Tracking your synths
Eterny99
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#1
29th August 2005
Old 29th August 2005
  #1
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Thread Starter
Tracking your synths

How do you guys track your synths? do you run them through any specific pre-amps? or just directly into your AD / Tape / HD ?

I'm mainly use Triton through Mackie console, and into my AD.. and am quite satisfied with it (although I have to do heavy tweaking afterwards to give it more "meat" and make it sound better)... I find Korg synths generally sound more "thin" compared to Roland or Yamahas.. (I love the sound of Yamaha EX5.. except for the interfaces )

Would throwing in a few high quality pre-amps in the signal path make tide turning differences and save me all the work to give it a "meat"? I just can't see myself ditching my Triton.. RPPR just rules!

Cheers,
#2
29th August 2005
Old 29th August 2005
  #2
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r0ck1r0ck2's Avatar
 

well...
i blast mine through an old TraynorYBA-1A

you wanna beef it up...
plus the usual d.i. preamp thing
Eterny99
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#3
29th August 2005
Old 29th August 2005
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Thread Starter
thanks for your input,.. however, I honestly don't think D.Is are necessary on Triton (or any other "modern" synths for that matter)

any particular pre-amps you guys are using to track digital synths? or would that be just an overkill?

Cheers
#4
29th August 2005
Old 29th August 2005
  #4
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Stoneface's Avatar
 

I think it's really just a matter of taste. I used to fill up my studio and racks with tons of synths and modules but now I'd rather have different flavors of Di's/mic pre's to give me a more diverse pallet of colors. (Still need more though!)

Today, most mic pre's come with a built in Di. I use the Avalon U5's mostly. With drums, kicks, snares and hats particularly, I may run them out of the MPC into the ISA430 to utilize the eq and sometimes a dash of compression. I bought this unit for exactly that purpose and it suits me fine. Now if I could just get some Neve in my rack I could stop using the Focusrite pre for vocals.

I wouldn't go as far as to say that DI's are unnecesssary but with good converters you could get away with not having them. But this is Gearslutz.com, not bargainstudios.com so I say get some good di's and stop being so damn cheap.
#5
29th August 2005
Old 29th August 2005
  #5
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TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eterny99
thanks for your input,.. however, I honestly don't think D.Is are necessary on Triton (or any other "modern" synths for that matter)
I respectfully disagree.
Eterny99
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#6
29th August 2005
Old 29th August 2005
  #6
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont
I respectfully disagree.
sorry, I'm a bit confused now so.. D.I is critical for tracking synths? could you elaborate a bit on this plz?

I thought D.I was primarily used to convert from unbalanced to balanced signal... and I figured since most modern synths provide balanced out, I jumped ahead and assumed D.I won't be necessary (except to add colors etc..) plz correct me if I'm wrong...
#7
29th August 2005
Old 29th August 2005
  #7
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TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eterny99
sorry, I'm a bit confused now so.. D.I is critical for tracking synths? could you elaborate a bit on this plz?

I thought D.I was primarily used to convert from unbalanced to balanced signal... and I figured since most modern synths provide balanced out, I jumped ahead and assumed D.I won't be necessary (except to add colors etc..) plz correct me if I'm wrong...
Well yeah, the main purpose of a DI is to take an unbalanced -10 signal and convert it to a balanced +4 signal... It also lowers the impedance. I always track all keyboards through DI's and the added benefit of the color is great. Also, most modern keyboard do not have balanced outs only a handful of them do. I have an entire rack full of "modern" sound modules and none of them have balanced outs.
Eterny99
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#8
29th August 2005
Old 29th August 2005
  #8
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont
Well yeah, the main purpose of a DI is to take an unbalanced -10 signal and convert it to a balanced +4 signal... It also lowers the impedance. I always track all keyboards through DI's and the added benefit of the color is great. Also, most modern keyboard do not have balanced outs only a handful of them do. I have an entire rack full of "modern" sound modules and none of them have balanced outs.
Cool! thanks for your input! which D.Is would you recommend to be good starter for digital synths? (i.e. Triton, Motif, EX5 etc..), and if I may ask, what D.Is are you currently using? learning something new everyday! thanks!
#9
29th August 2005
Old 29th August 2005
  #9
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TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eterny99
Cool! thanks for your input! which D.Is would you recommend to be good starter for digital synths? (i.e. Triton, Motif, EX5 etc..), and if I may ask, what D.Is are you currently using? learning something new everyday! thanks!
I like using the DI's on various mic pre's...

