Live vocal compressor settings

Genius Gone Ins · 8th February 2007

Hey guys,

quick question...what is a generally good starting point for compression on vocals in your REHEARSAL space, meaning LIVE, not when recording? Thanks,

dfegad

Jim Kerr · 9th February 2007

well if your playing loudly and tend to belt it out I would say bet. -4 and -8 threshold, 4:1 compression and +6 on the output. Fast attack and fast release. If your a quiet band and the singing might be off mic a little then I would say -4 -6 thresh, 2:1 to 4:1 comp, and + 4 on the output. Mess around a little. A real function is to achieve the same gain when the singers head is off mic or to the side as it is when they are right on the mic. Heavy stuff can get slammed a little more. Good luck.

Zeppelin · 9th February 2007

For a rehearsel space I would recommend to leave the comp off, especially if your into rock or anything not acoustic. It's a reason why engineers at live shows split the voc mikes into two channels so that the one feeding the monitors can be unprocessed: you are loosing gain to feedback. Less is more you know

Jim Kerr · 9th February 2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeppelin

For a rehearsel space I would recommend to leave the comp off, especially if your into rock or anything not acoustic. It's a reason why engineers at live shows split the voc mikes into two channels so that the one feeding the monitors can be unprocessed: you are loosing gain to feedback. Less is more you know

There's nothing wrong with your opinion and I too don't bother with comps in a rehearsal however if I have the time I would use comps. If the rig is powerful enough and you desire what a comp does then why not.

The reason for splitting channels at a venue is for isolated monitors period. Not to only have clean unprocessed channels. Thats what you start with (in a pro enviroment) In fact the amount of eq-ing can be extreme and if drums are being sent the comps on the drums may be "WAY MORE" squshed because they are feeding a box or wedge that might be 3ft from someones ear. If the artist reqiure comps on their monitors which does happen then they will be there. From monitor world.

stuntbutt · 9th February 2007

I would think that rehearsing without vocal compression would encourage better mic techinique.

tINY · 9th February 2007

Kids these days....

No wonder we have few good young performers.

Learn to sing and you don't need a compressor for rehearsal. You should be able to sing with your monitor - which will be uncompressed at a gig.

If you are rehearsing with IEMs - it must be nice......

-tINY

Jim Kerr · 9th February 2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by stuntbutt

I would think that rehearsing without vocal compression would encourage better mic techinique.

True.

Jim Kerr · 9th February 2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by tINY

Kids these days....

No wonder we have few good young performers.

If you are rehearsing with IEMs - it must be nice......

-tINY

Um.....I don't understand. Why say "kids"? as in naive? You ever hear "30 years upon my head and to have you call me child?" come on. I agree that dynamics is key but the person whether a kid or not (kids are great by the way) asked a question about a not absured audio subject.

You know its tiring to hear all the compressed crap out there, I blame the coroperate media and producers, not the kids wanting to have fun. I also am tired of all idots like myself who complain about all the compressed crap. It still smells bad! Anyways I agree that its the content thats in your soul. Thats what your really saying right? I apolize for ranting.

Man back in the day comps were for record lathes and transmitters and PA systems. When did they become color. Well heck I think its all good, just a bit more tricky...to get some dynamics. Its the music.

In ears suck.

tINY · 9th February 2007

The IEMs would let you squash the vocals without the feedback problems.

Comps on anything like stage monitors or PA speakers in a small room are a disaster waiting to happen.

-tINY

Genius Gone Ins · 9th February 2007

Thanks for the replies guys!... Oh, and tINY, if 31 years old is a KID to you, then you must be really old.

tINY · 9th February 2007

I got a couple of years on you....

If running monitors counts double, I'm ancient....

-tINY

vernier · 9th February 2007

Dynamics are wonderful ..forget the compressor.

Genius Gone Ins · 9th February 2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by vernier

Dynamics are wonderful ..forget the compressor.

