Dumping ITB beats through pres

[killahertz]

Does anyone arrange an entire beat in a DAW and then re-track it throught pres before the mix?

[Stitch333]

Originally Posted by killahertz

Does anyone arrange an entire beat in a DAW and then re-track it throught pres before the mix?

I dump through the pres to the DAW. That way the mix tracks have character to them before you start mixing. + they'll sit in an ITB mix better

[demonfuzz]

I would go Pre's --> DAW

[killahertz]

I composed the beat entirely in Logic so I have to dump out to goto preamps.

[boodah]

Originally Posted by Stitch333

I dump through the pres to the DAW. That way the mix tracks have character to them before you start mixing. + they'll sit in an ITB mix better

I wondered the same thing. However, what about latency? Is it a factor?

[killahertz]

Originally Posted by boodah

I wondered the same thing. However, what about latency? Is it a factor?

it should be if you dump all the tracks, because they will all have the same latency

[khameln]

the answer to latency is click + drag... yes A/D does incur a small bit of latency, but it only takes a couple of seconds to nudge tracks back a bit to where they should be.

[brian_delizza]

Originally Posted by killahertz

Does anyone arrange an entire beat in a DAW and then re-track it throught pres before the mix?

yup.

[PhonoquO]

you won't benefit much from this unless you have good d/a a/d.

[killahertz]

Originally Posted by PhonoquO

you won't benefit much from this unless you have good d/a a/d.

aurora clocked to big ben should handle it! I guess this is just something I have to try i was just looking for some compelling testimony to get over my patch bay laziness..

[The Marrvel]

Originally Posted by PhonoquO

you won't benefit much from this unless you have good d/a a/d.

Let's say that I had great convertors, why would I want to do this?

[PhonoquO]

if you've got a decent pres, they have the effect of warming up the sound and softening transients, and they will impart some color on the digital sound they are fed. I've tried this and it definitely works. I think it's worth the effort once you have committed your virtual instruments to audio.

[upscaps]

Originally Posted by PhonoquO

you won't benefit much from this unless you have good d/a a/d.

for hip hop i prefer darker converters. the brightness and thinness of softsynths will benefit from that (reason people love sp1200 and s950 sound) and say, neve preamps.

[The Marrvel]

Originally Posted by PhonoquO

if you've got a decent pres, they have the effect of warming up the sound and softening transients, and they will impart some color on the digital sound they are fed. I've tried this and it definitely works. I think it's worth the effort once you have committed your virtual instruments to audio.

Interesting, I have an API preamp. I'll run some virtual tracks through there and see if I notice a preferable difference.

[killahertz]

if we were mega producers this is the point where we'd tell the assistant to track that and we'll be back in a hour to mix it

[jikky]

Hey I have a tascam fw1082, mpc1000, and softsynths running in my system. I've been thinking hard about getting the rme fireface 400 to add to my system. I don't do vocals yet, just beats. I may be able to knock out 2 birds with one stone by using the pres on the rme to retrack the softsynths and adding a mic for vocals. Thinking about a sm7 and sm57 to go thru the pres on the fireface. What do you guys think?

[ShaneFontane]

all my mpc samples were tracked through my API as well as my Moog synth... def makes a difference, especially once you start laying the tracks on... i love my drum samples now... unique to me and the moog sounds wonderful tracked through it...

[The Marrvel]

Originally Posted by ShaneFontane

all my mpc samples were tracked through my API as well as my Moog synth... def makes a difference, especially once you start laying the tracks on... i love my drum samples now... unique to me and the moog sounds wonderful tracked through it...

Ok, so it makes a lot of sense to run virtual instruments out of my converters through the API and back in...

My drums aren't computer generated, so would it make sense to do this to those samples as well? I sample my drums mostly from CD reissues of older albums and sometimes vinyl. Technically, the CD drums are sampled ITB and sound exactly how they were tracked at the original studio. Should I leave these alone or run them through the API as well?

[dussel]

Originally Posted by jikkyboy11

Hey I have a tascam fw1082, mpc1000, and softsynths running in my system. I've been thinking hard about getting the rme fireface 400 to add to my system. I don't do vocals yet, just beats. I may be able to knock out 2 birds with one stone by using the pres on the rme to retrack the softsynths and adding a mic for vocals. Thinking about a sm7 and sm57 to go thru the pres on the fireface. What do you guys think?

Hi Jikkyboy,

You should not do that. Just recently I did a double blind listening of the fireface converters DA-AD vs. the original file and there's no way the preamps of this unit (which are not exactly high-end) are going to make enough difference to justify the loss you get from the conversion. If you want to do this you should get one or several very good, colored preamps that will add something to your sound rather than compromising it.

For the vocals both the 57 and the sm7 are good mics to have, but they would profit from a good preamp too :-).

best
Dussel

[usblink11]

Is there a difference between using the mpc hardware then go to the pre, then go in the DAW..... than taking the exact same sample sound from DAW logic sampler, out to pre, and the back in?

MPC -->preamp---> apogee 800 ---> logic

OR

logic mpc sample ---> apogee 800 --> preamp ---> apogee 800 ----> logic

is there a big difference? I dont have the mpc hardware but i do have mpc samples... if it is a huge difference then i will probably get the mpc. I heard because the mpc is an actual hardware gear it sounds better then the samples

[dussel]

Originally Posted by usblink11

Is there a difference between using the mpc hardware then go to the pre, then go in the DAW..... than taking the exact same sample sound from DAW logic sampler, out to pre, and the back in?

