Apogee Ensemble for tracking MPC and synths?

[TWC]

A question for the MPC tracking experts on here: Does the Ensemble and Logic look like a viable alternative to the Digi002 + outboard convertors + outboard pre's ?

Did anyone here check it out at NAMM?

I had Logic and replaced it with PT on the 002, then discovered all the outboard thats necessary to get the sound up to professional Pro Tools standards. Now i'm considering selling the 002 and just buying the Ensemble when it comes out.

How does the Logic summing/audio engine compare to the 002?

[TonyBelmont]

Originally Posted by TWC

A question for the MPC tracking experts on here: Does the Ensemble and Logic look like a viable alternative to the Digi002 + outboard convertors + outboard pre's ?

Did anyone here check it out at NAMM?

I had Logic and replaced it with PT on the 002, then discovered all the outboard thats necessary to get the sound up to professional Pro Tools standards. Now i'm considering selling the 002 and just buying the Ensemble when it comes out.

How does the Logic summing/audio engine compare to the 002?

While I'm sure it will sound good, you can't expect it to sound like the great preamp's that we all talk about on here everyday. Their other mic pre's, though clean, were never anything to write home about. You won't get much color out of those.....

[TWC]

Originally Posted by TonyBelmont

While I'm sure it will sound good, you can't expect it to sound like the great preamp's that we all talk about on here everyday. Their other mic pre's, though clean, were never anything to write home about. You won't get much color out of those.....

Thats what I thought. I'm thinking of picking it up still, cause the amount of money I would save on not buying outboard convertors would go a long way towards a GTQ2.. and then I would have a GTQ + a set of decent clean pre's, instead of the garbagey ones in the Digi002.

Basically the two final setups Im looking at are

MPC3000 -> GTQ2 -> Fatso -> Rosetta 800 -> Digi002
or
MPC3000 -> GTQ2 -> Fatso -> Ensemble

Ensemble = $1999
Digi002 + Rosetta 800 = $2495 + $2995 = $5490
(I just used list prices here to make the relative comparison easier. I picked up my used Digi002 for really cheap and I can get a used Rosetta for $2000, whereas I would have to buy Ensemble new, so that kind of tips things back towards favoring the 002)

Which do you think is the best route? I don't really mind loosing the 002 control surface, cause I'm just making beats, and I don't even like the 002 surface much at all. Sixtoo seemed to have good things to say about the sound difference switching to Logic and abandoning the 002

About the convertors in these things.. there seems to be a lot of confusion as to where they fit in the Apogee line. At first they were saying that they are at the same level as the Rosetta "just different". Now they say they are slightly worse.

Personally I suspect that the convertors are actually equal to or better than the Rosetta (subsidized by Apple?). It seems strange to me that they would spend the money to design a new convertor that is slightly worse than an existing design. I'm no expert though. As far as their ambiguous statements about it... I think that if the new convertors are better (and possibly coming out as a cheaper standalone replacement of the Rosetta series) then "slightly worse than the rosetta" is the only thing they can really say at this point considering the Rosetta 800 is still on the market.

maybe they are going to release an "ensemble pro" with a Big Ben c777 clock and rosetta or 16x convertors.. that would be nice

[goldphinga]

Ensemble has the mini-me convertors.

[Fredrik]

Originally Posted by TWC

maybe they are going to release an "ensemble pro" with a Big Ben c777 clock and rosetta or 16x convertors.. that would be nice

If you aren´t using a laptop you could get the symphony card instead and use any apogee interface, while maintain the compability with logic and coreaudio.

[TWC]

Originally Posted by goldphinga

Ensemble has the mini-me convertors.

Thats a pretty strong claim. If it has mini-me convertors
a) why is Apogee telling everyone that it's a totally new design?
b) what reason would Apogee have for not wanting to tell people thats it uses mini me conversion?

[TWC]

Originally Posted by Fredrik

If you aren´t using a laptop you could get the symphony card instead and use any apogee interface, while maintain the compability with logic and coreaudio.

I thought about that. I'm on a G4 1.5ghz 1.25gb ram laptop right now. I had a great deal lined up on a G5 but it fell through, now I'm not sure if I'll even get a G5. My situation is that I have enough money for about 60% of the gear I plan to get, and the other 40% will be purchased over the next 3 months. If I can get away without buying an expensive computer, I'd rather get something tasty like a fatso or gtq sooner. I don't plan on using many channels or plugins, so I think the laptop might cut it. For the most part I will be taking tracks into a big studio for mixing, so I'm really just after a good 2 channel recording chain.

Right now I'm finding the idea of grabbing an ensemble and a GTQ2 and being more or less ready to go pretty appealing. But is this a prosumer gear choice that I will regret and replace? arghh too many decisions

[beyarecords]

Originally Posted by TonyBelmont

you can't expect it to sound like the great preamp's that we all talk about on here everyday.

Which preamps were you refering to?

Beya

[TonyBelmont]

Originally Posted by beyarecords

Which preamps were you refering to?

