using saturation/warmer plugins?

[statixx]

hows it going gs id just like to know where in your vocal plugin chain you guys are applying ur psp vintage warmers colortones or tapeheads? ive never used saturation plugins because i normally track vocals with a ua la 610 and it give me all the 'warmth' or tube feel i need. at my cousins house hes using a rane ms1b and a sp b1 its definitly got a good clean sound but maybe too clean at times. we have the gain on the PA peaking around -18 dbs i assume this is correct. ive recently downloaded voxegon tube amp a free plugin suggested to me and im trying to apply it to my chain to give my vocals more of a tube feel or warmth. would i apply this plug as a bus? or directly to the vocal track? where along the line should i apply it? any information helps in advance.

ps. ive heard its good to use these kinds of plug with drum tracks too. if so, do i use it in the same fashion?

[phillysoulman]

Originally Posted by statixx

hows it going gs id just like to know where in your vocal plugin chain you guys are applying ur psp vintage warmers colortones or tapeheads? ive never used saturation plugins because i normally track vocals with a ua la 610 and it give me all the 'warmth' or tube feel i need. at my cousins house hes using a rane ms1b and a sp b1 its definitly got a good clean sound but maybe too clean at times. we have the gain on the PA peaking around -18 dbs i assume this is correct. ive recently downloaded voxegon tube amp a free plugin suggested to me and im trying to apply it to my chain to give my vocals more of a tube feel or warmth. would i apply this plug as a bus? or directly to the vocal track? where along the line should i apply it? any information helps in advance.

ps. ive heard its good to use these kinds of plug with drum tracks too. if so, do i use it in the same fashion?

If I use one, I place it at the end of the chain if you are trying to simulate tape saturation.

I prefer the URS saturation plug in as well as the MC DSP Analog Channel.

[Audio Child]

i always apply at th begining then eq etc,

I say experiment different combinations and see what u prefer.

[RealSon]

The nomad factory tape/tube warmer works quite well too ...

[EBP]

I like the Colortone, or the PSP MixSaturation2 in combination with the MixPressor2, with less compression.. Or the Voxengo Saturation PlugIn...

[beat you down]

this seems to work just fine:

High-end plug-ins for Pro Tools

[gorillainthemix]

I use them mostly on drums. Good stuff

[e-smile-z]

nebula !!!!

[phillysoulman]

Originally Posted by Audio Child

i always apply at th begining then eq etc,

I say experiment different combinations and see what u prefer.

If you are going for "tape saturation" you would apply the plug at the end of the chain because the material hits the tape last.
The same especially applies to the 2 bus.
But hey,whatever floats your boat.

[The Beatsmith]

i use massey tapehead medium AU (free) if i want to warm, and the logic bitcrusher when i want a more aggressive sound (10 or 12 bit, leave the downsampling, and drive input to taste). this also give some noise, which is often nice.

you need to be careful to what the tapehead does to teh very highs and low mids though. a lot of the time i want to retain the clarity in the highs, but just get some distortion, so it's not quite perfect for everything

these days i use vintage warmer as a 'coloured' limiter instead of using it for actual flavour...

i've gone off colourtone pro... a lot of the time i put it on and think 'oh that sounds nice', but then later struggle with a problem and realise it's the colourtone. also, as the impulses aren't matched volume wise, a lot of the time it's hard to gauge if you're really hearing any improvment when the volume is jumping all over the place. and the 'warmth' just adds a flabbiness and muddiness that i don't like...

i use these things wherever they sound best, but often at the end for the reason described above. if i get in some 'cold' sample based stuff in to mix, i'll put it at the beginning to 'pretend' that it's coming off a tape real... the massey is good for this

cheers

[rhodesp04]

i use a few different ones:

massey tapehead (rarely)

mcdsp ac 1 -> use it for soft limiting

mcdsp ac 2 -> tape sat. on a buss once in a great while, but mainly i use it to tame 808's a lot to clear up some headroom and makes them come out on small speakers better

DuY Valve (has presets for different instruments) -> i use the male vox preset a lot on my vox.

[terrytee]

URS sat maybe on the buss but rarely use it these days, it sometimes gets some love on the snare.

If i use the waves SSL buss on the main 2 out i will often put the EMI TG Mastering EQs before hand just to boost up the bottom therefore compensating the tug of war effect that can be found with the SSL Buss Comp, it can sometimes suck out a lot of bottom end.

[PettyCash]

Originally Posted by phillysoulman

If you are going for "tape saturation" you would apply the plug at the end of the chain because the material hits the tape last.
The same especially applies to the 2 bus.
But hey,whatever floats your boat.

if you are looking to emulate warmth from a pre, apply your saturation of choice at the beginning of the chain. Tape works just as Philly has stated. Experimentation is always important though.

[statixx]

thanks alot you guys for the informative responses. so, i take it where to apply the plug is subjective but if i wana emulate PA warmth i would place it at the beginning of the chain and to emulate tape saturation place it at the end of the chain.

[phillysoulman]

Originally Posted by PettyCash

if you are looking to emulate warmth from a pre, apply your saturation of choice at the beginning of the chain. Tape works just as Philly has stated. Experimentation is always important though.