MPC -->preamp---> apogee 800 ---> logic

OR

logic mpc sample ---> apogee 800 --> preamp ---> apogee 800 ----> logic

is there a big difference? I dont have the mpc hardware but i do have mpc samples... if it is a huge difference then i will probably get the mpc. I heard because the mpc is an actual hardware gear it sounds better then the samples

This depends on what mpc you are talking about. For the modern ones I would guess that the Apogee converters are a tad better and use those, for the old ones like mpc60 you get a signature sound from the converters that can be nice for some stuff. I use my sp1200 for this sometimes, works great for Snares, Claps or 808 type kicks for example.

best
Dussel

[jikky]

Originally Posted by dussel

Hi Jikkyboy,

You should not do that. Just recently I did a double blind listening of the fireface converters DA-AD vs. the original file and there's no way the preamps of this unit (which are not exactly high-end) are going to make enough difference to justify the loss you get from the conversion. If you want to do this you should get one or several very good, colored preamps that will add something to your sound rather than compromising it.

For the vocals both the 57 and the sm7 are good mics to have, but they would profit from a good preamp too :-).

best
Dussel

Well I was looking at the fireface for the low latency and solid drivers. i really don't have anything else in mind as far as an audio interface. I was going to combo the sm57, sm7, and rme fireface 400 with a brand spanking new intel core 2 duo E6600 computer. Are there any plugins that can add color or life? I've read a few comments on the psp vintage warmer, but I haven't actually seen this myself. Maybe I should rethink my approach. My plan is to do mixtapes for locals in the Houston area and drop beats/mix songs as they come.

[dussel]

Originally Posted by jikkyboy11

Well I was looking at the fireface for the low latency and solid drivers. i really don't have anything else in mind as far as an audio interface. I was going to combo the sm57, sm7, and rme fireface 400 with a brand spanking new intel core 2 duo E6600 computer. Are there any plugins that can add color or life? I've read a few comments on the psp vintage warmer, but I haven't actually seen this myself. Maybe I should rethink my approach. My plan is to do mixtapes for locals in the Houston area and drop beats/mix songs as they come.

Don't get me wrong I am not saying the fireface is a bad interface, its just "only" an interface and it's preamps do probably not play in the league of dedicated preamps. I use a RME card myself, the HDSP 9652. The drivers are great, I would say if you use a PC the RME stuff is as good as it gets. For the converters and preamps I use other brands though. (Although some guys here say they like the RME converters I would go for Mytek or Apogee or something in that league if you can afford it. The preamp is definitely much more important!)

Plugins are good and steadily get better but there is some stuff that cannot be done ITB so far IMHO. Adding the sound of a good tranny to your Synth is one of those things. I do believe in Hardware units for that. On the other hand there is a lot of top cats who get great results with pure ITB systems. You have to find your own way.

best
Dussel

[sergioelectro]

Has everyone tried to send his beats made in the DAW to a Chandler Germanium pre , and then back in the box ?
how was the result ?

Sergio

[jikky]

Originally Posted by dussel

Don't get me wrong I am not saying the fireface is a bad interface, its just "only" an interface and it's preamps do probably not play in the league of dedicated preamps. I use a RME card myself, the HDSP 9652. The drivers are great, I would say if you use a PC the RME stuff is as good as it gets. For the converters and preamps I use other brands though. (Although some guys here say they like the RME converters I would go for Mytek or Apogee or something in that league if you can afford it. The preamp is definitely much more important!)

Plugins are good and steadily get better but there is some stuff that cannot be done ITB so far IMHO. Adding the sound of a good tranny to your Synth is one of those things. I do believe in Hardware units for that. On the other hand there is a lot of top cats who get great results with pure ITB systems. You have to find your own way.

best
Dussel

I wanna go ITB all the way, but it'll just take experimentation and actually trying things out. I can't afford Mytek or Apogee and have only heard about them, but one day..... oh one day..... it'll be mine or something even better. Preciate tha knowledge. I'm going to do a lil more research on the RME. Imay have other options.

[PhonoquO]

another option might be to mess with the waves q-clone stuff. I downloaded some free SSL X-logic strip impulses that included a flat one, and i tried applying that flat impulse on a bunch of audio tracks, it definitely adds something nice. I think there are other impulses around now as well from pres like the 512 api.

[jikky]

Originally Posted by PhonoquO

another option might be to mess with the waves q-clone stuff. I downloaded some free SSL X-logic strip impulses that included a flat one, and i tried applying that flat impulse on a bunch of audio tracks, it definitely adds something nice. I think there are other impulses around now as well from pres like the 512 api.

I'm a lil confused as to what you're talking about. Can you explain a lil bit more. What do you mean "impulses"?

[The Marrvel]

When re-tracking through a preamp, what do you guys do with the preamp gain? I'm assuming that you track instruments back in at the same volume level in which they came out?

[PhonoquO]

Originally Posted by jikkyboy11

I'm a lil confused as to what you're talking about. Can you explain a lil bit more. What do you mean "impulses"?

just google it: impulse/response

it's just a capture of an acoustic signature

[jikky]

Originally Posted by PhonoquO

just google it: impulse/response

it's just a capture of an acoustic signature

will do