Shotgun Mics

RobAnderson · 1st March 2007, 11:00 PM

Sorry - I could swear I saw a thread in here a couple of weeks ago on this:

Which of the Sennheiser shotgun mic's is standard kit for boom work?

Maybe I should be in the on-location recording forum?

Best,
Rob

charles maynes · 1st March 2007, 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobAnderson

Sorry - I could swear I saw a thread in here a couple of weeks ago on this:

Which of the Sennheiser shotgun mic's is standard kit for boom work?

Maybe I should be in the on-location recording forum?

Best,
Rob

RAMPS is the best place to look-
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...duction.sound/

the popular Sennheiser shotguns though are the MKH-416 short shotgun, the MKH816 Long shotgun and the newer KE series which have better noise specs- THe 416 is an awesome mic though.

Other mics of interest -
The Schoeps shotgun
The Sanken CSS3
The Neumann KMR-81

none are cheap. all are good.

charles maynes

**Geert van den Berg** · 1st March 2007, 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobAnderson

Maybe I should be in the on-location recording forum?

You're right, I'll redirect the thread to that forum, though it will still be visible here for a week or two...

I don't do location recording but I believe that the Sennheiser 416 is the standard shotgun mic.

**Geert van den Berg** · 1st March 2007, 11:12 PM

He

e Charles, beat me to it!

But offcourse, he knows a lot about 'shotguns'!

Jim vanBergen · 1st March 2007, 11:23 PM

Love the 416, can't say enough good about it...

has anyone used the Schoeps shotgun yet? (Sorry for the hijack!)

I thought I was done with Senn 816s, but here I am at an opera house with four of them, and they sound perfect. C'est la vie!

Jim

charles maynes · 2nd March 2007, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geert van den Berg

He

e Charles, beat me to it!

But offcourse, he knows a lot about 'shotguns'!

Well of course my favorite shotguns are made by Remington and Benelli- Though I must confess I was looking at an M4 Carbine this afternoon.

However, I do LOVE the MKH416- If any one wants to give one to a good cause, let me know...

charles maynes

shilshoolon · 2nd March 2007, 02:15 AM

Since you brought up this subject and Jim already hijacked your thread

I thought I should join him and ask: what about a lower cost alternative to the MKH416?

soundbarnfool · 2nd March 2007, 02:35 AM

The 416 is the one. Or an older 415, even. Doubles as a club, which can come in handy when covering a political campaign.

charles maynes · 2nd March 2007, 02:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by soundbarnfool

The 416 is the one. Or an older 415, even. Doubles as a club, which can come in handy when covering a political campaign.

I second that-

As Samuel L.Jackson said in "Jackie Brown" accept no substitute...

For what it does it is brilliant.

shilshoolon · 2nd March 2007, 01:41 PM

Thank you for your help,

I'll save up for this one for sure as it seems like everyones choice.

Haydn · 2nd March 2007, 07:17 PM

I use a sennheiser MKH60 Shotgun, which I believe is similar to the 416..

but I don't know the exact differences, sorry :P

Jim vanBergen · 2nd March 2007, 07:27 PM

MKH60 is more expensive than a 416.

K3 w/ ME80 is an older, Electret condenser Sennheisser shotgun which is a good, low cost (used) alternative...but nothing is as good. A lot of people use Audio Technica 815, but personally, I think they sound like SH*T. (I own one, and an 835...they just suck.)

Neumann KM82i, Senn 416, 816, MKH60, MKH70.

Lower cost: AKG 460 w/ MK8 head, or Blue line 391 power supply with MK8 head. But not as good.

davebl@dircon.c · 2nd March 2007, 07:35 PM

MKH 416 used to be the standard short gun mic. Most robust of the lot of them, good in cold, heat, damp etc. One issue is is phases when panned.

MKH 60 is the new version, much lower noise floor. Doesnt phase when panned. much less comb filtering from the short tube in front of the capsuel. This mic fails in extreem heat ie in a wind gag that seems to act like a green house in strong sun. cool it down again and it comes back to life again.

MKH 70, had one for a while , didnt seem to be any more usefull than the MKH 60 as it doesnt seem to be any more directional and a nusance as it is a little longer and gets in shot more easily, so I sold it. Hopless for M/S work.