API's

Aurora Audio GTQ2mkiii

Also, the Desk Doctor makes an 8 channel DI which is under $1000 and sounds really good.
#10
29th August 2005
Old 29th August 2005
  #10
Lives for gear
 

Totally agree with Tony ... I simply can't my Virus etc ... into my HD system. There simply isn't enough gain. I personally use the TAB v-71 DI's... sounds great!

Synth>TAB v71's > Apogee AD16x>Digital 192>Protools HD
#11
29th August 2005
Old 29th August 2005
  #11
Gear maniac
 

I use Korg Karma --> GR MP2-NV DIs--> Cranesong HEDD AD. Lots of tonal options there. This set up can go from clean to meaty. Overall it gives the sounds some "weight" vs. just running things line in into ADs. IME
#12
29th August 2005
Old 29th August 2005
  #12
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Does anybody have any experience with the radial JDI duplex on keyboards?
#13
29th August 2005
Old 29th August 2005
  #13
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Switchcraft's Avatar
 

The langevin DMMP has a synth input, it is not a DI nor is it a line input...

here is part of the manual...

it sounds pretty damn goo on motif MPC4000 and a sp1200.

We did include a 1/4 inch phone jack input for electronic instruments. This is not quite the same thing as a direct box because the input impedance is about 23K ohms compared to 1M ohms of a typical DI - which means it sucks for guitar and bass. It is intended for the dozens of synths and drum machines in many rooms. It provides a good input with gain control and EQ. You can use either the INSTRUMENT INPUT or MIC INPUT but not both at the same time.
#14
30th August 2005
Old 30th August 2005
  #14
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XHipHop's Avatar
 

Anyone like the Groove Tubes brick on synths? I'm about to pick up a pair.
#15
30th August 2005
Old 30th August 2005
  #15
Gear maniac
 

I never use a DI.
I always track my korg and kurzweil syths by using the digital outputs.
thus avoiding two conversions. (D to A and A to D) outboard converters such as apogee
make my synths sound better on play back than they ever sounded through their own
DA converter.
#16
30th August 2005
Old 30th August 2005
  #16
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Stoneface's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by XHipHop
Anyone like the Groove Tubes brick on synths? I'm about to pick up a pair.
Never used them but I hear they are great. If you pick em up...post your thoughts of them once you start doing some tracking.
#17
30th August 2005
Old 30th August 2005
  #17
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Kestral's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont
I respectfully disagree.
I agree with Tony's disgreement.
#18
30th August 2005
Old 30th August 2005
  #18
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r0ck1r0ck2's Avatar
 

for fuks sake!!! does ANYoNE actually track through an amp???
#19
30th August 2005
Old 30th August 2005
  #19
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SoulSpace's Avatar
 

If you want a dark and beefy tube sound look at a Reddi DI.
Eterny99
Thread Starter
#20
30th August 2005
Old 30th August 2005
  #20
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by r0ck1r0ck2
for fuks sake!!! does ANYoNE actually track through an amp???
I've run triton, roland jv through marshal, I loved keys and synth drums through it.. but was never realy happy with any other results I find tracking synths cleanest way possible works the best for me (since I do heavy tweaks afterwards)..

it seems D.I. are crucial and I have been underestimating them, thank you all for your inputs!
#21
30th August 2005
Old 30th August 2005
  #21
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insomnio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Johan
I never use a DI.
I always track my korg and kurzweil syths by using the digital outputs.
thus avoiding two conversions. (D to A and A to D) outboard converters such as apogee
make my synths sound better on play back than they ever sounded through their own
DA converter.
That's cool for the new synths like yours, but for me, the conversion is part of the sound. Specially in old synths (D50, JV1080, etc).

