MPC 3000 card reader

[King Dread]

I'm interested in installing a card reader in my 3000. I was wondering if there is a certain or preferred model I should get and if the installation process is something I can do on my own or if I should send it in to somebody. I'm not experienced in soldering. Thanks for any help

[WideawakE]

www.scsi4samplers.com

go there and be merry

[King Dread]

Thanks bruh

[TonyBelmont]

That's an interesting idea... I might look into that as well.

3.5's are unreliable, and ZIP's have gone the way of the dinosaur.

Is anyone using one of these right now? How fast are the load times compared to ZIPs?

[kazper]

fast...

One of the best things you can do for your MPC..

[tombak]

This guy has MCD's, cables, and such available individually or as kits.

Akai MPC Parts , Accessories , Faceplates and More at MPCstuff.com

[fooloof]

Originally Posted by TonyBelmont

That's an interesting idea... I might look into that as well.

3.5's are unreliable, and ZIP's have gone the way of the dinosaur.

Is anyone using one of these right now? How fast are the load times compared to ZIPs?

i'm still using floppys!

[smokemachine]

scsi4samplers.com is going out of biz and don't have any more cf readers for the mp3k.

anyone know of somewhere else (besides mpc stuff) that might have something similar?

[vintagefreak]

Originally Posted by kazper

fast...

One of the best things you can do for your MPC..

yes it is, but have to remind you , MPC3000 with OS 3.11 can only access one ( 80MB) partition A on the disc/card , unless you install alternative Vailixi OS that lets MPC3000 access all partitions on the SCSI card/ disc.
at least that's what's happening on my MPC3000 LE / AKAI OS 3.11 with external Zip drive even if i use 100mb or 200 mb zip disks MPC only sees 80mb of it .... waist of space :( ...

but don't take my word for it - maybe its just me with the Zip discs...?

anyone?

[King Dread]

^I installed the Vailixi OS the same day as my card reader so I couldn't say. Glad with my decision by the way

[ianbryn11]

Originally Posted by King Dread

^I installed the Vailixi OS the same day as my card reader so I couldn't say. Glad with my decision by the way

Hey, what cf reader did u end up buying. I'm looking for on for a 3000. Can't seem to find much info

[Audio Child]

These days its floppy disk emulators via sd cards!

[King Dread]

Originally Posted by ianbryn11

Hey, what cf reader did u end up buying. I'm looking for on for a 3000. Can't seem to find much info

I got the internal cf card reader from scsi4samplers. I believe they're no longer in business now though

[viewingstuff]

internal

external

[SEED78]

I'm 90% the way through installing a internal NON hotswap CF reader in my 3.11os 3000 classic. I got mine working, but my old floppy drive had its screw holes in different places so need to drill holes in the CF>IDE adapter reader so I can leave my 3000 untouched. installing this consumed my last month or so and I found a lot of info to be pure myth...

seriously, if you've not got 3.5os (many don't) I'd think twice. ESP if you are gonna want to be transfering a ton of samples MPC>computer.

I'm currently working on a detailed how to guide (with pics) for those you want to go this route, eventually I'll make a PDF of it, or post of a blog or something.

here is the info I gave to someone via a PM recently (see LONG post below), it needs work, it doesn't at the mo cover ALL details needed but it may get you started, or make you decide to just use ZIP+MPC editor to save you £100 and a ton of you time <<with CF (non hot swap) or ZIP (hot swap)>> if you read though this lot you will find you only get 30meg, YES 30 meg, if you want to use MPC editor, the only decent software about for backing up and converting file types etc etc) otherwise yeah you got 780meg of space on CF card in 30meg partitions (no other formatting options exist), but you can't back up that amount or hotswap (even without MPC Editor max any computer is gonna see is first 30meg partition), have a think about how little that actually lets you do with a 3000 - resist asking detailed questions as I'll be doing what I said above within the next month or so.

_______________________________________

I'm learning this all as i go, I'm 90% there, got internal working and found what seems for now to be a good CF card (lexar 133x 1GB CF). my CF>IDE tray has different screw holes to my old floppy drive so I need to drill the tray, getting that done this week. i had some help with finding parts, so wasn't on my own - I'm far from expert on this stuff

over next few months I'll be making 'how to guide' covering all needed info - the below is just for starters to get peeps on the right road

first up, the raw facts incase you don't know, treat this as a WARNING section:
regarding MPC 3000's with 3.11OS (or any non 3.5OS)

