Remixing A Song But Dont Know The Tempo

[sevendaysoff]

if your in PT just turn elastic audio on and open the project browser window.

[ncoak]

i often find myself having to do stupid things like layering drums and other samples via midi over poorly-mixed, pre-sequenced 2 track instrumentals (). this requires a high degree of accuracy in bpm identification (as opposed to remixes, which can be ballpark'd, chopped etc.)...i find the most consistently reliable method is the mathematical one described above. i'm no mathematician, but wanted to clarify my 'formula' for doing this in case others find themselves in the same boat.

as noted, zoom in and put your cursor on the downbeat, then select as many bars as you need (more bars = more accuracy)....make sure you're right on the downbeat on both ends as accurately as possible.

now let's say:

X = time of selection in seconds
Y = number of beats in selection (number of bars * 4 for 4/4)

60 divided by X = Z
Z * Y = BPM

nice and sleazy.

[Monroe/Rampart]

Guess I shouldn't be surprised that "produsaz" and "scientistz" can't even find the track tempo, let alone be bothered to logically come to a conclusion on it, but I digress...

Ontopic - yeah, the mathematical stuff is pretty much flawless, except when it comes to song with numerous tempo switches, or live drums where the drummer was allowed to drum on with his natural groove and not act like a human drum machine. Years ago I've even made a table with lenghts of all major "tempos", so I could predict the best tempo for a sample immediately after I hear it, and kept it near my mixing desk...I don't know where it is today, but I still remember a couple of "important" ones. Like, 90 bpm is 10.666 seconds, 10 seconds is 96 bpm, 11 seconds is 87.273 bpm, 12 seconds is 80 bpm et cetera.

Or you could just load a loop into ReCycle, Guru or any other slicer-type plugin for that matter. But hey, why try to find a soulution on your own...

[J.Green]

Originally Posted by chris carter

my bad, this is the HIP-HOP forum... nobody here actually went to school....

Though you are correct about calculating the tempo, this is a very nonsensical statement. Not very good deductive reasoning.

[gorillainthemix]

Originally Posted by J.Green

Though you are correct about calculating the tempo, this is a very nonsensical statement. Not very good deductive reasoning.

spend some time on this section of GS and you'll find out why he said that.

[rallycapmusic]

WOW! L@@k at what I started, lol!

I was basically asking for tempo finding if Im doing a remix where its JUST vocals, accapella.

He hands me the track and its ALL VOCALS, lol! So im looking to but a track under it but its all set to a default tempo of 120BPM's.

I appreciate everyones input, its ALL useful. But I thing about me, you give a smart-ass remark Im gonna return it with MORE SMART-ASS responses back. Thats me, thats the Gemini in me, plus a lil "mama said dont take any s**t from ANYONE" lol!

Peace..

[PettyCash]

Originally Posted by rallycapmusic

WOW! L@@k at what I started, lol!

I was basically asking for tempo finding if Im doing a remix where its JUST vocals, accapella.

He hands me the track and its ALL VOCALS, lol! So im looking to but a track under it put its all set to a default tempo of 120BPM's.

I appreciate everyones input, its ALL useful. But I thing about me, you give a smart-ass remark Im gonna return it with MORE SMART-ASS responses back. Thats me, thats the Gemini in me, plus a lil "mama said dont take any s**t from ANYONE" lol!

Peace..

Every now and then some people have a stick up their ass that they need to pull out. Here at GS sometimes the well educated folk act no better than the poorly educated.

I gotta say though, you do ask a lot of questions that you should be able to figure out on your own with some more effort on your part; because of this, even when you have better questions to ask, when others see that it's you asking the question, it's like "Awww nawww... not this cat again...". Get what I'm saying?

[azwun25]

Wait....What's this "downbeat" you speak of? I only drop that club hype sh!t!

[ncoak]

Originally Posted by rallycapmusic

I was basically asking for tempo finding if Im doing a remix where its JUST vocals, accapella.

He hands me the track and its ALL VOCALS, lol! So im looking to but a track under it put its all set to a default tempo of 120BPM's.

