Starting out. APC40+Ableton for Jamie XX?

[xanax]

Starting out & Jamie XX shouldn't really be in the same sentence lol..but ok.. i think he uses 2 MPC's, but regardless of the tool the most important thing in sampled based production is...the samples. Jamie XX like a lot of producers started out as a DJ listening & collecting records. it's a great pathway to learn what blends together, pitching, timing... you may be a trained musician, and that helps but doesn't necessarily translate to sample based music production. basically you gotta experiment, fwiw i'm not a fan of ableton for actual production (much prefer the MPC) it is however ideally suited for live performances (as it's name indicates ) oh and try and do your own thing and not copy others, there's nothing more annoying to listen then a copy cat imo (especially in "new" genres like post-dubstep etc)

[mikebailey92]

I've seen Jamie XX use an MPC 500 a few times for live performances. I suppose there's no reason you couldn't use Ableton and an APC though.

[primemeat64]

Originally Posted by xanax

Starting out & Jamie XX shouldn't really be in the same sentence lol..but ok.. i think he uses 2 MPC's, but regardless of the tool the most important thing in sampled based production is...the samples. Jamie XX like a lot of producers started out as a DJ listening & collecting records. it's a great pathway to learn what blends together, pitching, timing... you may be a trained musician, and that helps but doesn't necessarily translate to sample based music production. basically you gotta experiment, fwiw i'm not a fan of ableton for actual production (much prefer the MPC) it is however ideally suited for live performances (as it's name indicates ) oh and try and do your own thing and not copy others, there's nothing more annoying to listen then a copy cat imo (especially in "new" genres like post-dubstep etc)

Thanks to both of you for the replies. I know Jamie has used MPC500's live but wasn't sure what kind of thing he was doing to compose in the first place although I know a ton of hip hop beats that I like have also been made on MPCs.

I'm not going to carbon-copy Jamie XX, I have a wealth of influences across many genres and whatever I do, I'm sure it'll have my own flavour to it. I do, however, want to know the kind of techniques used to make music, mixes and remixes in the style of people I admire - much like I learn guitar licks or aim for guitar tones based on guitar music that I like but will write my own stuff, you know?

So, I suppose, I want to know if it'd be a good idea for me to invest in something like Ableton + Maschine or Ableton + APC40 and maybe Traktor. I'd like to be able to do a combination of things:

1) Learn to use a setup like an APC40 + Traktor to DJ in the regular sense of playing one track and mixing into the next. Eventually progressing into more advanced effects use, looping on the fly, remixing to some extent on the fly.

2) Learn to use some kind of controller + software for the "making beats" approach to composition. This includes making hip hop plus Jamie XX type stuff.

Any thoughts?

[raffael77]

@primemeat64

Jamie XX is a dope producer, this is the true art form of Dubstep. I think he detuned te vocal because i ttryed it out but be gentle with it. It works great on female vocals.

If you like this style of production you should check out more music. I'll give you a few links.

This guy called Burial and is a true pioneer in this form of vocal style and beats.

Burial - Archangel - YouTube

Burial - Etched Headplate - YouTube

Burial - Fostercare (HQ) - YouTube

[xanax]

Originally Posted by primemeat64

I'm not going to carbon-copy Jamie XX, I have a wealth of influences across many genres and whatever I do, I'm sure it'll have my own flavour to it. I do, however, want to know the kind of techniques used to make music, mixes and remixes in the style of people I admire - much like I learn guitar licks or aim for guitar tones based on guitar music that I like but will write my own stuff, you know?

i hear you, but it isn't really comparable to guitar licks/tones, the guitar is a timeless instrument used for more then 70 years... sampling trends like the cut up pitched up/down vocals used in a lot of burial type dubstep are a lot more short-lived imo (basically it's already been done to death) nothing wrong in learning how to do it though i guess.. just warning you, i had a quick listen & your stuff sounds dangerously close in an inferior type way (sorry just trying to be honest). now to be constructive about your questions on tools, all i can say is the MPC is great and imo superior to ableton for music composition as it feels like it's own instrument, it also has essential tools to what you might be after: the sampler allows chopping slices, mapping out pitch on 16 levels, note repeat for quantized stutter effects etc etc.. others will say all that is possible in ableton but not even 1% as close in intuivity which is what i find is important in a tool/instrument..

