stereo for MSN music this weekend in Kiel, germany..
Often a soundsupervisor in flown in for these gigs, but happily I could supervise myself mixing

YouTube - a-ha - "Stay on These Roads" Kiel concert (2/15)

Happily the band's manager liked my mixing, and I was able to keep it nice and dry..
I'm sure many of you will disagree with me, but I really don't like ambience in a mix at all,
It's like putting a reverb across your whole mix..
Obviously I'll put it in if the band/producer/manager wants it, but I very much prefer not to..

Interesting discussion possibly?

Huub

[Remoteness]

Huub,

First of all, what an excellent job. I hope we get a chance to hear more of your work.

Secondly, I'm happy to see that A-ha is still around playing live music.

Was the live MSN music performance from Kiel, germany also multitracked?

I really like the way the visual was directed. Very strong. The soft focus shots of the keys and GTRs into a clear shots were awesome.
This live concert performance was captured perfectly. A lot of "film style" camera work.
Everything about it made me feel connected to the performance and live event.

Kudos to the entire production staff.

"Interesting discussion possibly?" Yes, yes indeed!

[huub]

Thanks steve!

The producer and director are british, we work a lot for them on MTV europe stuff,
I really like the director's (matt askem) work too.

I multitracked it to pyramix (madi connected to Lawo mc 66/2 console: check Lawo out at the aes, lovely company, best broadcast consoles in the world in my humble opinion, we purchased two more last week .
The soundcheck was a day before, so had plenty of time to adjust the mix from the multitracks..

This was my first time trying out a neve 33609 compressor across a mix (2:1) and, man that thing is freaking awesome! I had no limiter, just a dB or 3,4 reduction from the neve... I loved what it did!

Crowd ambience was difficult; the crowd was far away from stage, listening to a delayed stack, go figure! also, they were very quiet and tame.. put out 8 mics, but did not like the result at all...

[Remoteness]

It's my pleasure -- You folks did an excellent job.

Man, Matt Askem is a wonderful director. What a great eye he has.

Yes, I've seen the Lawo mc 66/2 consoles at past AES conventions. I like them very much.

It sounded like you really dialed in the mix. Doing the soundcheck a day before with multitracks for remixing is a great way to make it happen.
You had plenty of time to adjust the mix. Did the band get involved with the mixage?

Ahh, the 33609 is an awesome 2Buss compressor indeed.

How did you handle the crowd ambience during the live music? Did you pretty much keep it out of the mix until the end of the songs?

Down the line if this becomes anything marketable, you could remix and time delay the audience back into the mix.

[Remoteness]

Do you have any pictures of the set-up or show?

[huub]

I wanted to make snapshots of the songs, but I did not know the names of the songs

Only their foh mixer and manager had a listen, but they liked it, so they just said: Ok just do your thing..
Their manager sat with me during live broadcast but did not ask me to change anything..
So quite nice and relaxing really..

We don't do straight music gigs so often, I'd like to go fiber to stage, but it's still 12pairs to stage.. I did have the cables tested before leaving to germany..
Then again..I do still trust copper more then fiber..The idea of having one fiber to stage, and then loosing that means you have NOTHING!!! is really scary...

I kept the ambi mics group at -20 db or so during the mix, just the way i like it
Also, there was no way to open em during the songs, because 1 set of mics was at a delayed stack, and the ones on stage had huge echos coming at em..
Im happy the crowd did almost no singing/clapping along, because that would have been a mess...

I'll send the band the multitracks, but videowise nothing else will happen with it, we only recorded line cut, no iso cameras at all.. Normally these british folks record every camera iso..

ah, yes pics.. ill try and figure out how to post em here..

[Remoteness]

Man, your trucks look fantastic...

I checked out your website -- Very nice situation you're invovled in my GS friend.

All the best to you and yours!

I look forward to seeing your pictures.

[huub]

Ah, figured out the picture thing:
The stage, with the delay stack on the right, which had 2 416's and 2 km140's rigged in,


Myself with lawo and audio booth (or whatever the english word is, in the uk they call it audio gallery i think)


and our lovely cinevideogroup OBV-10 truck


cheers,

Huub


Oh and Steve, just wait til you see our two new trucks currently in the building stage

Ofcourse I do mainly sports and not so much music, but I am happy that our ob company has nice audio equipment..
and our jobs are pretty nice and international..

And maybe the title of the thread could be changed in order to stir up a heated discussion about ambience in live music mixing?

[structuredloud]

Originally Posted by huub

And maybe the title of the thread could be changed in order to stir up a heated discussion about ambience in live music mixing?

If you want a heated discussion about ambience in a mix you might try a different forum, the remote forum is too peaceful. Or maybe try whether ambience is better in an anologue or digital mix.

[huub]

Haha,

yeah: ambience mixing: itb or otb?

[Remoteness]

Originally Posted by structuredloud

If you want a heated discussion about ambience in a mix you might try a different forum, the remote forum is too peaceful. Or maybe try whether ambience is better in an anologue or digital mix.

That's an interesting mindset... Looking for the right forum to have a heated discussion.

Forget about the topic or genre, it's more important to find the right forum to fight.

Huub knows exactly where to post his threads or comments.

IMO, it's not that the Remote Possibilities forum is too peaceful; it's a type of forum that people come to discuss and address mobile & location audio related concerns.

[huub]

And of course I was kidding about the heated discussion, I'm just interested how other engineers feel about this, and how they deal with director's/band's/whoever is involved's opinions/wishes..

[audioisgood]

Huub, absolutely great work here! I love where your drums are sitting in the mix.

Adding ambiance to an out-door gig is a difficult task. The last one I did the client definitely asked for copious amounts of reverb. We settled at a place that I could live with.

I myself like to mix the room / crowd mics up a little more. It varies from venue to venue but I will push it until either the lowend gets to mushy, i hear individual voices, or an unwanted reflection occurs. I have always been a believer in placing the room mics to address the audience, even back at the delays, still pointed to the back wall. I have never like the sound of room mics pointed towards the stage from FOH. I don't really understand how to use that (anyone want to explain). I like the idea of making my own mix and using the warmth and diffusion of the audience facing room mics to give the recording its live feel. Sometimes if the room or live engineer isn't doing its thing well I will use a multiband on my ambient buss to fix problems spots. I also adjust the timing of the room mics in the rear of the room to get just the right amount, or no amount of delay. I realize of coarse that's impossible doing a live mix to video. I have always wondered what other peoples strategies on room micing and mixing were.