MPC REN Emulator review

[Fireworks]

Originally Posted by skiroy

Look there is a 74 page forum about the REN,most of which is insults and bickering.

I simply wanted to ask anyone who has actually tried the REN and has owned an MPC 3000 or SP 1200 if the Emulations are accurate. And how do they compare to other emulations plugs and Maschines emulations.

I dont care about features or nothing like that. I have tried EVERY sampler including a VP-9000. I ended up with the MPC 1000 for cleaner sounding stuff and the MPC 3K for that thick sound. But the 3K is tough for chopping coming from the PC world. It would be nice to trade both in for something with an easier workflow,but I am one that will absolutely not compromise the sound. I will not compromise sound for convenience.

Just use science and the answer is no. The key word is emulation. I am sure its not even close at least with machine it wasn't.

Advise. Buy a asrx bro. Sounds better than any mpc and easy as hell to chop.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Gearslutz App

[Fireworks]

Originally Posted by Fireworks

Just use science and the answer is no. The key word is emulation. I am sure its not even close at least with machine it wasn't.

. Buy a asrx bro. Sounds better than any mpc and easy as hell to chop.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Gearslutz App

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Gearslutz App

[DAH]

Originally Posted by Fireworks

Just use science and the answer is no. The key word is emulation. I am sure its not even close at least with machine it wasn't.

Advise. Buy a asrx bro. Sounds better than any mpc and easy as hell to chop.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Gearslutz App

Is the seq as tight as the 3k?

[ForWerd]

I kicked off the "SP1200 vs Maschine emulation" thread a while back. I provided audio examples as well. I may do the same with the Ren. But I can tell you, IN MY OPINION, that Maschine comes closer to the SP1200 sound. The main thing that NI nailed on their version of the emulation was the "ring" effect. This can especially be heard on a kick. Both emulations do the zippery decay thing pretty well. As much as I'm loving the Ren right now. I'm gonna have to give the emulations to NI. Besides I have an S-950 and an Emax 1 rack so no emulations are really necessary here.

[Fireworks]

Originally Posted by DAH

Is the seq as tight as the 3k?

No way my friend. The asrx is owned by me for its sound, Fx and filters. I do make beats in the X from time to time because to me its fun but I still have a mpc as my workhorse. Trust me the X is the biz

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Gearslutz App

[Goa-Dubs]

Originally Posted by DAH

Is the seq as tight as the 3k?

The asrx had a very good,complex sequencer that will give you an original feel and result (% and different groove settings as well as swing ect) .Its a bit fiddly and glitches sometimes(my experience after owning a few)when tweaking patterns and changing tracks.It does not sound as blocky as the mpc.Tight-dunno....it is worth testing one for yourself.The thing is not many people have investigated deeply by what ive read.Its far more advanced than the asr10 tho.
12 year old exp- Wolfmoon by Dryad-66 on SoundCloud - Create, record and share your sounds for free

now back to the REN....]

[Fireworks]

Originally Posted by Goa-Dubs

The asrx had a very good,complex sequencer that will give you an original feel and result (% and different groove settings as well as swing ect) .Its a bit fiddly and glitches sometimes(my experience after owning a few)when tweaking patterns and changing tracks.It does not sound as blocky as the mpc.Tight-dunno....it is worth testing one for yourself.The thing is not many people have investigated deeply by what ive read.Its far more advanced than the asr10 tho.
12 year old exp- Wolfmoon by Dryad-66 on SoundCloud - Create, record and share your sounds for free

now back to the REN....]

Its NOT more advanced then the asr-10

[xanax]

i don't wanna re-up the whole swing debate, but the ASR-X is known to have a glitchy sequencer and perhaps loose feel (due to jittery clock or whatever) it's light years away from the rock solid MPC sequencer & clock BUT the technical flaws of the ASR sequencer might also give it it's ubiquitous groove (similarly to the SP1200 swing recently discussed). i can certainly feel the looseness when listening to old rza material made on the EPS/ASR sequencers & at the prices they are going for today it might be worthy to further investigate..

concerning OP's question, i am also curious how Ren's 3K circuitry compares to the actual 3K, especially the filters (i hear Ren has a filter type modeled on the 3Ks?) maschine's emulation was definitely a let down in the filter department..