MKH 816 great long gun mic. Seems to be more directional than the 70 by quite some way. Use it about 3 time a year when the 60 gives out. Dont even think about panning this thing, leave it one one position.

Shoeps short gun, cant remember the name of it. Never used one but those that have say its prefered over the MKH 60. The new must have mic. Must try one.

MKH 418 M/S mic, seems to be a 416 with an MS capsuel built in to it, a convienent mic but still needs a 5 inch Rycote to keep the wind of the S capsule. A 4 inch Rycote basket doesnt work so well.

Always use an MKH30/40 M/S pair for wildtracks not the 30/60 pair, stereo is far far better.

Thats my view of it all anyway, be interested to hear what others think.

davebl@dircon.c · 2nd March 2007, 07:36 PM

Ah yes ME66, I have 5. Very usefull low cost short gun.

Electret, dont use it in the damp.

soundguydave · 3rd March 2007, 02:25 AM

This might be an appropiate thread hijack. What hairy cover do you guys like for the 416? I mostly use it in the studio for VO work, but I occasionaly go out on location and use it. So I don't need the best or most critical, just something good.

davebl@dircon.c · 3rd March 2007, 09:05 AM

A Rycote Windjammer over a Rycote basket.

Jim vanBergen · 3rd March 2007, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davebl@dircon.c

A Rycote Windjammer over a Rycote basket.

As usual, Dave is spot on with great & fast answers ! The Windjammer is THE industry standard for outdoor work, --though as long as there's no rain and the wind is mild, you can usually get away with the foam windshield that comes with the mic-- but one good wind gust and you're reaching for Rycote, which is well built and has minimal sonic impact.

davebl@dircon.c · 3rd March 2007, 05:13 PM

Thanks Jim,

, Windjammers do get wet after which thay no good to anyone. I ahve a couple of the Sennheier ones that have longer hair reminding me more of a sort of woolly mamoth type of affair. It seemed to be Ok but I still much prefer a windjamer. Its a must have not an option for a recordist. With good care theyll last a few years but then they staet going bald bin them and buy another.

There is a fleece cover which is just a soft cover which seems to be OK in the rain, I cant say its acousticaly transparent when wet but in really heavy rain and theres absolutly no other option if may keep the rain out subject to the whole mic getting wet and having rain noise. Youll see these things at most race meetings and Wimbledon tennis, they seem to survive OK. I tend to switch the HF boost on the MKH mics if there fitted when inside a windjammer.

Someone asked about which product suited a 30/60 combination which is here.

Make: Sennheiser
Model: MKH30/MKH60

Stereo Suspension
Order Code: 040211
Bar Side: 2 module
Back-to-Back Clips: 25Rd/25Rd-25Sq/25Sq
O-Rings Size: 21.6X2.4

Connbox
Order Code: CB3 (016903)

Stereo Windshield
Order Code: AG (010906)
Body Length: 300
Slot Length: 170
Overall Length: 460
Bracket Holes: 1 & 5
Filler Stripe Length: 180 (mm)

Windjammer (fur cover)
Order Code: AG (021906)

Hi Wind Cover (fleece cover)
Order Code: AG (022630)

Just hijacked this from the rycote site (sorry Vivienne, think of it as a marketing aid !)

http://www.rycote.com

I am very lucky as these guy and girls are just up the road from me, along with ATC.

SixAndChange · 4th March 2007, 08:31 PM

I actually have an old Sennheiser ME 40 that works pretty good. It was free and I have no clue how much it would cost new, but I dont really care.

Anyone know anything at all about this thing?

davebl@dircon.c · 4th March 2007, 08:48 PM

Electret very short gun, more like hyper cardiod I think, should have something like a K3 preamp attached to it. Useful on a desk stand or when you can get it reasnobly close. Use it where a 435 used to be used.

An interesting thing about the 416 or MKH 60 is if it is placed right on the edge of shot, ie in cut off on a 16 x 9 film camera. The audio perspective was usualy right for the shot framing. Nothing else seems to perform this way.

sonidista · 15th May 2007, 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by charles maynes

RAMPS is the best place to look-
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...duction.sound/

the popular Sennheiser shotguns though are the MKH-416 short shotgun, the MKH816 Long shotgun and the newer KE series which have better noise specs- THe 416 is an awesome mic though.