[primemeat64]

@raffael77

Thanks man, Burial's stuff is cool. I'm also a fan of SBTRKT, James Blake and a bunch of others across ever differing genres (e.g. the big man - Aphex Twin).

Originally Posted by xanax

i hear you, but it isn't really comparable to guitar licks/tones, the guitar is a timeless instrument used for more then 70 years... sampling trends like the cut up pitched up/down vocals used in a lot of burial type dubstep are a lot more short-lived imo (basically it's already been done to death) nothing wrong in learning how to do it though i guess.. just warning you, i had a quick listen & your stuff sounds dangerously close in an inferior type way (sorry just trying to be honest). now to be constructive about your questions on tools, all i can say is the MPC is great and imo superior to ableton for music composition as it feels like it's own instrument, it also has essential tools to what you might be after: the sampler allows chopping slices, mapping out pitch on 16 levels, note repeat for quantized stutter effects etc etc.. others will say all that is possible in ableton but not even 1% as close in intuivity which is what i find is important in a tool/instrument..

Hey man, thanks for the input. Don't sweat the critique of those tracks I did with my sis, I can't even explain the limitations we were working with that week!

Whether a DAW or an MPC or whatever can be compared to guitar is room for a whole different debate - personally I feel that both are equally valid instruments and will be considered so in the future - but let's save that for another thread ;0

Ok, so for the time being, I'm going to throw a standalone MPC into the mix as an option... I'll do a bunch of additional youtube watching and forum reading and see where I start netting out...

[raffael77]

Me to i like James Blake, Volor Vlex, Mount Kimbie and others, Nice to see that more people like good music today, you don't see that often. You should check out Hyperdub label and Dark Clover records (bandcamp).

[CharlesEdward]

Ableton + an APC40 would be great start and a great ending. MPC is for fanboys.

[Thetron]

Originally Posted by CharlesEdward

MPC is for fanboys.

are you ****ing insane? right thats it, i'm putting everything in my life on hold to repeatedly tell you, youre wrong.

[CharlesEdward]

Originally Posted by Thetron

are you ****ing insane? right thats it, i'm putting everything in my life on hold to repeatedly tell you, youre wrong.

If that makes you feel better about yourself, Ok then.

[mat1]

Jamie xx Creators Project Interview | ABEANO

Logic and computers according this interview

[KT1]

Originally Posted by Thetron

are you ****ing insane? right thats it, i'm putting everything in my life on hold to repeatedly tell you, youre wrong.

Actually I think he has a point. The APC/Live combo is absolutely perfect for this type of music. Not because it 'has a sound' but because the workflow in-line with effect racks is optimal for real-time movement. That could be an effect/modulation or playback of the source in question.

MPC's are great! I have owned a few. I can absolutely appreciate the value and the attraction. That being said - I dont care how competent you are with one - Live/APC combo will allow for significantly better functionality and workflow and the result is not comparable.

-- In other words - and ill say this again and again. You can make whatever music you like with absoluetly anything!!

-- The difference is in the workflow and some basic tools. But beyond that it really is the individual.

Raffael I like you but you do make me laugh with a lot of your comments . No disrespect but you act like you are the only person to have heard something as commercial as Burial or James Blake :D. I'm from the UK where a lot of this genre stems. There is so much talent on this little Island it's overwhelming.

The sound is constantly evolving. People like James use Ableton / NORD stage Pianos (any decent Piano sound) and a prophet 8 keyboard. Almost the entire album was produced with those instruments. Im basing this on the number of performances i have seen. That coupled with a very experinmental/electronic sound + JB is just cray talented like it or not = the music. It definately has nothing to do with an MPC or some software.

--

What you need to ask yourself OP is this. What is the source material? In other words does it sound like samples/a mix of/ what about the sounds/effects. Dont focus on the songs or style. Just focus on the energy and vibe. Then bring your musicality to it.

You may not create that exact sound but you WILL learn something and you WILL create something you like.

Good luck.

[primemeat64]

My current thoughts:

Use touchAble on my girlfriend's iPad to kinda semi mimic the APC40 experience (yes, I know it's not tactile or 100% the same). Also thinking of getting a padkontrol for some nice, touch-sensitive pads for percussion and also for MPC style chopping. Not sure on where I should look for killer samples, maybe I just do it the old school way and start digging through records to find some things, make some things from scratch and kinda see what happens.... hmm.