Sm7b...Overated?

[diff caliber]

Ok, I know I might just be causing a fire storm by just that title alone but we need to have a honest discussion about THAT mic. So here we go.

A month ago I was looking to beef up my mic arsenal, so I started doing my research. I was looking for a mic that would not break the bank but also give me some good rap vocals.

You type in "rap vocals", type in "microphone", click search and Biggity Bang what do you get? A kazzilion threads biggin up hip-hops beloved mic, the Shure SM7b.

I ended up reading threads after threads of people catching ear-gasims over that mic. I'm new to recording, but I pride myself on not getting hyped over gear I haven't tested myself, but by just reading those threads and countless of reviews gave me a hype over THAT mic and put the battery in my back to get it. Fell in love before I even took her on a date.


So a week later I get the mic, fired up my pro tools, got my pere-73 juiced up, layed some vocals down,licked my chops for the play back and pressed play and...


...meh. Definitely not the ear-gasim I was expecting

Now, don't get me wrong,what I heard was good vocals, but not the kind of vocals you would expect for such a well received mic like this. For me the sm7b is a GOOD mic for that price, but certainly not the greatest, even in that price range. For me at least I can name a handful of mics that are superior to it.

blue baby bottle
blubird
At4040
At4033
AKG C 214 just to name some.

Listening to the sm7b for seem reason I get sort of a vagueness especially around the middle where I like to have my vocal sit in. There is no tightness around it and gets to wild on the top end for me. Its like there's something lacking in its sound that I cant really explain. So to ME, I cant emphasize that enough, the sm7b is way overrated. I ended up trading it back in, put a little more doe on top and got a at4074 to compliment my at4060, which I think is actually one of the most underrated mics.

Anyways, dont mean to sound sacrilegious and draw blood in the water but we need an honest talk about this mic. I would really like to hear from those who ain't drinking the sm7b kool-aid and got negative vibes towards this mic, to offer up a flip side for those looking to scoop up this mic.

Man, I think its about to get heated up in here!

[JoRillo]

Threads praising the Sm7b exist.

Threads hating the Sm7b exist.

Threads *exactly like this one* about it being over rated exist.

You just didn't do enough reading. I read those same threads. I bought an Sm7b, although I love the thing. Part of having a mic collection is to know how and when to use a mic for a certain thing. "Oh I am going over to your friends house to record - he has no room treatment, lives at his moms who watchs jerry spring all day loud as shit in the living room?" "No problem - I got my Sm7b here with me, you won't hear a thing."

I personally like it on my voice - not my favorite mic I own, but definitely my workhorse. It does lack some definition - but it's a dynamic mic, you should expect that.

[jrides]

Yes. Yes it is.
Its not a bad mic though. As a matter of fact I might have use for it again. Maybe I will cop one soon.

[diff caliber]

Originally Posted by JoRillo

Threads praising the Sm7b exist.

Threads hating the Sm7b exist.

Threads *exactly like this one* about it being over rated exist.

You just didn't do enough reading. I read those same threads. I bought an Sm7b, although I love the thing. Part of having a mic collection is to know how and when to use a mic for a certain thing. "Oh I am going over to your friends house to record - he has no room treatment, lives at his moms who watchs jerry spring all day loud as shit in the living room?" "No problem - I got my Sm7b here with me, you won't hear a thing."

I personally like it on my voice - not my favorite mic I own, but definitely my workhorse. It does lack some definition - but it's a dynamic mic, you should expect that.

Over the research I did, I probably ran into 7-8 Posts, not threads, who had negative feelings about the mic.

Obviously there are exceptions and not every one is going to like it, but you can certainly agree that those opinions are substantially less then those gushing over it.

Any thread started in any rap forum with a title like " looking for a mic for rap vocals.." or "need help finding a mic.." seems to turn into a love-fest for the sm7b. That I don't get for what seems to me to be such a mediocre mic. I know that's highly subjective based on my own experience with the sm7b

We can agree that it is a mic that is probably worth having in your arsenal, but the question still remains, is it overrated? Does the quality of the mic deserve to have that much hype around it? To me, the answer is no.

Again, its purely subjective, but that reason alone should not hinder others from sharing there negative experience with the mic to offer up a balance of critique from what seems to me to be so much hype.

Maybe from those who feel its overrated can offer up a few mics, with in or around that price range, that out performs it.

[JoRillo]

Wana know why it gets suggested so much? Because 90% of the threads asking what mic to get are from 17 year olds who don't want to go threw the steps of room treatment, mic placement, gain staging, and all the other technical aspects. Its a mic that won't pick up much if any room noise and its at a great price.