Peace..

that's a little different...unless you're familiar with the song, or dude has a very predictable flow it'll be tough to tell. get him to send a copy of the original version and work from there.

i've had people send me shit to mix with no reference, and have ended up putting verses off by two beats - all wrong but ironically it sounded phonkier than when i put it back in the right place. bottom line: people need to do their jobs.

[rallycapmusic]

Originally Posted by PettyCash

Every now and then some people have a stick up their ass that they need to pull out. Here at GS sometimes the well educated folk act no better than the poorly educated.

I gotta say though, you do ask a lot of questions that you should be able to figure out on your own with some more effort on your part; because of this, even when you have better questions to ask, when others see that it's you asking the question, it's like "Awww nawww... not this cat again...". Get what I'm saying?

True! but you cant get on here and say "aww man this cat should know this and that" cause if thats the case then, whats the point of the forum being here. Its a free country dude, you dont HAVE to answer ANYTHING. What you wont answer, someone else will eventually! Thats my LEAST worry about this forum. Questions WILL get answered. I dont mind answering questions for a cat with less knowledge than me, it aint costing me a dime so why not answer it and share the knowledge>

Appreciate the thought tho..Peace!

[rallycapmusic]

Originally Posted by ncoak

that's a little different...unless you're familiar with the song, or dude has a very predictable flow it'll be tough to tell. get him to send a copy of the original version and work from there.

i've had people send me shit to mix with no reference, and have ended up putting verses off by two beats - all wrong but ironically it sounded phonkier than when i put it back in the right place. bottom line: people need to do their jobs.

I mean yeah i can pretty much "tap" the tempo in on a vocal but by me knowing it wont be 100% accurate, what should i do to keep the sync and not have it "drift"

[Chris Lago]

The first thing I ask when I get asked to do a remix is this:

What is the tempo of the track?

[tonymission]

Originally Posted by rallycapmusic

I mean yeah i can pretty much "tap" the tempo in on a vocal but by me knowing it wont be 100% accurate, what should i do to keep the sync and not have it "drift"

What you should do is READ THIS THREAD.

[IM WHO YOU THINK]

Originally Posted by chris carter

Why don't you just zoom in, find a downbeat (or any other beat) and then go a few measures ahead (like 4 or 8) and find the same beat. Then measure the time (point_B - point_A = elapsed_time). Then just cross multiply and divide to get the beats per minute. I do this all the time and it takes me like 30 seconds and it's damn accurate.

I don't want to seem harsh, but "how do I find the tempo" questions come up on this forum all the freakin' time. It's litterally 4th grade math. Oh, my bad, this is the HIP-HOP forum... nobody here actually went to school....

You do know that you are in the hip hop forum posting as well right?

[Chris Lago]

I actually go to college so I don't see the relevance of his sarcastic answer either.

[MYAMS]

Originally Posted by chrislago

I actually go to college so I don't see the relevance of his sarcastic answer either.

you aint exactly hip hop so don't take it to offense

Neither am I, but whether I can count is another question

[Darwin James]

bah.

[Chris Lago]

Originally Posted by MYAMS

you aint exactly hip hop so don't take it to offense

Neither am I, but whether I can count is another question

Dude I can barely count either

Everybody knows that college is more about partying than anything

[Justice]

TAP TEMPO on the MPC ova here.

Just did a remix for Cassie F Diddy....

all by ear....

can I post and show off a little????

[Jonkr]

I havent used protools in a while so cant instruct u on how to use beat detective but u can just count how many beats are in 15 second and multiply by 4... or if you have logic u can dump it in there and use the bpm detector plugin

[superjc]

Well, they way I do it is make a perfect loop of the original in Wavelab, load that into Recycle, and it will tell me the exact BPM. Then when I load the acapella into Cubase, set the master bpm to that tempo. If it starts to vary, look/listen to the waveform with the metronome playing- is it getting behind, or speeding ahead of the clock? Sometimes I have to use the awesome "time warp" tool where you drag the bar TO THE WAVEFORM and Cubase will calculate a tempo adjustment out to .0009 of one beat. I have seen songs that had changes/wobble from R.Kelly, Timbaland, and others (could be from 2" tape transfers or whatever).

[Justice]

Just posted a remix I did in the "Checkout my mix" post...

Check it out!!!

