Different pre's for hip-hop beats tracking.. worth it ?

hitsville · 2nd June 2006, 05:02 PM

Do you think the choice of preamps is that important when tracking mpc's and asr's and sp's.. ?

my experience.. so far I've been using a 1073DPA to do all my tracking. I love the 1073, although sometimes, on drums for example, I have the impression it squashes the transients too much for my taste, almost sounding like some compression. I might be tripping tho ! I've been thinking about buying an API type pre (BAE or API) to track my drums, but I'm not sure it will be worth it.

so my question is, do you think using different pre's to track samplers is unnecessary ?

Polyphony · 2nd June 2006, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hitsville

Do you think the choice of preamps is that important when tracking mpc's and asr's and sp's.. ?

my experience.. so far I've been using a 1073DPA to do all my tracking. I love the 1073, although sometimes, on drums for example, I have the impression it squashes the transients too much for my taste, almost sounding like some compression. I might be tripping tho ! I've been thinking about buying an API type pre (BAE or API) to track my drums, but I'm not sure it will be worth it.

so my question is, do you think using different pre's to track samplers is unnecessary ?

Using different pre's with different combinations of comps IS necessary....

The 1073 is a very open pre ment for close mic'ing....API would be good for something like a piano cause of its' mid range 'punchiness'.....1081 are tyght for drums....It all depends....you just got to hear it for yourself....

hope this helps,
lates,
Poly

hitsville · 2nd June 2006, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyphony

Using different pre's with different combinations of comps IS necessary....

The 1073 is a very open pre ment for close mic'ing....API would be good for something like a piano cause of its' mid range 'punchiness'.....1081 are tyght for drums....It all depends....you just got to hear it for yourself....

hope this helps,
lates,
Poly

thanks Poly, yes it does help but I was talking about tracking samplers though, not through mics. not sure if it really makes a difference ?

Polyphony · 2nd June 2006, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hitsville

thanks Poly, yes it does help but I was talking about tracking samplers though, not through mics. not sure if it really makes a difference ?

Yea I understood that....

Use them at line level ....

good luck.

Gduron · 2nd June 2006, 11:28 PM

you know... i've notice that too... I have a chandler ltd-1... but in my case i like the drums i get from it... nice and round.. and not much compression needed... sorry couldn't help...hey at least your post is going to be on top of the forum

hitsville · 3rd June 2006, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gduron

you know... i've notice that too... I have a chandler ltd-1... but in my case i like the drums i get from it... nice and round.. and not much compression needed... sorry couldn't help...hey at least your post is going to be on top of the forum

hooold on, nah it's not that I don't like the drums I'm getting from the 1073.. it's just that sometimes I wish i had another flavor.. but I don't know how big the difference will be if i switch to, say api's

kingneeraj · 3rd June 2006, 12:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hitsville

hooold on, nah it's not that I don't like the drums I'm getting from the 1073.. it's just that sometimes I wish i had another flavor.. but I don't know how big the difference will be if i switch to, say api's

Most of the big hip-hop producers dont use any special pre-amps for tracking their MPC's and other modules.. they just use whatever board is in the room...whether its the SSL pre's or the Neve Pre's.. (i can only talk about these, since all the rooms i've worked in only have had these boards...)

**TonyBelmont** · 3rd June 2006, 01:49 AM

I like using a combination of Neve-style and API pre's for my synths, samplers and sound modules. I love using the different flavors for tracking.

nukmusic · 3rd June 2006, 03:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kingneeraj

Most of the big hip-hop producers dont use any special pre-amps for tracking their MPC's and other modules.. they just use whatever board is in the room...whether its the SSL pre's or the Neve Pre's.. (i can only talk about these, since all the rooms i've worked in only have had these boards...)

i learned the same thing.

Polyphony · 3rd June 2006, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TonyBelmont

I like using a combination of Neve-style and API pre's for my synths, samplers and sound modules. I love using the different flavors for tracking.

I'm with Tony on that......

Different flavors is what it's all about for the...................... SONG!!!

hitsville · 3rd June 2006, 05:33 PM

so, there are 2 differents schools i guess

H-Rezz · 4th June 2006, 06:07 AM

Yep , same here , a combination of Summit(fat and warm) , Isa 428(Hi Fi Clean) and Manley(Somewhere inbetween).

EHProductions · 5th June 2006, 06:26 AM

if the room permits I never use line In's....... I am a DI advocate ask Nuk...lol...... every sample should have its place... of origin in my opinion... In other words if its all motif and you line in the strings drums and whatever else all have a similar edge and color.........no,no,no..... I usually use countrymans and J48's and switch up certain sounds to either some 1272's API's or yes even a foucusrite 428..... gives diff tonalities and edges I like the 1272's for distorted transients,,, API's for warm strings etc.// the MPC is a beast of its own cause each sample more than likely comes from diff places anywayz so Ill DI through the an SSL 900J pre or something ... distorts nicely... but May use NEve etc depending..... The DI is cool because when you go line in on most pres it hits diff gain stage, Transformers etc... I like the added junk in the way for flavor reasons... Clean hip hop.... this aint no MC hammer album..... Just kiddin

-Eric

nukmusic · 5th June 2006, 06:35 AM

who's MC hammer ?