1) the 60+3000 are what seems just about one of the most fussy samplers for using an external or internal CF out there, compared to later Akai S Series/EMU/Ensoniq samplers at any rate.
2) there is one known external known to work - but its REAL rare! see near bottom of this starter guide - since scsiforsamplers.com has gone people are getting hold of Acard scsi to IDE bridge AEC-7720U (NOT the one with W on the end I've been told) and CF>IDE adapter tray + needed cables (see below)
3) NO hot swapping of CF cards without 3.5OS, disk MUST be inserted and removed with machine switched OFF. CORRECTION, LOOKS LIEK THIS ISN'T TRUE SEE MY MORE RECENT POST BELOW
2) even once ANY reader is installed or used externally you can only ever read 780 meg on ANY size of card (in a ton of 30meg partitions NOT one block) - when it comes to transfering to PC/MAC your computer NOT see the MPC formatted disc - if you format with MPC Editor you only have 1x30meg block that can be seen on the MPC+computer
3) without MPC Editor your computer will actually corrupt your CF card!! so resist ramming card with samples until you got a tried and tested method with a working card). you can format the CF in MPC editor first then use in the 3000, but THEN you'll only have one 30meg partition on the whole card even if its a 1GB/2GB/4GB

this might be useful - use with care!!
NoVolTrack

4) firmware on Acard or external drive needs to be taken into account - you can change this yourself, but easier not to... Acard 3.75 firmware is working for me, see below 3.79 might work too
5) not all brands of CF even work with the CF>IDE adapter - there are many variations of this adapter and variations of CF cards themselves, with mine currently Lexar 133x 1GB is working, transcend doesn't, doubt kingston will - possibly SanDisk Ultra II or III might work, will test those next.
6) can you handle your 3000 being out of action for a month while you go through all this?

3.5OS sorts a lot of the above problems - use more types of CF card, you can see ALL partitions on MOST computers with a hell of a lot less hassle, you can use hotswap Spyrus drives (if you can find one - RARE). But, even though the 3.5OS website site is online the owner is currently awol, do not buy until people on MPC-Forums.com confirm he is back in the picture - when he does the 3000 community will rejoice, and we all wish him good health.

still want drive for your 3.11 OS MPC3000?? then read further.

using Acard scsi bridge and CF>IDE adapter tray:
3 x types of installation
a) what I've done: JUST an internal CF drive by taking the scsi connection inside the machine - did this as I've got nothing on zip worth worrying about, and I got the 3000 on a QL-400 stand on wheels so want no external anyway - PLUS its less strain on the 3000's crappy cheap scsi fuse. you need a CF>IDE adapter tray + the Acard scsi to IDE bridge talking about in link below do (NOT use yamaha bridge) + cables in thread below - female molex to male floppy is hardest to come by so many people solder their own, I didn't know how so got someone else to do it.
b) installation with internal drive AND external scsi port - only slightly more complication to fit, and at least 1 extra cable needed - you need need to make sure you internal and external as different scsi ID, blowing scsi fuse is an issue of not full clued on what you are doing - most parts same as a)
c) the IDE CF reader + Acard mentioned in a) housed in a enclosure to use as a external drive. involves other stuff I don't know about. advantages of this are less tinkering inside your 3000 and still being able to use zip as and when you need IF you need.

use this thread below as a guide for parts (read whole thing!!), they are in ref to 60, SHOULD be ok for 3000 not 100% sure - and DL the PDF I posted to mike near end of thread, its the install guide that came with scsiforsamplers.com drive (he is awol out of business at the mo - and not posting support on these forums). shows him doing option b).


firmware and parts
Akai MPC Forums - what ACARD firmare for MPC 3000? : MPC3000, MPC60


Akai MPC Forums - what ACARD firmare for MPC 3000? : MPC3000, MPC60

some info knocking about here too:

Akai MPC Forums - SUCCESS!!! Internal card reader in 3k! : MPC3000, MPC60

only one 'off the shelf' CF external known to work with 3.11os - but now they are seriously RARE!!!!!!!!!:

its SCM/Intermart/Microtech PCD-25 - def works, possibly firmware issues now and again not sure but its THE most reliable drive for 3000 known to man at this point - rare though! Akai S series / EMU owners got there early and cleared the global stock.

PCD-15 with right firmware, but seems 8ish out of 10 times it doesn't work.

all other PCD models DO NOT WORK - Spryrus only with 3.5OS

alternatives:

updating a good EMU rack sampler with CF (a LOT easier than in a 3000 to my knowledge, finding working parts is easier), then just using the 3000 to control it.

or MPC 4000/2500/5000 :D

even the 2000XL is easier to install CF in than the 3000 and they are hotswap and other stuff.. .

[SEED78]

Originally Posted by TonyBelmont

Is anyone using one of these right now? How fast are the load times compared to ZIPs?

thats one of the advantages - load and save times are SO fast you are gonna be double checking it saved at all!!

[SEED78]

Originally Posted by viewingstuff

internal

external

I can vouch for this guy - I got the internal from him - you might have the same screw hole issue as me, apart from that you are set, good price, some people are charging this for the now rare Acard alone... good seller, recommended!!!

[King Dread]

Originally Posted by SEED78

thats one of the advantages - load and save times are SO fast you are gonna be double checking it saved at all!!

Indeed, and it's completely silent

[SEED78]

Update:

for those who care I tested 3.85 Acard firmware yesterday - that works too.

Also DRUMROLL - despite never hearing of it being done with 3.11os (and ONLY hearing it was NEVER going to happen), I have managed to get a hot swap internal CF drive working via the above seller - VERY pleased with that development, my old one wasn't hot swap. All I can conclude is the bulk of MPC 60/3000 CF reader info out there is from people who haven't bothered trying a load of different CF cards.

