Brass Section Recording Studio

[Nestor Z.]

Hello Fellow Slutz,

I do not post much around here but thanks to this site and local engineer friends I started a small home studio over a year and a half ago...I record and arrange mainly horn sections for producers around town. I have been doing this for almost 10 years here in South Florida. Any style. Actually anyone who needs my services is welcome. With the help of people on this site I narrowed down my gear to the bare necessities. MAC G5 2.3, 002R, Millennia preamp, Coles 4038, Sennheiser MD441, AKG 414ULS, Event SP8 monitors, room treatment, etc...

Attached I put a sample of the kind of work that I am doing. I would appreciate an honest suggestion on how I could possibly improve the sound. Later this year I plan on opening an online business to offer my services to anyone around the world. It will be similar to what lots of drummers are doing online except strictly brass sections/solos. That said, I want to make sure that my projects leave with the best audio quality possible.

Gear that I have in my sights are:

Rosetta 200 or
UA 2192 or
Blue LAVRY AD/DA

Great River ME-1NV
UA LA-610

Royer R-121
NEUMAN U-87

In the sample you will hear 2 trumpets, 3 bones, midi piano/bass, and a percussion loop. I muted the piano every 4 bars so that you could analyze the brass on its own. I used a little plate/chamber R-VERB (.95 sec long) on it to make it blend better in the mix. Mind you the only final cut on this track is the brass. Everything including the voice, chorus, live bass, and percussion were recorded later. Oh, I had to attach an MP3 file because the section is too long/large for an AIFF or WAV file. If anyone wants to hear a higher quality file like a WAV send me a PM and I will email it to you.

Hope to hear some constructive critisism from you all...

Thank you and take care,

Nestor Z.

[ArcCirDude]

Hey Nestor,

The brass sounds really good and well recorded. Sounds like 1 bone and 1 trumpet overdubed... I say that because the phrasing is so tight and the timbres are so similar. Thats NOT to say it sounds bad, just homogenous. Either way, you have a great section sound and shouldn't have problems getting customers. Just mix the brass with the rest of the tune and make sure the rest of the tune is as well recorded. And perhaps avoid the piano loop. I grew up playing in latin bands in New Orleans and as you know, the interplay between live musicians can't be approached by loops. IMHO, of course.

P.S. Is Billy Spencer still in Miami?

[jseveriniii]

A Trick I have used when using one player for supplement an entire section is to have them actually DETUNE their instrument completely far out and then retune it back. I then have them stand in different places in the room on each pass. This can help get away from having it sound too close to being the same player. However, depending on what you want, that may actually be a good thing!

Also, when it comes to brass players, most of them have multiple mouthpieces of various types. Having them do a few passes with each of the different mouthpieces can create the illusion of different playes with different horns.

[Snatchman]

Sounds good!... ..Nothing like a tight horn section driving you playing live! Back in the 70's.. ...when I was guitarist/lead singer for this Funk group.. ..., we had a 5 piece horn section that Rocked! Brass Construction, Parliment, Confunkshun, Earth, Wind, and Fire, etc. covers songs! Oh well........

[Nestor Z.]

Originally Posted by ArcCirDude

Hey Nestor,

The brass sounds really good and well recorded.

Thank you for the compliment!!! I appreciate it.

Sounds like 1 bone and 1 trumpet overdubed... I say that because the phrasing is so tight and the timbres are so similar. Thats NOT to say it sounds bad, just homogenous. Either way, you have a great section sound and shouldn't have problems getting customers.

You are completely right.

Being a trombone player I overdubed my self and did the same with the trumpet player. I always use the best players. There is no room in my studio to record a whole section at the same time, and most of the recordings around here are overdubed one at a time anyways. If one of my clients ever requires a live section type of sound I use a friend of mines studio to record in. So far though not one producer has complained about the sound that I am able to achieve.

Just mix the brass with the rest of the tune and make sure the rest of the tune is as well recorded.

This is one battle that I am never certain about. There are very few great mixing engineers around here, and I have to step very lightly on who I recommend due to pride and "work circles" issues. Too bad I usually never get a chance to participate in a mixing session unless it is for a friends project.

And perhaps avoid the piano loop. I grew up playing in latin bands in New Orleans and as you know, the interplay between live musicians can't be approached by loops. IMHO, of course.

The sample that you hear here is not the final recording. Unfortunately several of the recordings that I do here are recorded on top of songs that are not complete yet. This track that you heard was created one night before I recorded the brass tracks. Basically we were pressed with time because the artist had to complete two songs in a few days. The producer I was working with has live percussion loops that he uses for time and feel purposes only. Like I mentioned earlier the piano, bass, percussion (conga, bongo, cowbell, timbal, guiro), chorus, singer were all recorded later. I'll try to get you a final mix so that you hear the final product.

P.S. Is Billy Spencer still in Miami?

That name rings a bell but he definitely does not play around in this town anymore. If he does I would be surprised because this is not that big of a city...