Well the idea was to get the quieter passages, ie whispers, to come out a bit. We play metal, real loud metal.

BJohnston · 10th February 2007

We are talking about the idea of crompressing vox in the wedge for the practice space right? From a monitor engineer's standpoint compression on vocals can be a pandoras box of problems. Especially if your equipment...ie board, mic, wedges, outboard octave eq...etc... are semi pro type gear. I say that because most guys I know that play in bands, myself included, don't travel around with Rat, Meyers, or Clair Brothers type monitor rigs. The bandwidths in the eq sections of most of your Mackie or Behringer type consoles are pretty drastic. When you start dipping out frequencies you'll cause a lot more feedback problems due to phasing. Add the compression on top of that and you've got a real mess. You could probably get away with some 2:1 type stuff, but to get whispery type things to really come through with heavey riffs a blaze you're talking pretty drastic compression levels. Which is another reason why from a musician standpoint In Ears can be great and from a FOH and Monitor Engineer's perspective they're beautiful. A lot of guys just can't get used to in ears because of the obvious reasons. Unfortunately playing in a band doesn't offer you the luxury of having the best seat in the house. Part of being a great singer is using mic technique. Even in the studio there's a lot to be said for knowing how to work the mic. That's just my $.02.

B

outoftune · 11th February 2007

bjohnston, nice informative reply...just wondering if you'd care to share any tips with regards to vocal mic technique in a live setting.

BJohnston · 12th February 2007

I think the biggest thing is finding the correct mic for the particular singer. I like the Audix OM series for the fact that they've got a variety of cardiod patterned mics to choose from. Some pretty loose others really tight. Especially for heavy music with a really hard hitting drummer the tighter patterned mics can help with drum and cymbal bleed quite a bit. It takes a while to learn where you need to be on the mic to make it work for you though.
Cupping the mic is another huge problem. I know it may look cool, but believe me you doing more harm than good. Singing with control is key and knowing what you can and can't get away with is something I think you just learn in time.

B

Jim vanBergen · 12th February 2007

I do a LOT of duty mixing FOH and live broadcasts, often I get stuck doing BOTH without extra pay.

For a vocal starting point, set your threshold to 0dB or +2dB, and a ratio of either 1.5:1 or 2:1. You can set the attack/release to AUTO or go to 12 o'clock on either one. This is a FINE way to start with a comp on vocals, and will let you actually HEAR much of whats happening as you dial it in and hear the way the compressor works with the voice. If you don't hear the difference as you dial in the comp, then take it out of the chain.

When I have serious compression to do, I might start at -6 or -8 with a ratio of 3:1. You use that with a basic vocal before the screaming starts, you'll hear a buttload of compression when the screaming begins. If you get to 6:1 compression, you have SOMETIME dialed in wrong, or you're using the compressor to fix a different problem entirely, like keeping a vocal FLAT to compete with an overly loud guitar amp.

I hope this helps!

8th February 2007	#1
Genius Gone Ins Gear interested Joined: Nov 2006 Posts: 10 Thread Starter	Live vocal compressor settings Hey guys, quick question...what is a generally good starting point for compression on vocals in your REHEARSAL space, meaning LIVE, not when recording? Thanks, dfegad

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9th February 2007	#2
Jim Kerr Gear addict Joined: Aug 2006 Posts: 465	well if your playing loudly and tend to belt it out I would say bet. -4 and -8 threshold, 4:1 compression and +6 on the output. Fast attack and fast release. If your a quiet band and the singing might be off mic a little then I would say -4 -6 thresh, 2:1 to 4:1 comp, and + 4 on the output. Mess around a little. A real function is to achieve the same gain when the singers head is off mic or to the side as it is when they are right on the mic. Heavy stuff can get slammed a little more. Good luck.