All those bundled into one make it highly suggested.

[beef]

I am using this mic all the time, great tool!

[TYPHY]

I just ordered mine a few days ago, should arrive in 2 more days.

Hopefully, it lives up to the hype.

Hopefully, it'll suit my voice more than my current mic.

Hopefully, it makes me sound like Tupac.

Hopefully..... lol.

[superwack]

True for the SM7b (and every single other piece of gear) it is good on some sources, great on some sources, ok on some sources and terrible on some sources - depending, of course, on the sound you are going for.

Also, to be fair, the mics you mentioned as "better" are NOT dynamic mics so you can't really compare them as they all have different qualities. Shoot out an RE20, SM7b or 441 and, although you still might like one of those better than the Sm7b, it'll at least be an apples-to-apples comparison.

I hate my SDC (AKG451) on vocals but LOVE it compared to the Realistic PZM I have... although on drum room it's completely the opposite.

[JoRillo]

Originally Posted by superwack

True for the SM7b (and every single other piece of gear) it is good on some sources, great on some sources, ok on some sources and terrible on some sources - depending, of course, on the sound you are going for.

Also, to be fair, the mics you mentioned as "better" are NOT dynamic mics so you can't really compare them as they all have different qualities. Shoot out an RE20, SM7b or 441 and, although you still might like one of those better than the Sm7b, it'll at least be an apples-to-apples comparison.

I hate my SDC (AKG451) on vocals but LOVE it compared to the Realistic PZM I have... although on drum room it's completely the opposite.

All three of those dynamic mics are amazing on specific things.

Sm7b on Vox - RE 20 on Kicks - 441 to Mic guitar cabs

The perfect dynamic mic collection trio

[blaarg]

i bought this mic a while back because of all it's praise and i was greatly disappointed. the sound is too dark for my taste, i prefer going condenser when recording and kind of vocals. i also tried it with guitar and still didn't like how it sounded, i have it in a drawer somewhere and i never use it except for screamers which i've never ran into since 2005

[RonGherkins]

I think your problem is you bought a mic without trying it on your voice. The good news is it's probably good for other people you record OR you can sell it for around what you paid and buy something else. The mics you named are for the most part decent. I don't know about superior, but they could be a replacement for in some situations depending on the vocalist. I have about 3 vocal mics I use for rap and I feel like I'm on the low end of what people have.

Works fine for me though I gotta say, depends on the rapper but usually it's perfect.

This entire track was recorded with an sm7b, including the female vocalist on the hook.
http://soundcloud.com/lamontp/3-card-burning-records-feat/s-HRpuV

[TYPHY]

Originally Posted by RonGherkins

I think your problem is you bought a mic without trying it on your voice. The good news is it's probably good for other people you record OR you can sell it for around what you paid and buy something else. The mics you named are for the most part decent. I don't know about superior, but they could be a replacement for in some situations depending on the vocalist. I have about 3 vocal mics I use for rap and I feel like I'm on the low end of what people have.

Works fine for me though I gotta say, depends on the rapper but usually it's perfect.

This entire track was recorded with an sm7b, including the female vocalist on the hook.
http://soundcloud.com/lamontp/3-card-burning-records-feat/s-HRpuV

that track sounds pretty nice.
what was the vocal chain for it?

[Michael Jin]

Well, the question of whether it's overrated or not really comes down to what you're expecting from it. I see the SM7b pretty much the same way I see the SM57, SM58, and hell... even the U87. They're workhorse mics with undeniable versatility. They're also a safe bet to make. In that sense, they're every bit worth the hype they get.

However, if what you're looking for is a magic pill to automatically bring your recordings to a new level, then you're probably going to be disappointed. I'm sure that this does happen for some people, but the simple fact is that not every voice will work great on every mic, even expensive or highly reputable mics. It seems to me like this mic really just isn't doing it for your voice and that's fine. Finding the right mic is just part of the journey as both an engineer and an artist.

Similarly, I don't think "outperform" would be the correct term to use since that also presumes some sort of expectation or standard as being "right" or "better". This is ultimately an art and everyone is looking for different qualities. The "good" mic is the one that matches your preference in a given instance. This is not to say, however, that comparisons can't be made. You can argue over frequency response, sibilance, etc. But that's really a different story.

[diogo.zaccara]

im plannin to get one... i have an AKG Perception 220 and i really hate how my voice sound on it, and since i dont have an appropriate room for recording, i think this would be a good mic...