[Nahuel]

Originally Posted by xanax

maschine's emulation was definitely a let down in the filter department..

LOL

mpc60: no filter, sp1200 a very limited envelope controlled filter that can be used to shorten a kik drum but not much more, regardeless of it's sonic caracteristics that filter is probably the most useless lpf I've ever used...


You sound like you never used a 60 or a 1200.

The NI filtered 1200 modes dont behave like a 1200, that's a fact, but in my opinion these are far more useable that what was available on the real deal.

[xanax]

i never said the 60 had a filter, the 3000 however does and that's what i was asking about, re-read my post carefully.. concerning the SP filtering, i strongly disagree but depending on your SP revision model the filters go from weak to strong (SSM) i know i've had a few SP's inn my life..

btw i currently own both the 60 & 1200 (use them daily as well)

[Nahuel]

The 1200 have an enveloppe controlled filter that is barely useable and a few oututs have fixed cutoff filters that have no special character at all...the character of the 1200 is it's pitch shifting.

I'm not talking about your questions about the 3k I talk about the statement I quoted.

[xanax]

Originally Posted by Nahuel

The 1200 have an enveloppe controlled filter that is barely useable and a few oututs have fixed cutoff filters that have no special character at all...the character of the 1200 is it's pitch shifting.

wrong..but i guess it's subjective, one man's junk is another man's treasure. i personally use and love the 1200's filtering, my current model with the SSM is downright violent on some outputs..

Originally Posted by Nahuel

I'm not talking about your questions about the 3k I talk about the statement I quoted.

..and that was about the 1200 not the 60

[Nahuel]

Originally Posted by xanax

wrong..but i guess it's subjective, one man's junk is another man's treasure. i personally use and love the 1200's filtering, my current model with the SSM is downright violent on some outputs..

Come on, lol

Originally Posted by xanax

..and that was about the 1200 not the 60

wtf is this? du poulet? t'est magnifique mec.

Originally Posted by xanax

i never said the 60 had a filter, the 3000 however does and that's what i was asking about

btw your statement was general, sorry to remind what we were talking about: one barely useable envelope filter and two plain fixed cutoff filters...

my point is that the most interesting feature in the 1200, it's aliasing, is very convincingly emulated by NI.

[xanax]

et toi t'est un peu lent a comprendre... 2 different things were being referenced here:
the 1200 emulation on maschine, the 3K emulation on REN

[Nahuel]

Originally Posted by xanax

et toi t'est un peu lent a comprendre... 2 different things were being referenced here:
the 1200 emulation on maschine, the 3K emulation on REN

orly? and I'm a bit slow right?

lol...

whatever

[xanax]

what's so hard to understand? oh i get it.. you're a maschine fanboi...

fwiw, the aliasing is not the SP's most interesting feature, any bit-reduction plugin can get close to it.. the ad/da converters, the analog filters, general workflow and let's not forget the unique swing is what makes me keep mine..

[Nahuel]

Originally Posted by xanax

what's so hard to understand? oh i get it.. you're a maschine fanboi...

fwiw, the aliasing is not the SP's most interesting feature, any bit-reduction plugin can get close to it.. the ad/da converters, the analog filters, general workflow and let's not forget the unique swing is what makes me keep mine..

Yea I'm such a fanboi that I'm the first to tell that it seq is lacking so much that I use it as a pad controller for Ableton...


But I can tell BS when I see it.

Read you post, you're asking a question about the 3k emu and opposing it to the filter emus of something emulating a 60 and a 1200...

any bit reduction plugin can emulate the alisaing from the pitch shifting of a 1200? now that's funny...

sorry dude but I cant keep talking seriousely with you, let's leave it at that.

[szf]

ssm filters... no special character?... blasphemy. seriously, are minimoog filters also crap?
You're free to your opinion of course, but if you do own an sp, sell it to someone who appreciates it's intricacies.

[mp3]

Originally Posted by Fireworks

Its NOT more advanced then the asr-10

It's sequencer is.

[Nahuel]

Originally Posted by szf

ssm filters... no special character?... blasphemy. seriously, are minimoog filters also crap?
You're free to your opinion of course, but if you do own an sp, sell it to someone who appreciates it's intricacies.

LOL...please explain to me how you use the so special ssm filter and it's character and how in the hell it have somehting to do with a minimoog filter.