Other mics of interest -
The Schoeps shotgun
The Sanken CSS3
The Neumann KMR-81

none are cheap. all are good.

charles maynes

The Schoeps CMIT is an incredibly well-crafted shotgun. No phasing when panned and very great frequency response 360°. I wouldn't be surprised if in the long run it takes over 416's leading role in shotgun mics.

I use a Rode NTG-1 also, which is cheap but well done and way better than Audiotechnica. Not sure whether I'd prefer it over a ME66 though. Aynone compared the two?

davebl@dircon.c · 15th May 2007, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sonidista

The Schoeps CMIT is an incredibly well-crafted shotgun. No phasing when panned and very great frequency response 360°. I wouldn't be surprised if in the long run it takes over 416's leading role in shotgun mics.

I use a Rode NTG-1 also, which is cheap but well done and way better than Audiotechnica. Not sure whether I'd prefer it over a ME66 though. Aynone compared the two?

I think the CMIT is great. Most likely my next buy. May not be so good in humidity and damp environments though.

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1st March 2007, 11:00 PM	#1
RobAnderson Gear nut Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: NY New York a wonderful town Posts: 86	Shotgun Mics Sorry - I could swear I saw a thread in here a couple of weeks ago on this: Which of the Sennheiser shotgun mic's is standard kit for boom work? Maybe I should be in the on-location recording forum? Best, Rob __________________ "Everybody gets so much information all day long that they lose their common sense." - G. Stein 1946 http://homepages.nyu.edu/~rea253

1st March 2007, 11:12 PM	#4
Geert van den Berg Mac Moderator Join Date: May 2003 Location: Amsterdam Posts: 2,583	Hee Charles, beat me to it! But offcourse, he knows a lot about 'shotguns'!

1st March 2007, 11:23 PM	#5
Jim vanBergen Lives for gear Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: New York Friggin' City Posts: 2,294	+1 on Senn 416! Love the 416, can't say enough good about it... has anyone used the Schoeps shotgun yet? (Sorry for the hijack!) I thought I was done with Senn 816s, but here I am at an opera house with four of them, and they sound perfect. C'est la vie! Jim

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2nd March 2007, 02:15 AM	#7
shilshoolon Gear nut Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 109	Since you brought up this subject and Jim already hijacked your thread I thought I should join him and ask: what about a lower cost alternative to the MKH416?

2nd March 2007, 02:35 AM	#8
soundbarnfool Gear addict Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Nashville Posts: 347	The 416 is the one. Or an older 415, even. Doubles as a club, which can come in handy when covering a political campaign.

2nd March 2007, 01:41 PM	#10
shilshoolon Gear nut Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 109	Thank you for your help, I'll save up for this one for sure as it seems like everyones choice.

2nd March 2007, 07:17 PM	#11
Haydn Gear Head Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 37	I use a sennheiser MKH60 Shotgun, which I believe is similar to the 416.. but I don't know the exact differences, sorry :P

2nd March 2007, 07:27 PM	#12
Jim vanBergen Lives for gear Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: New York Friggin' City Posts: 2,294	MKH60 is more expensive than a 416. K3 w/ ME80 is an older, Electret condenser Sennheisser shotgun which is a good, low cost (used) alternative...but nothing is as good. A lot of people use Audio Technica 815, but personally, I think they sound like SH*T. (I own one, and an 835...they just suck.) Neumann KM82i, Senn 416, 816, MKH60, MKH70. Lower cost: AKG 460 w/ MK8 head, or Blue line 391 power supply with MK8 head. But not as good.