9th February 2007	#3
Zeppelin Gear addict Joined: May 2006 Location: Giske, Norway Posts: 355	For a rehearsel space I would recommend to leave the comp off, especially if your into rock or anything not acoustic. It's a reason why engineers at live shows split the voc mikes into two channels so that the one feeding the monitors can be unprocessed: you are loosing gain to feedback. Less is more you know

9th February 2007	#5
stuntbutt Gear maniac Joined: Dec 2004 Location: St. Louis Posts: 261	I would think that rehearsing without vocal compression would encourage better mic techinique.

9th February 2007	#6
tINY Gear Guru Joined: Jul 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 10,234	Kids these days.... No wonder we have few good young performers. Learn to sing and you don't need a compressor for rehearsal. You should be able to sing with your monitor - which will be uncompressed at a gig. If you are rehearsing with IEMs - it must be nice...... -tINY

9th February 2007	#12
vernier Lives for gear Joined: Mar 2006 Posts: 6,130	Dynamics are wonderful ..forget the compressor.

10th February 2007	#14
BJohnston Gear maniac Joined: Dec 2004 Location: Lower Midwest Posts: 277	We are talking about the idea of crompressing vox in the wedge for the practice space right? From a monitor engineer's standpoint compression on vocals can be a pandoras box of problems. Especially if your equipment...ie board, mic, wedges, outboard octave eq...etc... are semi pro type gear. I say that because most guys I know that play in bands, myself included, don't travel around with Rat, Meyers, or Clair Brothers type monitor rigs. The bandwidths in the eq sections of most of your Mackie or Behringer type consoles are pretty drastic. When you start dipping out frequencies you'll cause a lot more feedback problems due to phasing. Add the compression on top of that and you've got a real mess. You could probably get away with some 2:1 type stuff, but to get whispery type things to really come through with heavey riffs a blaze you're talking pretty drastic compression levels. Which is another reason why from a musician standpoint In Ears can be great and from a FOH and Monitor Engineer's perspective they're beautiful. A lot of guys just can't get used to in ears because of the obvious reasons. Unfortunately playing in a band doesn't offer you the luxury of having the best seat in the house. Part of being a great singer is using mic technique. Even in the studio there's a lot to be said for knowing how to work the mic. That's just my $.02. B

11th February 2007	#15
outoftune Gear nut Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 83	bjohnston, nice informative reply...just wondering if you'd care to share any tips with regards to vocal mic technique in a live setting.

12th February 2007	#16
BJohnston Gear maniac Joined: Dec 2004 Location: Lower Midwest Posts: 277	I think the biggest thing is finding the correct mic for the particular singer. I like the Audix OM series for the fact that they've got a variety of cardiod patterned mics to choose from. Some pretty loose others really tight. Especially for heavy music with a really hard hitting drummer the tighter patterned mics can help with drum and cymbal bleed quite a bit. It takes a while to learn where you need to be on the mic to make it work for you though. Cupping the mic is another huge problem. I know it may look cool, but believe me you doing more harm than good. Singing with control is key and knowing what you can and can't get away with is something I think you just learn in time. B

12th February 2007	#17
Jim vanBergen Lives for gear Joined: Apr 2005 Location: New York Friggin' City Posts: 2,562	I do a LOT of duty mixing FOH and live broadcasts, often I get stuck doing BOTH without extra pay. For a vocal starting point, set your threshold to 0dB or +2dB, and a ratio of either 1.5:1 or 2:1. You can set the attack/release to AUTO or go to 12 o'clock on either one. This is a FINE way to start with a comp on vocals, and will let you actually HEAR much of whats happening as you dial it in and hear the way the compressor works with the voice. If you don't hear the difference as you dial in the comp, then take it out of the chain. When I have serious compression to do, I might start at -6 or -8 with a ratio of 3:1. You use that with a basic vocal before the screaming starts, you'll hear a buttload of compression when the screaming begins. If you get to 6:1 compression, you have SOMETIME dialed in wrong, or you're using the compressor to fix a different problem entirely, like keeping a vocal FLAT to compete with an overly loud guitar amp. I hope this helps!