Originally Posted by RonGherkins

I think your problem is you bought a mic without trying it on your voice. The good news is it's probably good for other people you record OR you can sell it for around what you paid and buy something else. The mics you named are for the most part decent. I don't know about superior, but they could be a replacement for in some situations depending on the vocalist. I have about 3 vocal mics I use for rap and I feel like I'm on the low end of what people have.

Works fine for me though I gotta say, depends on the rapper but usually it's perfect.

This entire track was recorded with an sm7b, including the female vocalist on the hook.
http://soundcloud.com/lamontp/3-card-burning-records-feat/s-HRpuV

that track is pretty nice man...

[JoRillo]

im plannin to get one... i have an AKG Perception 220 and i really hate how my voice sound on it, and since i dont have an appropriate room for recording, i think this would be a good mic...

Even if you don't like the Sm7b - it will be about the opposite of the AKG P220 lol

I have both - The AKG to me sounds pretty good on higher pitched vocalists and the Sm7b has most of its power in the low-high mids

[diff caliber]

Again I know its purely subjective and what can make my vocals sound like shit can make another mans vocal sound like THE shit.I have no delusions about this and I guess I just happen to not like a mic that seems to be very popular. But I do wonder if there are other elements into why people rave about it in rap forums beyond its sonic delivery. Price is always a major factor because we judge not just based on its performance but also the cost of that performance.

Having said that, this thread is not about whether its a good or bad mic, but peoples experience with the mic and whether it lives up to its hype. Surely there are people who don't like it that can offer up there critique of it. To me its a honest strait forward question, is the mic overrated or does it deserve its light based on your personal experience with it.

[JoRillo]

Anything can be overrated. You need to learn how to sift threw the bull ---- and form your own opinions. Anything that changes your vocal chain should always be tested before you buy it - so anyone upset with their purchase can only blame themselves - unless they were smart enough to keep the receipt - in which case you can consider that a "test" and you now know whether you like it or not.

[ShadowAMD]

Not this crap again!! Do you know how many famous singers used the SM7B?

[ShadowAMD]

Originally Posted by Michael Jin

Well, the question of whether it's overrated or not really comes down to what you're expecting from it. I see the SM7b pretty much the same way I see the SM57, SM58, and hell... even the U87. They're workhorse mics with undeniable versatility. They're also a safe bet to make. In that sense, they're every bit worth the hype they get.

However, if what you're looking for is a magic pill to automatically bring your recordings to a new level, then you're probably going to be disappointed. I'm sure that this does happen for some people, but the simple fact is that not every voice will work great on every mic, even expensive or highly reputable mics. It seems to me like this mic really just isn't doing it for your voice and that's fine. Finding the right mic is just part of the journey as both an engineer and an artist.

Similarly, I don't think "outperform" would be the correct term to use since that also presumes some sort of expectation or standard as being "right" or "better". This is ultimately an art and everyone is looking for different qualities. The "good" mic is the one that matches your preference in a given instance. This is not to say, however, that comparisons can't be made. You can argue over frequency response, sibilance, etc. But that's really a different story.

+10 on this!!

[2Loud]

Originally Posted by ShadowAMD

+10 on this!!

woooord !

[candidate]

all microphones are over rated

[RonGherkins]

Originally Posted by TYPHY

that track sounds pretty nice.
what was the vocal chain for it?

that track is pretty nice man...

Thanks guys.

Vocal chain for this was sm7b>1073dmp>babyface>pro tools, usually it's sm7b/c414>1073 module>distressor>saffire pro 40>pt.
I think any 1073 style pre will sound great, I tried it with an ISA one once on a rock vocal and it sounded alright, but I mostly track hiphop with it. For Pop music, I'll use my condensers.

[TYPHY]

Originally Posted by RonGherkins

Thanks guys.

Vocal chain for this was sm7b>1073dmp>babyface>pro tools, usually it's sm7b/c414>1073 module>distressor>saffire pro 40>pt.
I think any 1073 style pre will sound great, I tried it with an ISA one once on a rock vocal and it sounded alright, but I mostly track hiphop with it. For Pop music, I'll use my condensers.

My SM7 will be here in a few days but I don't have a nice preamp. It will be going into my interface (Komplete Audio 6, which isn't even comparable to a RME Babyface) to PT. But if I were to buy a nice pre like the BAE1073, SSL Alpha, or UA 610.. would it matter if my interface was low end or not? Will my interface restrain my preamp from delivering its maximum potential?

[RonGherkins]

If you can bypass the preamps of your interface (line in), I'm of the opinion that it will matter very little. Yes, better conversion is better, but you will get a very noticeable increase in sound quality regardless. Extremely usable.