Disco D · 6th June 2006, 03:43 PM

i got tons of different favors now - neve, A Designs, OSA etc and it really makes a difference. one trick i have been doing is using 2 completely different brands and models of preamps on each side of a stereo synth output. this gives a cool subtle stereo field.

DSMrehearsal · 13th August 2007, 06:41 AM

ssl pre's sound great for drums IMO, Tab/tele valve pre's for synths, makie/yamaha for bass. All goes to studer tape machine.

mix-it-well · 13th August 2007, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hitsville

Do you think the choice of preamps is that important when tracking mpc's and asr's and sp's.. ?

my experience.. so far I've been using a 1073DPA to do all my tracking. I love the 1073, although sometimes, on drums for example, I have the impression it squashes the transients too much for my taste, almost sounding like some compression. I might be tripping tho ! I've been thinking about buying an API type pre (BAE or API) to track my drums, but I'm not sure it will be worth it.

so my question is, do you think using different pre's to track samplers is unnecessary ?

No.
Not for me.
That`s why EQs was invented ,isn`t it?
Sure it`s another sound yup ,but is it better ....I don`t think so ,it`s different and you may like that but is it worth the extra money and tracking-time?
Not for me.

There are a lot of classic records tracked on a console without different preamps ,so if they don`t needed it ,why should I?
But if it works for you that`s great ,try it.

deuc647 · 13th August 2007, 09:32 AM

I honestly think you have to choose a pre than can go with anything, API is one, and honestly i have never heard a neve but from all the posts it seems to not be the ideal choice of tracking certain things, its referred to as dark, API always seems to get the good cohesion, but different flavors are good, i have 8 sebatrons pres, i think that there is something special about the cohesion when you track with the same pre, like it just meshes together, it might be just me

khameln · 13th August 2007, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mix-it-well

No.
Not for me.
That`s why EQs was invented ,isn`t it?

No.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mix-it-well

There are a lot of classic records tracked on a console without different preamps ,so if they don`t needed it ,why should I?

That's because those classic records were tracked on consoles that HAD the classic preamps that these boxes are trying to emulate.

mix-it-well · 13th August 2007, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by khameln

No.

That's because those classic records were tracked on consoles that HAD the classic preamps that these boxes are trying to emulate.

So what?
They still only had one type of preamp ,and if you want to tell me EQs wasn't invented to change the sound then what the hell are they for?
delight me...

chris carter · 13th August 2007, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deuc647

i have 8 sebatrons pres, i think that there is something special about the cohesion when you track with the same pre, like it just meshes together, it might be just me

I think there is something to that. I just did that a little while back. Same pre for EVERYTHING. When it came time to mix everything stuck together really well. There was this creepy cohesion thing going on and everything came together much easier. When I sent the track to some trusted folks for feedback they also commented on the cohesion and asked me how I did it. One pre.

For some reason in the rock world it's a very popular methodology to use the same pre on everything on a record, but the hip-hop folks don't. Are the hip-hop guys just slow on the uptake? I dunno. On PSW you see big engineers talk about the 'one pre' thing all the time.

chris carter · 13th August 2007, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mix-it-well

So what?
They still only had one type of preamp

VERY good point!

t.dizzle · 13th August 2007, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mix-it-well

and if you want to tell me EQs wasn't invented to change the sound then what the hell are they for?
delight me...

EQ was actually invented to correct microphone deficiencies.

mix-it-well · 13th August 2007, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t.dizzle

EQ was actually invented to correct microphone deficiencies.

Thx dizzle,this is why I love this board ,you always learn new things.
But I don't really see the difference between adding some more lows because the kick doesn`t sound right ,and adding some more lows because the kick mic is "bad".

Tabnetic · 13th August 2007, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hitsville

Do you think the choice of preamps is that important when tracking mpc's and asr's and sp's.. ?

my experience.. so far I've been using a 1073DPA to do all my tracking. I love the 1073, although sometimes, on drums for example, I have the impression it squashes the transients too much for my taste, almost sounding like some compression. I might be tripping tho ! I've been thinking about buying an API type pre (BAE or API) to track my drums, but I'm not sure it will be worth it.

so my question is, do you think using different pre's to track samplers is unnecessary ?

i like the sound of the chandler LTD-2 when tracking my mpc, though i had the luck of using a john hardy box one day to track at a friend's studio and it sounded amazing. you should check out

the listening sessions

this is the session where they run the drums out of a korg trinity (bleh) into various pres. might help.