2nd March 2007, 07:35 PM	#13
davebl@dircon.c Gear maniac Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Gloucestershire Posts: 276	MKH 416 used to be the standard short gun mic. Most robust of the lot of them, good in cold, heat, damp etc. One issue is is phases when panned. MKH 60 is the new version, much lower noise floor. Doesnt phase when panned. much less comb filtering from the short tube in front of the capsuel. This mic fails in extreem heat ie in a wind gag that seems to act like a green house in strong sun. cool it down again and it comes back to life again. MKH 70, had one for a while , didnt seem to be any more usefull than the MKH 60 as it doesnt seem to be any more directional and a nusance as it is a little longer and gets in shot more easily, so I sold it. Hopless for M/S work. MKH 816 great long gun mic. Seems to be more directional than the 70 by quite some way. Use it about 3 time a year when the 60 gives out. Dont even think about panning this thing, leave it one one position. Shoeps short gun, cant remember the name of it. Never used one but those that have say its prefered over the MKH 60. The new must have mic. Must try one. MKH 418 M/S mic, seems to be a 416 with an MS capsuel built in to it, a convienent mic but still needs a 5 inch Rycote to keep the wind of the S capsule. A 4 inch Rycote basket doesnt work so well. Always use an MKH30/40 M/S pair for wildtracks not the 30/60 pair, stereo is far far better. Thats my view of it all anyway, be interested to hear what others think.

2nd March 2007, 07:36 PM	#14
davebl@dircon.c Gear maniac Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Gloucestershire Posts: 276	Ah yes ME66, I have 5. Very usefull low cost short gun. Electret, dont use it in the damp.

3rd March 2007, 02:25 AM	#15
soundguydave Gear maniac Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 286	This might be an appropiate thread hijack. What hairy cover do you guys like for the 416? I mostly use it in the studio for VO work, but I occasionaly go out on location and use it. So I don't need the best or most critical, just something good.

3rd March 2007, 09:05 AM	#16
davebl@dircon.c Gear maniac Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Gloucestershire Posts: 276	A Rycote Windjammer over a Rycote basket.

3rd March 2007, 05:13 PM	#18
davebl@dircon.c Gear maniac Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Gloucestershire Posts: 276	Thanks Jim, , Windjammers do get wet after which thay no good to anyone. I ahve a couple of the Sennheier ones that have longer hair reminding me more of a sort of woolly mamoth type of affair. It seemed to be Ok but I still much prefer a windjamer. Its a must have not an option for a recordist. With good care theyll last a few years but then they staet going bald bin them and buy another. There is a fleece cover which is just a soft cover which seems to be OK in the rain, I cant say its acousticaly transparent when wet but in really heavy rain and theres absolutly no other option if may keep the rain out subject to the whole mic getting wet and having rain noise. Youll see these things at most race meetings and Wimbledon tennis, they seem to survive OK. I tend to switch the HF boost on the MKH mics if there fitted when inside a windjammer. Someone asked about which product suited a 30/60 combination which is here. Make: Sennheiser Model: MKH30/MKH60 Stereo Suspension Order Code: 040211 Bar Side: 2 module Back-to-Back Clips: 25Rd/25Rd-25Sq/25Sq O-Rings Size: 21.6X2.4 Connbox Order Code: CB3 (016903) Stereo Windshield Order Code: AG (010906) Body Length: 300 Slot Length: 170 Overall Length: 460 Bracket Holes: 1 & 5 Filler Stripe Length: 180 (mm) Windjammer (fur cover) Order Code: AG (021906) Hi Wind Cover (fleece cover) Order Code: AG (022630) Just hijacked this from the rycote site (sorry Vivienne, think of it as a marketing aid !) http://www.rycote.com I am very lucky as these guy and girls are just up the road from me, along with ATC.

4th March 2007, 08:31 PM	#19
SixAndChange Gear nut Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: SWFLA Posts: 147	I actually have an old Sennheiser ME 40 that works pretty good. It was free and I have no clue how much it would cost new, but I dont really care. Anyone know anything at all about this thing?

4th March 2007, 08:48 PM	#20
davebl@dircon.c Gear maniac Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Gloucestershire Posts: 276	Electret very short gun, more like hyper cardiod I think, should have something like a K3 preamp attached to it. Useful on a desk stand or when you can get it reasnobly close. Use it where a 435 used to be used. An interesting thing about the 416 or MKH 60 is if it is placed right on the edge of shot, ie in cut off on a 16 x 9 film camera. The audio perspective was usualy right for the shot framing. Nothing else seems to perform this way.