I think 610 might be too coloured as your only pre, and I know a lot of people who like the alpha but I haven't used it enough to comment, it's clean anyways. I've used a bunch of bae products and I've used vintage neve modules and they sound v v good by comparison. They are better than the vintechs imo though the vintechs are really great value.

[2Loud]

Originally Posted by TYPHY

My SM7 will be here in a few days but I don't have a nice preamp. It will be going into my interface (Komplete Audio 6, which isn't even comparable to a RME Babyface) to PT. But if I were to buy a nice pre like the BAE1073, SSL Alpha, or UA 610.. would it matter if my interface was low end or not? Will my interface restrain my preamp from delivering its maximum potential?

It needs a lots of gain, so some nice pre is welcome.
Not sure how your device pres would handle this in best possible way
just my guess.
Same with conversion - dont know the device but guess it might be on some nice level.
Dont forget room however this mic is very easy with untreated space.

Anyway - SM7B will demand some amount of gain. Be ready for that.

Still love it on lots of stuff.
Cheers.

[TYPHY]

Yeah I actually have the Presonus Studio Channel right now that provides about 65dbs of gain. I have 30 days with this pre. I just bought it to play with for 30 days, I'm really saving up more money to get a nicer pre.

I was thinking the UA Solo 610 but then it may be too colored to have as my only pre. So I'll probably save up even more and get a BAE1073.

[2Loud]

Originally Posted by TYPHY

Yeah I actually have the Presonus Studio Channel right now that provides about 65dbs of gain. I have 30 days with this pre. I just bought it to play with for 30 days, I'm really saving up more money to get a nicer pre.

I was thinking the UA Solo 610 but then it may be too colored to have as my only pre. So I'll probably save up even more and get a BAE1073.

take look at mic pre /no Eq/ version of Bae 1073

Great River ME1NV is superb too.


if budget limited and with conversion in mind - you may find
SSL Alpha cheap on eBay - high gain, cleanish - no "magnifico"
the vhd gives some nice options though

works well with Shure, plenty of gain plus it has a very nice conversion, so using its spdif you can feed your Kontakt spdif in. You can also plug any other pre patching it into insert return at the back of the SSL unit with option to bypass the Eq section in Alpha and go directly digital via Alpha´s spdif out to your Kontakt again, so you can use it as a single converter also. I prefer other preamps on most of the things,but for the price and its versatility this one is bargain.


Cheers
2L

[Stepwise Sound]

I really love my SM7b.

Is it overrated? Sure - i think it is probably the most highly-rated mic on GS and it's hard to live up to that kind of hype.

You can put it up and it will sound good (if not great) regardless of the room. I have heard horrible results with condensers in sub-optimal rooms - the SM7b takes out that whole element so it is easy to recommend. You can also tweak the EQ on the back of the mic which is pretty cool.

That being said, I would not reach for an SM7b for rap vocals first -- unless maybe the MC is shouting or super loud on the mic. I think large diaphragm condensers are 90% of the time the sound that people expect and want to hear for rap vocals.

I personally go for an Audio Technica mic (4050) first -- then if it doesn't sound right I will go for the SM7b.

I will tell the OP that the SM7b is not a mic that will "blow you away", at least not at first. I do think that everyone who has a nice condenser owes it to themselves to get at least one nice dynamic mic like an SM7b - it will come in handy and may even save your bacon one day.

[diff caliber]

Fist off me buying the mic and keeping the receipt was my "test".
Secondly I didn't open this thread as an angry shopper I just thought we can have a open discussion about it. Its actually quite the opposite. I was glad to test out the mic and see what the hype was about and then see its flaws.

I've never complained about buying gear and not end up liking it, I just keep the receipt.

[JoRillo]

Fist off me buying the mic and keeping the receipt was my "test".
Secondly I didn't open this thread as an angry shopper I just thought we can have a open discussion about it. Its actually quite the opposite. I was glad to test out the mic and see what the hype was about and then see its flaws.

Don't take it so personal. This has been brought up before, so maybe we are just being overly critical in this thread - but honestly every piece of gear should be tested pre buy - or returned if you don't like it - so when threads like this come up - they get bashed down. It's not a personal attack on you - it's more like a "Well I hope you learned" then anything.

The Sm7b is a great mic - if you don't like it on your voice that's unfortunate - but there are a million uses for it and it does a great job on 80% of anything you want to use it for. With that said there are a million mics that could do a better job - but most of them aren't $350 - and most will pick up 40% more room sound - which could be desirable - but not always.