I'm down for a good laught.

[Goa-Dubs]

Originally Posted by Fireworks

Its NOT more advanced then the asr-10

It's sequencer is.

Thats right...more advanced sequencer.Great fun for step programming too.Which is best only you can tell.

[xanax]

Originally Posted by szf

ssm filters... no special character?... blasphemy. seriously, are minimoog filters also crap?
You're free to your opinion of course, but if you do own an sp, sell it to someone who appreciates it's intricacies.

don't waste your time, he discovered the SP last week with Maschine..

Originally Posted by Nahuel

LOL...please explain to me how you use the so special ssm filter and it's character and how in the hell it have somehting to do with a minimoog filter.

SP-1200 uses SSM2040's, they're just considered some of the best filters ever second to moog... they equipped legendary analog instruments such as Prophet 5 rev2, Korg poly's, Voyetra 8...list goes on

[szf]

Originally Posted by Nahuel

LOL...please explain to me how you use the so special ssm filter and it's character and how in the hell it have somehting to do with a minimoog filter.

I'm down for a good laught.

Maybe you should do some research before acting like you know anything.
Anyone that level of ignorant should be embarrassed to have such a loud forum voice.

The sp12/1200 have ssm2044 chips, which where updated versions (although not as good) of ssm2040's ala prophet rev1/2... considered by some to be the best filter ever.
The 2040 was basically a moog filter on a chip..

2040:
additional_schemos.html

SSM2040 Style 4 pole Filter
In my opinion, the SSM2040 was the best filter chip ever produced.

2044:
PolySix also used these, another synth with a highly regarded filter that is considered very warm.. You can research all the other gear that used these in your own time.

show me some classic ssm?

[mp3]

Yeah the ssm filter chips are probably the best chip based filters. But the thing about the sp is that, in that machine, the filters were implemented in a static, non-resonant way.

[xanax]

^ true but there are still ways to use them effectively.. i also find that by assigning samples to different outputs and therefore filter settings, the resulting beat has an alive warm analog feel to it whereas when you use the digital emulations or bit reduction pugins, the mixed elements can sound harsh & clippy..

[szf]

I'm wondering if Nahuel ever sampled kicks hot into an sp and put it through the highly filtered tom outputs.. I've stuck boring synth kicks through it that lacked sub energy.. and got instant magic after they got the sp treatment.. same with snares, or putting music phrases through those outs.. which give you an cool auto filter sweep.

The fact the filters are not resonant and static is a good thing IMHO.. I've never liked resonance on drum sounds, the s900/950 filters are also not resonant, and yet people love those.. (I also never use resonance on drums in the emax)

I do agree that the transposition on the sp can't be emulated, even the emax used a different/more advanced algorithm which makes it less crazy (ringing sound is lost somewhat comp to sp12)... although still grittier than most other samplers.

[mp3]

On the emax I used to have, I used the resonance to bring out the air and hi freq's of vinyl phrase samples. But i mostly agree, on drums the only time I use resonance is when I'm layering kicks.

[xanax]

Originally Posted by szf

I do agree that the transposition on the sp can't be emulated, even the emax used a different/more advanced algorithm which makes it less crazy (ringing sound is lost somewhat comp to sp12)... although still grittier than most other samplers.

we agree... it's just i feel a lot of SP n00bs think the SP "magic" is all about the artifacts when, for me at least, it is actually a small part of what makes the machine so unique..

[Nahuel]

Originally Posted by mp3

Yeah the ssm filter chips are probably the best chip based filters. But the thing about the sp is that, in that machine, the filters were implemented in a static, non-resonant way.

Thank you, there's also the envelope contolled lpf on outputs 1 and 2 that is actually the most intersting of the brunch and can get some use for shortening kik drums or stuff like that....

the other filters are super flat, all that talk about the chip and it being used on sequencial circuits synths is just that, talk...reality is that these filters are ultra limited in use and sound nothing special...

sp1200 fanatics tend to sing the praises of their drum machine like crazy when in fact it's a super limited and dated box with shitty pads, an a archaic sequencer, barely usable filters and an interesting aliasing when shifting.

If you're looking for a sampler that have a good filter get a sequencial circuits prophet 2002, now we're talking, that ish can auto oscilate.