_____________________________________
Insomnio
#22
30th August 2005
Old 30th August 2005
  #22
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wallace's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont

Aurora Audio GTQ2mkiii

There you go! I just got mine back from being repaired and it sounds so sweet! I love to get as much color as I can on synths or anything DI.
#23
30th August 2005
Old 30th August 2005
  #23
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Stoneface's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by wallace
There you go! I just got mine back from being repaired and it sounds so sweet! I love to get as much color as I can on synths or anything DI.
Repaired? What happened to it?
#24
30th August 2005
Old 30th August 2005
  #24
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wallace's Avatar
This is what Geoff told me:

"It appears that a short or something overloaded the left channel's output stage and it allowed an excess current to be reflected to the output transformer primary, that slowly cooked until it became a short circuit. The ac toroidal transformer, over a period of time, I suspect, heated up driving the shorted output stage and that most have melted varnish causing a shorted turn, causing large amounts of ac current to be drawn and the reason for the fuses blowing."


He fixed it and I got it back, and it sounds SO sweet, like butter with the Ifet7 for vocals. I haven't heard it next to a 1073, but that would be an interesting comparison. Can anybody eloborate?
#25
30th August 2005
Old 30th August 2005
  #25
Moderator
 
TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by wallace
This is what Geoff told me:

"It appears that a short or something overloaded the left channel's output stage and it allowed an excess current to be reflected to the output transformer primary, that slowly cooked until it became a short circuit. The ac toroidal transformer, over a period of time, I suspect, heated up driving the shorted output stage and that most have melted varnish causing a shorted turn, causing large amounts of ac current to be drawn and the reason for the fuses blowing."


He fixed it and I got it back, and it sounds SO sweet, like butter with the Ifet7 for vocals. I haven't heard it next to a 1073, but that would be an interesting comparison. Can anybody eloborate?
When I first got mine I put it next to a pair of well maintained 1066's (same preamp stage as a 1073)... You can really hear the similarities in the preamps. They are very similar, I would say the GTQ is a little more open in the very upper frequencies. They have the same character, etc....

BTW, I love Geoff's response to the problem with the GTQ.... How many other companies would give such an in depth analysis of the problem you were having with your unit.
#26
30th August 2005
Old 30th August 2005
  #26
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kestral
I agree with Tony's disgreement.
I agree with Kestrals' agreement about Tonys' respectful disagreement.

Shane
#27
30th August 2005
Old 30th August 2005
  #27
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TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shan
I agree with Kestrals' agreement about Tonys' respectful disagreement.

Shane
I'm glad we are all in agreement... Ha Ha Ha...
#28
1st September 2005
Old 1st September 2005
  #28
Gear Head
 

I read about good thing for reddi and tab v71 di boxes but I want to hear these sounds.
Anyone can put wav files(or 320kbps mp3) dry and wet synth sound signal these di boxes?
#29
2nd September 2005
Old 2nd September 2005
  #29
Gear addict
 

Meh, you guys are going too far. I just pump them through my mackie 32x8 into the 192 i/o. Works like a charm.
#30
13th September 2005
Old 13th September 2005
  #30
Gear Head
 
kingsalmonella's Avatar
 

Not quite a DI, but I ended up buying a Synth Driver, basically 32 channels of line balancing with ground lift on each channel. It works great and remains hidden in the back of my equipment rack. I have a ton of synths and this seemed like a cost effective and clean alternative. At that point, you can still run synths into a DI/pre for coloration if needed. I usually end up tracking my Nord and Virus through a Distressor or running it through my Summit TPA-200B for warmth.

Here's a link:

http://www.sigt.com/Synth_Driver_Poster_Plus.shtml



--kingsalmonella
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