Anyways, I would love to know your opinions on if it would be worth my while to go ahead and invest more money in my studio??? Will the investment make sense considering the quality that I am getting right now???

This site has me thinking too much about gear!!!!ARGHHHHHH!!!!!!

Thanks for your reply.

Take care,

Nestor Z.

[davedarling]

sounds great - good job.

Dave Darling

[Beech]

The brass sounds great man! If that's what you've done with the gear you have would you consider sending your spare cash on a real piano instead of more gear? You'd be surprised at how cool it is to have even an nice upright around. Then a few percussion instruments s to add your own flavor to you loops. Just a thought.

What mic did you use on the bone and trumpet?

Keep up the good work!

[Nestor Z.]

Originally Posted by Beech

The brass sounds great man! If that's what you've done with the gear you have would you consider sending your spare cash on a real piano instead of more gear? You'd be surprised at how cool it is to have even an nice upright around. Then a few percussion instruments s to add your own flavor to you loops. Just a thought.


Keep up the good work!

Thanks dude!!!

I am not the piano player. The producer that I was working with on this project actually created the harmonic arrangement. He played the piano and bass on midi for it.

I only arrange and record the brass. Right now.

What mic did you use on the bone and trumpet?

Trumpet - Sennheiser MD-441
Bone - Coles 4038


Take care,

Nestor

[PlugHead]

Yep,

It sounds tite, tho I'm missing the sax to give it more 'bite' as a section, tho the ideas are good...

Nice arranging - it sounds good (thru these little laptop speakers!) and thru phones, I can tell there is some panning done to the parts.

That said, I'd consider panning parts even more to the fringes, and/or using a 'widening' plugin (i.e. DUY/Waves etc.) to create a different and somewhat exciting space for the parts. Or, using a delay to do the same thing, or even dbl tracking each part and panning them differently (or to taste), and leaving a bit of 'looseness' creep in, as when things are too tight, they can be sterile.

This of course is an opinion, so YMMV greatly.

My .02 c - nice work Nestor - bet you love that 4038 on bone (nice on the opening bass register part) - I know I do!

[Motown Majic]

How about your phone number so I can call you for some consulting, and midi work

Bob 919-467-0900

[parissound]

Nice work, Excellent.
Awesome sound, I know we can work together in the near future.
Please PM me with some prices for future reference.
I record 95% salsa so we can do business.
I don't realy care about the mix since I would be doing the mixes.

Thanks, Eric M.

[Nestor Z.]

Originally Posted by PlugHead

Yep, It sounds tite, tho I'm missing the sax to give it more 'bite' as a section, tho the ideas are good...

I use a sax for pop, carribean, Hatian, Ska, spanish rock, etc.

Lately for salsa all I use is either

2 bones, two trumpets, or

3 bones, two trumpets, or

2 bones, 2 trumpets, and a baritone sax.

Yeah when I record a sax it adds that bite that is so pleasing to the ears...I love it too...

Fot the most part I do as I am instructed according to the people that I am working with.

Nice arranging - it sounds good (thru these little laptop speakers!) and thru phones, I can tell there is some panning done to the parts.

Than you for the compliment...

Yeah I panned them. The trumpets were panned - 15% L/R, and the bones were panned - bn1 0%, bn2 60%L, bn3 60%R. Depends on the song and the voicings.

If I am recording octaves with only bone parts I will put the bottom octave in the 1st bone channel so that when I pan them the fat low end will be right in the middle...Just like in the sample you heard...

That said, I'd consider panning parts even more to the fringes, and/or using a 'widening' plugin (i.e. DUY/Waves etc.) to create a different and somewhat exciting space for the parts. Or, using a delay to do the same thing, or even dbl tracking each part and panning them differently (or to taste), and leaving a bit of 'looseness' creep in, as when things are too tight, they can be sterile.

Widening plugins... That sure does interest me...Could you give me more details...

I agree that too tight of a section could be sterile sometimes. That is something that has been brought upon us in the recent years. Now the standard in this kind of music is very high. Not just from the producers but from the musicians themselves.

What I have been doing is trying to get the best feeling, sounding, intune, and intime takes so that I do not have to edit. I think that to record brass just like guitars, drums, or even voices the person recording has to kind of visualize the sound they want in their head in order to get it on tape. That is the hard part when recording one trak at a time.

This of course is an opinion, so YMMV greatly.

My .02 c - nice work Nestor - bet you love that 4038 on bone (nice on the opening bass register part) - I know I do!

Thanks for replying my man!!! This is exactly the kind of interaction that I am looking for.

Yup, I love my Coles 4038!!! It´s the BEST!!!

Take care,

Nestor

test

[Nestor Z.]

Originally Posted by parissound

Nice work, Excellent.
Awesome sound, I know we can work together in the near future.
Please PM me with some prices for future reference.
I record 95% salsa so we can do business.
I don't realy care about the mix since I would be doing the mixes.

Thanks, Eric M.

PM sent...

My rates are reasonable since I work out of my house and I love this so much!!!

Love your myspace songs.

NZ