playing live hi-hat to programmed beats

Arka · 2nd August 2006

Hi!

Been messing around, playing live hi-hat to programmed beats to obtain a more live feel, musically its dope, but the sound is pretty much tin-canny crap.

I guess its mostly due to our cheap hi-hat. What size and type of hi-hat would you recommend for an organic vintage 70´s soul hi-hat sound suitable for hiphop beats? What price range do you have to be in to get a hat that records nicely? And what about miking? Favorite mics?

peace /Arka

Methlab · 2nd August 2006

why not use samples and lay them out on pads and play them live that way?

Steamy Williams · 2nd August 2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arka

What size and type of hi-hat would you recommend for an organic vintage 70´s soul hi-hat sound suitable for hiphop beats? What price range do you have to be in to get a hat that records nicely?

I would like to know this too.

RaGe · 2nd August 2006

keep in mind that much of the typical HH sound comes from the overhead mics
so mic'ing just the HH with one mono mic may not give you the sound you're after

that and better cymbals of course

Isle of Weight · 2nd August 2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steamy Williams

I would like to know this too.

I agree, from R&B to 70's Rock to Disco, I've always felt like the high hats had a very "sweet?" sound to it. Just my opinion....

anyone else?

AA.

Fredrik · 2nd August 2006

I might be wrong here but isnt the typical breakbeat high hat sound to a degree a result of heavy saturation, maybe even several bounces on tape? To me what makes abreak special apart from the groove is the sound, just micing a hihat straight to the soundcard will be to clean, thats my guess.

firby · 2nd August 2006

Zildjian new beats or old zildjian Avedis. somewhere around 80-140 .

Casanova · 2nd August 2006

Get BFD Jazz and Funk.

kennyd03 · 2nd August 2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by adamatic

If you are close micing the hihat try micing it from further back or if you have a full kit setup try getting a decent overall drum sound and make the bleed from the rest of the mics work for you.

I second this.

I've recorded just hi hats before to do exactly what you are talking about. So much groove can come from that. I would also try to get hats that have A LOT of character, and of course, have a player who can get a variety of sounds out of them and incorporate that into the groove.

-Kenny D

PhonoquO · 2nd August 2006

i think you'll have a hard time no matter what hihats you use, unless you got some vintage style preamp, compressor and tape and nice stereo overheads. For the amount of effort, i would just get a nice input pad that u can use sticks on with a choke pedal (midi) and play some good samples.

Arka · 3rd August 2006

ok, I´m not expecting a 60´s open room breakbeat sound, but still I know for sure that this is what I want to do. I´ve been messing around with samples a bunch, and its really hard to get to the level of expression you get with a real hi-hat. The little ghost notes, the subtle variations of pedal pressure and how the stick hits...

The Zildjian A range hi-hats seems to be nice, any other tips?

peace /Arka

PhonoquO · 6th August 2006

my friend always plays zildgian "K" s, they sound really nice.

NeoVXR · 7th August 2006

in case no analog equipment is available beyond the mic and the brass,
perhaps a de-esser, a denoiser (try different frequencies and Q values, use it also for its FFT artefacts), a saturation emulator, an exciter and what else might help!
I would try a parallel "mult" of these also.
remember, a hihat on vinyl has seen much audio culture and climbed many steps from the mic until the home speaker cabinet...

Arka · 8th August 2006

thanks for all the replies...

We had a drummer in today who played various percussion instruments on a bunch of beats. He brought his own hi-hats, thinner than ours, and we successfully laid down some hi-hat tracks. With one beat in particular the result was really nice, we ran the hi-hat through Amplitube for a very gritty sound that fitted nicely with the track. I´ll try to post an example of this...

peace /Arka

Igotsoul4u · 8th August 2006

for recording purposes you should get a nice thin and smaller pair of hats. You can make smaller hats sound bigger but you cannot make bigger hats sound smaller. I really like 13" hats that are fairly dry. Check out the zildjian K or A series.