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/rap-h...-thread-2.html

Jus

[RonT]

Originally Posted by chris carter

Why don't you just zoom in, find a downbeat (or any other beat) and then go a few measures ahead (like 4 or 8) and find the same beat. Then measure the time (point_B - point_A = elapsed_time). Then just cross multiply and divide to get the beats per minute. I do this all the time and it takes me like 30 seconds and it's damn accurate.

I don't want to seem harsh, but "how do I find the tempo" questions come up on this forum all the freakin' time. It's litterally 4th grade math. Oh, my bad, this is the HIP-HOP forum... nobody here actually went to school....

WTF? I find that to be just outright disrespectful! I am in the HipHop forum and I have a Masters Degree. I listen to it and some of the smartest people have made Millions in this business.

I don't think you know how offending that comment is and if you do then shame on you!

[chris carter]

Okay, most people got it. For those that didn't, I'M SORRY. The education thing was a JOKE. Most people laughed because they get it. To those that didn't laugh, I sincerely apologize. For the record, my dumbass graduated magna cum laude and I'm in this forum on a regular basis and have produced/mixed an assload of hip-hop.

Notice however, that I DID actually answer the OP's question

[ryst]

Originally Posted by RonT

WTF? I find that to be just outright disrespectful! I am in the HipHop forum and I have a Masters Degree. I listen to it and some of the smartest people have made Millions in this business.

I don't think you know how offending that comment is and if you do then shame on you!

It's a free country. He can say whatever he wants. And he was joking. It's sad that you decided to get offended at all. And, yes, getting offended is a decision, and thats what you decided to do.

[PettyCash]

Originally Posted by rallycapmusic

True! but you cant get on here and say "aww man this cat should know this and that" cause if thats the case then, whats the point of the forum being here. Its a free country dude, you dont HAVE to answer ANYTHING. What you wont answer, someone else will eventually! Thats my LEAST worry about this forum. Questions WILL get answered. I dont mind answering questions for a cat with less knowledge than me, it aint costing me a dime so why not answer it and share the knowledge>

Appreciate the thought tho..Peace!

The point of this forum is to come here and share ideas, and for up and comers like yourself to try and learn a good thing or too. To uphold the right type of atmosphere though, we have to pay attention to how we conduct our conversations and especially to what questions we ask and how we ask our questions.

If you want my personal opinion, you could really try approaching what you do in a more professional manner. This could mean actually trying to use the search function or google to find some of the answers you are looking for; or anytime you can't find answers on your own, ask clear and concise questions and carry yourself as best as possible throughout that thread.

I was trying to find a similar question out about a year or 2 ago... did I come on here and make a post about it? No. I used google and got some decent answers, enough for me to go back to work and figure out how to get what I needed done. The advice Chris Carter gave you was very useful, because no matter what you are using or where you are, you can use that technique to find out the tempo with the highest amount of accuracy. Your excuse was that you are lazy to do the math... one of the biggest woes of today's society... "I'm Lazy"; and your wrong... this does cost something. It costs time to be on here sharing whatever knowledge you got. It cost time and money to gain that knowledge in the first place. Like Ken said in another post, being able to come here and receive this knowledge is like free college.

If you only care about doing this as a hobby then fine, none of this will really matter to you, but if you have hopes of doing this as some type of job someday you cant go around annoying the heck out of everybody to get what you want. Have a bit of consideration before you come on here is all I'm saying. I'm sure that would be no sweat off your back, and you will find that people will be more than willing to help you out the best they can.

[rallycapmusic]

Originally Posted by PettyCash

The point of this forum is to come here and share ideas, and for up and comers like yourself to try and learn a good thing or too. To uphold the right type of atmosphere though, we have to pay attention to how we conduct our conversations and especially to what questions we ask and how we ask our questions.

If you want my personal opinion, you could really try approaching what you do in a more professional manner. This could mean actually trying to use the search function or google to find some of the answers you are looking for; or anytime you can't find answers on your own, ask clear and concise questions and carry yourself as best as possible throughout that thread.