Beya

Neve-style preamps... API preamps..... etc.

[TonyBelmont]

Originally Posted by TWC

Which do you think is the best route? I don't really mind loosing the 002 control surface, cause I'm just making beats, and I don't even like the 002 surface much at all. Sixtoo seemed to have good things to say about the sound difference switching to Logic and abandoning the 002

I reserve judgement on the Apogee Ensemble converters until I can actually hear them. On paper this thing looks pretty cool, though..

Also, why not look at something like the RME ADI-2, and plug that into the 002 you already have...??? Just a thought.. I think that RME makes great converters at a much better price point.

[beyarecords]

Originally Posted by TonyBelmont

Neve-style preamps... API preamps..... etc.

Gotcha!

[TWC]

Originally Posted by TonyBelmont

I reserve judgement on the Apogee Ensemble converters until I can actually hear them. On paper this thing looks pretty cool, though..

Also, why not look at something like the RME ADI-2, and plug that into the 002 you already have...??? Just a thought.. I think that RME makes great converters at a much better price point.

Yeah that seems like the most sound idea. I noticed you recommended the GTQ2 + ADI2 on another thread. I've been going through your posts on this topic and from what I gather you say the DI/pre solutions for the Digi002 are more important than the AD.DA convertors, right?
What do you think about clocking? Some people seem to make a huge deal out of this, others say that it only makes a small difference.

Your like the voice of reason here, but I've got another little devil on my shoulder that looks like Steve Jobs telling me "don't buy that ugly convertor for your ugly digi 002. Get rid of that plastic crap and buy a beautiful brushed metal made-for-mac peice"
the Macintosh siren song..

[ebworld]

can the volume on the adi 2 control the monitors or just the headphones?and does the adi 2 have better conversion than the mini me?

[TonyBelmont]

Originally Posted by TWC

Yeah that seems like the most sound idea. I noticed you recommended the GTQ2 + ADI2 on another thread. I've been going through your posts on this topic and from what I gather you say the DI/pre solutions for the Digi002 are more important than the AD.DA convertors, right?
What do you think about clocking? Some people seem to make a huge deal out of this, others say that it only makes a small difference.

Your like the voice of reason here, but I've got another little devil on my shoulder that looks like Steve Jobs telling me "don't buy that ugly convertor for your ugly digi 002. Get rid of that plastic crap and buy a beautiful brushed metal made-for-mac peice"
the Macintosh siren song..

I think converters in general is an overly debated subject. Sure, 5-6 years ago you had to get the absolute best converters to get a good sound, but now mid-level converters are superior to even those most expensive of converters of that era. I don't feel like the converters are that big of an issue with the 002... They aren't the best, but they are certainly decent enough for tracking beats, etc.

You could get an ADI-2, and I'm sure that would be a step up from the 002, but anything more than that is big money for little reward.

The pre is going to make the biggest difference.

[TonyBelmont]

Originally Posted by ebworld

can the volume on the adi 2 control the monitors or just the headphones?and does the adi 2 have better conversion than the mini me?

I was told at AES that the next update would allow for that. I could only assume that the RME sounds better than the Mini-Me.

[PhonoquO]

Originally Posted by TonyBelmont

I reserve judgement on the Apogee Ensemble converters until I can actually hear them. On paper this thing looks pretty cool, though..

Also, why not look at something like the RME ADI-2, and plug that into the 002 you already have...??? Just a thought.. I think that RME makes great converters at a much better price point.

You get a "PhonoquO" point!!!

[goldphinga]

Come on Apogee, tell us about the convertors in the ensemble.Surely they wouldnt release a product that didnt include the latest convertor technology? That would be a bad move. This unit needs to be killer if its gonna take the firefaces crown. Its a hard act to follow, though if anyone can do it Apogee can. I just they would put out a proper press release with more details about the convertors. No one can really make an informed choice as it stands.I want to hear that the ensemble kicks the **** out of the fireface!!

[TWC]

I REALLY REALLY hope this unit ends up being good. I've just had a drastic change of plans for next year, and now it looks like I'm moving to Brasil! If I could get this Ensemble running with my laptop, it would be ideal for bringing down there with me.

Now if Apogee could just break off a test unit for someone on GS to review...

[Proman]

Originally Posted by TWC

A question for the MPC tracking experts on here: Does the Ensemble and Logic look like a viable alternative to the Digi002 + outboard convertors + outboard pre's ?

Did anyone here check it out at NAMM?

I had Logic and replaced it with PT on the 002, then discovered all the outboard thats necessary to get the sound up to professional Pro Tools standards. Now i'm considering selling the 002 and just buying the Ensemble when it comes out.

How does the Logic summing/audio engine compare to the 002?

Better

Thanks

[tomdarude]

got a used MetricHalo 2882 I/O for under $1000,-
never ever looked back converter-wise!!

prefer it to the RME Fireface..but slightly worse than a AD16x or Lynx Aurora16....but no big deal at all!

I´ll def put that money into mics/preamps/comps/etc....that´s gonna make a difference ....just what tony said