HIGHENDONLY · 13th August 2007, 07:53 PM

I would love to run an mpc4000 into a real fairchild for fun, id bet that sound killer!!!But i'll continue to just dream about it.

t.dizzle · 13th August 2007, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mix-it-well

Thx dizzle,this is why I love this board ,you always learn new things.
But I don't really see the difference between adding some more lows because the kick doesn`t sound right ,and adding some more lows because the kick mic is "bad".

I was just pointing out the original intent of eq was. I'm not really sure what the debate is on this thread. I do know that back in "the day" of the big studios, we would run MP's and such through outboard pres/line amps only if we were dealing with a rookie or less-experienced producer with mediocre sounds. We wouldn't dare do that for Johnny J, or Quick, or Dre and Mel - that would be their decision if they wanted to do that...and usually they didn't.

Just as a FYI thing - eq cannot "add" anything that isn't there already.

**TonyBelmont** · 14th August 2007, 02:43 AM

There are so many factors that effect the sound of a preamp... You cannot use an EQ to emulate the sound of a preamp.

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2nd June 2006, 05:02 PM	#1
hitsville Gear nut Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 132	Different pre's for hip-hop beats tracking.. worth it ? Do you think the choice of preamps is that important when tracking mpc's and asr's and sp's.. ? my experience.. so far I've been using a 1073DPA to do all my tracking. I love the 1073, although sometimes, on drums for example, I have the impression it squashes the transients too much for my taste, almost sounding like some compression. I might be tripping tho ! I've been thinking about buying an API type pre (BAE or API) to track my drums, but I'm not sure it will be worth it. so my question is, do you think using different pre's to track samplers is unnecessary ?

3rd June 2006, 01:49 AM	#8
TonyBelmont Moderator Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Boston,MA Providence,RI Posts: 10,133	I like using a combination of Neve-style and API pre's for my synths, samplers and sound modules. I love using the different flavors for tracking. __________________ Tony Belmont We Sell Gear! Need plugins? Check out PluginDiscounts.com

6th June 2006, 03:43 PM	#15
Disco D Gear addict Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: NYC / Sao Paulo Posts: 395	i got tons of different favors now - neve, A Designs, OSA etc and it really makes a difference. one trick i have been doing is using 2 completely different brands and models of preamps on each side of a stereo synth output. this gives a cool subtle stereo field. __________________ http://www.myspace.com/gringolouco

14th August 2007, 02:43 AM	#28
TonyBelmont Moderator Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Boston,MA Providence,RI Posts: 10,133	There are so many factors that effect the sound of a preamp... You cannot use an EQ to emulate the sound of a preamp. __________________ Tony Belmont We Sell Gear! Need plugins? Check out PluginDiscounts.com

2nd June 2006, 11:28 PM	#5
Gduron Gear nut Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: LA, California Posts: 92	you know... i've notice that too... I have a chandler ltd-1... but in my case i like the drums i get from it... nice and round.. and not much compression needed... sorry couldn't help...hey at least your post is going to be on top of the forum

3rd June 2006, 05:33 PM	#11
hitsville Gear nut Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 132	so, there are 2 differents schools i guess

4th June 2006, 06:07 AM	#12
H-Rezz Lives for gear Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 1,380	Yep , same here , a combination of Summit(fat and warm) , Isa 428(Hi Fi Clean) and Manley(Somewhere inbetween).

5th June 2006, 06:26 AM	#13
EHProductions Gear interested Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Dallas Posts: 16	if the room permits I never use line In's....... I am a DI advocate ask Nuk...lol...... every sample should have its place... of origin in my opinion... In other words if its all motif and you line in the strings drums and whatever else all have a similar edge and color.........no,no,no..... I usually use countrymans and J48's and switch up certain sounds to either some 1272's API's or yes even a foucusrite 428..... gives diff tonalities and edges I like the 1272's for distorted transients,,, API's for warm strings etc.// the MPC is a beast of its own cause each sample more than likely comes from diff places anywayz so Ill DI through the an SSL 900J pre or something ... distorts nicely... but May use NEve etc depending..... The DI is cool because when you go line in on most pres it hits diff gain stage, Transformers etc... I like the added junk in the way for flavor reasons... Clean hip hop.... this aint no MC hammer album..... Just kiddin -Eric

13th August 2007, 06:41 AM	#16
DSMrehearsal Gear addict Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 308	ssl pre's sound great for drums IMO, Tab/tele valve pre's for synths, makie/yamaha for bass. All goes to studer tape machine.

13th August 2007, 09:32 AM	#18
deuc647 Lives for gear Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 1,308	I honestly think you have to choose a pre than can go with anything, API is one, and honestly i have never heard a neve but from all the posts it seems to not be the ideal choice of tracking certain things, its referred to as dark, API always seems to get the good cohesion, but different flavors are good, i have 8 sebatrons pres, i think that there is something special about the cohesion when you track with the same pre, like it just meshes together, it might be just me

13th August 2007, 07:53 PM	#26
HIGHENDONLY Lives for gear Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Middlebury CT Posts: 825	I would love to run an mpc4000 into a real fairchild for fun, id bet that sound killer!!!But i'll continue to just dream about it.