I was trying to find a similar question out about a year or 2 ago... did I come on here and make a post about it? No. I used google and got some decent answers, enough for me to go back to work and figure out how to get what I needed done. The advice Chris Carter gave you was very useful, because no matter what you are using or where you are, you can use that technique to find out the tempo with the highest amount of accuracy. Your excuse was that you are lazy to do the math... one of the biggest woes of today's society... "I'm Lazy"; and your wrong... this does cost something. It costs time to be on here sharing whatever knowledge you got. It cost time and money to gain that knowledge in the first place. Like Ken said in another post, being able to come here and receive this knowledge is like free college.

If you only care about doing this as a hobby then fine, none of this will really matter to you, but if you have hopes of doing this as some type of job someday you cant go around annoying the heck out of everybody to get what you want. Have a bit of consideration before you come on here is all I'm saying. I'm sure that would be no sweat off your back, and you will find that people will be more than willing to help you out the best they can.

LMAO Are you kidding me dude? PLEASE!
Maybe its a hobby to YOU but DEFINANTLY NOT a hobby to ME, I got the ASCAP check stubs to prove it also. AND NO I DIDNT NEED TEMPO FINDING TRICKERY TO GET EM EITHER! The tempo finding is NEW TO ME NOW because I NEVER HAD THE NEED for it till NOW. Whoa is me, sue me for NOT knowing how to find a tempo, GRRRR!!

One thing about certain clowns on here thats funny to me. You take simple topics LIKE THIS ONE and RUN like hell with em, which keep me LMAO. If you got helpful info, share it. If you feel you gotta be a smart ass with a smart ass remarks instead of NOT giving any positive feedback, DONT RESPOND! Who REALLY looks silly here? I started the thread, read the POSITIVE, HELPFUL tips, gave my thank yous and MOVED ON. Truthfully I FORGOT I posted it! Ive been to Canada and back to STILL find yall on this SAME TOPIC going back and forward with each other, cheap shots at me in between. With all the "KNOWLEDGE" you guys "supposed" to have, I would think you had BIGGER FISH TO FRY than sit up on this "wasting ya time" leaving stupid remarks instaed of sharing the knowledge.

Me not knowing how to find a "tempo" is something YOU knew about that I didnt. Me cashing ASCAP checks and YOU not, is signs of me KNOWING something that YOU DONT!

Its a dead issue to me. For those with the helpful info, THANKS MUCH once again! For those with the dumb ass responses, YOU dont even count, lol! Now go make music and make money..PEACE

[rallycapmusic]

Originally Posted by Makinithappen

Great post in general and this is very true. You wanna know how I learned to get tempos? By being an intern and having the engineer exit the room with 5 pissed off clients sitting behind me paying big bucks an hour. You learn not to make mistakes that way. Especially when the head engineer comes into the room and laughs in your face in front of everyone at your inability to do simple math. People sure have it lucky now... Come ask pros at GS and then get mad at them when they suggest a Google search? He'll go far.






Really... ? You're an idiot.

I'm surprised you managed to put the right address on your ascap forms for those "mad checks you be gettin".

I like how you refer to tempo finding as "trickery", as well. Like getting the tempo of something is witchcraft? Good thing we wern't around 200 years ago. Chris and I would be burned at the stake.

You lack the basic courtesy to simply thank the people who gave you the correct advice like Chris (and I will give credit to the people who said use "Identify Beat" since that is just a calculator in PT that does the same math) and instead, lash out at the pros while embracing all the home guys that tell you to look at your watch and count snare drums for one minute or tap out the tempo (because that's probably close enough, anyway, right?) Next time I have some major label work come through, I'll have to try that trick. (no offense at all to the guys that originally posted those)

Who really looks silly here? Ummmm... You.

Thats my exit from the hip hop forum. Good luck with your ascap checks.... I'm sure you aren't making that up.

Na! Its YOU pimp, that looks silly. About tempo finding? "work smarter NOT harder" but YOUR doin EXACTLY what I talked about in my last post, IF U REALLY READ IT or maybe you "skimmed" through it looking for more ish to harp on, lol!

Some of you cats never stop amazing me!

[rallycapmusic]

Originally Posted by Synthy08

Remixing is SOOOOO hard!......i get like 30 seconds perfect then it goes ALL over the place.

True!

[rallycapmusic]

Originally Posted by voicegenius

This is the best piece of free software you'll ever need... Are you on a Mac?

MixMeister Free Stuff :: BPM Analyzer

Thank YOU!