The HS drive Doesn't work with all CF cards, we've only found a few specific Lexar's and a specific SanDisk so far, that was same with old one too - even scsiforsampler drives had these kind of issues. In another month though I want to double that list!!

be warned, this isn't a green light for ALL HS drives, this random one works - really wouldn't recommend picking up the first one you see and expecting it to work...

INSIDE - you can see scsi port has been moved internally, Acard is in use and floppy power cable is running things up in this beach


OUTSIDE

[viewingstuff]

looks like our friend from scsiforsamplers is back at it get 'em while they're hot!

[SEED78]

not hot swap like mine

I don't know that guy, but still worth getting if you know the limitations, i.e 780meg in 30meg partitions on MPC only usage - and only 1 single formatted 30 meg partition if you plan on transferring files to and from the computer with MPC Editor.

Honestly, if you are already using hot swap Zip and MPC editor to back up your sounds etc 30 meg at a time the only benefit is slight increase in speed - in odd way you are going backwards coz you won't have a got swap drive anymore.

make sure thats an Acard bridge he is selling, Yamaha has large chance of not working!

[hallman]

Thanks Seed
Awesome info

[goldphinga]

So what is the advantage of these card readers? To me it's only that they are more reliable than zips and only this! in every other way it seems that any mpc 3000 user would be worse off than with zips?

[DAH]

Originally Posted by goldphinga

So what is the advantage of these card readers? To me it's only that they are more reliable than zips and only this! in every other way it seems that any mpc 3000 user would be worse off than with zips?

That alone justifies CFs, the reliability of zips

[SEED78]

If you have 3.11os or earlier and only want to use with MPC Editor then Zips/CF are not much different, just bit quicker - and the fact zips ARE hot swap gives them a advantage.

If you don't want to use MPC Editor at all, a NON hot swap CF drive can be a PITA if you want a sound thats on another disk, you just cant have it simple as... you really need to have MPC Editor in the mix for NON hot swap option.

Hot swap CF on 3.11os however changes the game - 780meg and its fast, so that p*ss's on zips.

3.5os and hotswap - is even better

so answer is - if you have the right setup CF is miles better, if you don't advantages are so so.

[goldphinga]

So I'm shortly getting a set of 3.11 Roms, and I have rs16x and a mac would you suggest me grabbing a card reader?

[SEED78]

I've heard of rs16x, and I've gone so far as to DL it for future use - but have not had the need to use yet. so can't vouch for it as a good link in the chain.

If you can get a hot swap drive CF, 100% yes, not so easy to find specific ones that do work, and will just get harder to find, as will the Acard scsi to IDE bridges. as said above you can't just stick random ones in and hope for the best, you need to research, once I've got more info will share. guy on link above does have some in stock, I did the testing for him. he only has the non hot swap displayed for sale at the mo as the HS ones are fresh in and he only has a handful.

If you can't - then read all the above and think about if it really services your needs compared to a zip drive.

for me even as non hot swap it was a non brainer. but they are not without their problems, as are zips. think of specifically what your personal workflow (just sampling and using 780meg, or computer access with only 30 meg etc etc) is and apply all the limitations above to figure out whats best for you.

anyone london way needs a hand with this stuff let me know. will always help my 3000 brothers!

[SEED78]

a reminder from the above

regarding MPC 3000's with 3.11OS (or any non 3.5OS)

1) the 60+3000 are what seems just about one of the most fussy samplers for using an external or internal CF out there, compared to later Akai S Series/EMU/Ensoniq samplers at any rate.
2) there is one known external known to work - but its REAL rare! see near bottom of this starter guide - since scsiforsamplers.com has gone people are getting hold of Acard scsi to IDE bridge AEC-7720U (NOT the one with W on the end I've been told) and CF>IDE adapter tray + needed cables (see below)
3) NO hot swapping of CF cards without 3.5OS, disk MUST be inserted and removed with machine switched OFF. CORRECTION, LOOKS LIKE THIS ISN'T TRUE SEE MY MORE RECENT POST
2) even once ANY reader is installed or used externally you can only ever read 780 meg on ANY size of card (in a ton of 30meg partitions NOT one block) - when it comes to transfering to PC/MAC your computer NOT see the MPC formatted disc - if you format with MPC Editor you only have 1x30meg block that can be seen on the MPC+computer
3) without MPC Editor your computer will actually corrupt your CF card!! so resist ramming card with samples until you got a tried and tested method with a working card). you can format the CF in MPC editor first then use in the 3000, but THEN you'll only have one 30meg partition on the whole card even if its a 1GB/2GB/4GB

4) firmware on Acard or external drive needs to be taken into account - you can change this yourself, but easier not to... Acard 3.75 firmware is working for me, see below 3.79 might work too
5) not all brands of CF even work with the CF>IDE adapter - there are many variations of this adapter and variations of CF cards themselves, with mine currently Lexar 133x 1GB is working, transcend doesn't, doubt kingston will - possibly SanDisk Ultra II or III might work, will test those next.
6) can you handle your 3000 being out of action for a month while you go through all this?