2nd August 2006	#1
Arka Gear nut Joined: Mar 2004 Location: Sundsvall, Sweden Posts: 92 Thread Starter	playing live hi-hat to programmed beats Hi! Been messing around, playing live hi-hat to programmed beats to obtain a more live feel, musically its dope, but the sound is pretty much tin-canny crap. I guess its mostly due to our cheap hi-hat. What size and type of hi-hat would you recommend for an organic vintage 70´s soul hi-hat sound suitable for hiphop beats? What price range do you have to be in to get a hat that records nicely? And what about miking? Favorite mics? peace /Arka

2nd August 2006	#2
Methlab Lives for gear Joined: Jul 2004 Location: Orlando Posts: 3,686	why not use samples and lay them out on pads and play them live that way? __________________ Professionally played Basslines for $35 a Track. www.professionalbassguitar.com

7th August 2006	#13
NeoVXR Lives for gear Joined: Apr 2004 Posts: 1,230	in case no analog equipment is available beyond the mic and the brass, perhaps a de-esser, a denoiser (try different frequencies and Q values, use it also for its FFT artefacts), a saturation emulator, an exciter and what else might help! I would try a parallel "mult" of these also. remember, a hihat on vinyl has seen much audio culture and climbed many steps from the mic until the home speaker cabinet... __________________ sorry 4 poor english

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2nd August 2006	#4
RaGe Gear maniac Joined: Dec 2002 Location: Planet Earth Posts: 181	keep in mind that much of the typical HH sound comes from the overhead mics so mic'ing just the HH with one mono mic may not give you the sound you're after that and better cymbals of course

2nd August 2006	#6
Fredrik Lives for gear Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 2,228	I might be wrong here but isnt the typical breakbeat high hat sound to a degree a result of heavy saturation, maybe even several bounces on tape? To me what makes abreak special apart from the groove is the sound, just micing a hihat straight to the soundcard will be to clean, thats my guess.

2nd August 2006	#7
firby Lives for gear Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,491	Zildjian new beats or old zildjian Avedis. somewhere around 80-140 .

2nd August 2006	#8
Casanova Gear interested Joined: Feb 2006 Posts: 7	Get BFD Jazz and Funk.

2nd August 2006	#10
PhonoquO Lives for gear Joined: Nov 2005 Location: North of Toronto Posts: 1,172	i think you'll have a hard time no matter what hihats you use, unless you got some vintage style preamp, compressor and tape and nice stereo overheads. For the amount of effort, i would just get a nice input pad that u can use sticks on with a choke pedal (midi) and play some good samples.

3rd August 2006	#11
Arka Gear nut Joined: Mar 2004 Location: Sundsvall, Sweden Posts: 92 Thread Starter	ok, I´m not expecting a 60´s open room breakbeat sound, but still I know for sure that this is what I want to do. I´ve been messing around with samples a bunch, and its really hard to get to the level of expression you get with a real hi-hat. The little ghost notes, the subtle variations of pedal pressure and how the stick hits... The Zildjian A range hi-hats seems to be nice, any other tips? peace /Arka

6th August 2006	#12
PhonoquO Lives for gear Joined: Nov 2005 Location: North of Toronto Posts: 1,172	my friend always plays zildgian "K" s, they sound really nice.

8th August 2006	#14
Arka Gear nut Joined: Mar 2004 Location: Sundsvall, Sweden Posts: 92 Thread Starter	thanks for all the replies... We had a drummer in today who played various percussion instruments on a bunch of beats. He brought his own hi-hats, thinner than ours, and we successfully laid down some hi-hat tracks. With one beat in particular the result was really nice, we ran the hi-hat through Amplitube for a very gritty sound that fitted nicely with the track. I´ll try to post an example of this... peace /Arka

8th August 2006	#15
Igotsoul4u Lives for gear Joined: Mar 2005 Location: New York, NY Posts: 2,845	for recording purposes you should get a nice thin and smaller pair of hats. You can make smaller hats sound bigger but you cannot make bigger hats sound smaller. I really like 13" hats that are fairly dry. Check out the zildjian K or A series.