In fact,I often use the URS sat plug in the vocal chain,especially for some old school type vibe.

The Motor City pre set works great for this type of thing.

[Equiv_Exchange]

So would a SSL plug go after the preamp plug and before the tape plug?

[evillain]

So....to experiment....I put the URS Saturation plug on every channel of a 16 track session. I put it on the first insert, put it on the 30ips setting, and turned it up to 100% Saturation. I put one on every buss, but put it on the British Transformer Setting, and turned it up to 100%. On the Master Buss I put one more on the 30ips setting, and again turned it up to 100%.

I then started bringing up faders and mixed "into it".

I thought it sounded fantastic. Added a softness, a depth, and warmth I had not experienced before. I have used the plug more sparse previously, but never like it that much. This seems to be an extreme approach, but i truly thought it was fabulous, and the high end attenuation was subtle, but just right. And any distortion that occurred was really pleasant.

Anyone else try this? if not, do so....you may like it.

[phillysoulman]

Originally Posted by evillain

So....to experiment....I put the URS Saturation plug on every channel of a 16 track session. I put it on the first insert, put it on the 30ips setting, and turned it up to 100% Saturation. I put one on every buss, but put it on the British Transformer Setting, and turned it up to 100%. On the Master Buss I put one more on the 30ips setting, and again turned it up to 100%.

I then started bringing up faders and mixed "into it".

I thought it sounded fantastic. Added a softness, a depth, and warmth I had not experienced before. I have used the plug more sparse previously, but never like it that much. This seems to be an extreme approach, but i truly thought it was fabulous, and the high end attenuation was subtle, but just right. And any distortion that occurred was really pleasant.

Anyone else try this? if not, do so....you may like it.

Why not just place it at the end of the 2 bus if you want to saturate the entire mix??

[evillain]

i tried just that as well, but its really the sum of all the layers of saturation that sounded best to me. not just louder, but better.

[longbongsilver]

...and how much CPU did that take up before you added anything else?

[H-Rezz]

If it's on a channel i apply it first, that's how multitrack tape works, it hits the console inputs then you manipulate the sound with eq/comp etc , if it's on the master it goes last because that how you hit tape in your final stage ....YMMV

[Equiv_Exchange]

Originally Posted by phillysoulman

If you are going for "tape saturation" you would apply the plug at the end of the chain because the material hits the tape last.
The same especially applies to the 2 bus.
But hey,whatever floats your boat.

Originally Posted by H-Rezz

If it's on a channel i apply it first, that's how multitrack tape works, it hits the console inputs then you manipulate the sound with eq/comp etc , if it's on the master it goes last because that how you hit tape in your final stage ....YMMV

so which is it when it comes to a channel? tape first or last?

[down_town]

i use massey tapehead medium AU (free) if i want to warm

Another great free plug in is "channel" from air windows
Airwindows Audio Unit Plugins

Originally Posted by phillysoulman
If you are going for "tape saturation" you would apply the plug at the end of the chain because the material hits the tape last.
The same especially applies to the 2 bus.
But hey,whatever floats your boat.
Quote:
Originally Posted by H-Rezz
If it's on a channel i apply it first, that's how multitrack tape works, it hits the console inputs then you manipulate the sound with eq/comp etc , if it's on the master it goes last because that how you hit tape in your final stage ....YMMV

so which is it when it comes to a channel? tape first or
last?

Hello Equiv_Exchange

If you would like to have the sound of your of your whole mix printed to tape I would it last in the chain. Saturation/warmer plugs can sound great on individual channels and can really help blend soft synths/VI with real world instruments. Sometimes all a sound/soft synth needs is a little bit of tape/Saturation plugin rather than a whole load of plugins on it's channel.

One approach if I am using any type of Saturation/Warmer plug on my mix buss I like to first get a great sounding static mix. I then like to apply the Saturation and or any 2 buss compression and MIX INTO IT. That way the Saturation/Warmer plug is effecting the whole mix from the get go.

remember to experiment.

[phillysoulman]

Originally Posted by Equiv_Exchange

so which is it when it comes to a channel? tape first or last?

For me,its usually last.
However,I dont always use saturation plugs....only for "effect"

[smoke]

just do what sounds better, it's your song.

[Keyflo]

Bootsy makes a bangin tape plugin i forget the name but its free...I would love to get my hands on the URS saturation plugin one day tho

[phillysoulman]

Originally Posted by Keyflo

Bootsy makes a bangin tape plugin i forget the name but its free...I would love to get my hands on the URS saturation plugin one day tho

URS Sat is the truth..I aint lyin'

[Methlab]

URS is sick. I use it first and usually use the detroit pres, but I go by what sounds best.

Many times I follow up with the tape plug at the end if I need more warmth.

I put the saturator on every channel too, but sometimes I do it in my composition template if there are a lot of tracks. So when I bounce everything to audio before mixing, I already have used the URS on the tracks and they are all warmed up to be mixed..saves me some cpu.

[Equiv_Exchange]

thanks guys thumbsup

[Gduron]

vintage warmer 2 was a waste of money for me, didn't try the demo version before I made the purchase so that was my fault. Max Warm by Nomad Factory sounds much better in my opinion.