studio foam and Se Reflection Filter

[jr8084]

i was looking for a way to get better rap vocal recordings, and i record in a untreated bedroom in my house. So i was wondering if i can turn my closet into a vocal booth. I was gonna put studio foam in it and use a Se Reflection Filter. The measurments of my closet is, width=3ft, lenght=5ft, and height=8ft. So would this be a good idea or should i look into something else. If So what would be some suggestions? Thanks

[phillysoulman]

Originally Posted by jr8084

i was looking for a way to get better rap vocal recordings, and i record in a untreated bedroom in my house. So i was wondering if i can turn my closet into a vocal booth. I was gonna put studio foam in it and use a Se Reflection Filter. The measurments of my closet is, width=3ft, lenght=5ft, and height=8ft. So would this be a good idea or should i look into something else. If So what would be some suggestions? Thanks

Forget the closet,homes..unless its at least six by nine with a 10 foot ceiling

[davew]

yeah, i would forget that closet unless you deaden it 100%, and foam will not do that. Find another room that sounds good.

[sleeper1400]

Originally Posted by jr8084

i was looking for a way to get better rap vocal recordings, and i record in a untreated bedroom in my house. So i was wondering if i can turn my closet into a vocal booth. I was gonna put studio foam in it and use a Se Reflection Filter. The measurments of my closet is, width=3ft, lenght=5ft, and height=8ft. So would this be a good idea or should i look into something else. If So what would be some suggestions? Thanks

ya bro,
skip the closet treatment. its not necessary.

the logic is this, a cardiod/hyper cardiod pattern is going to reject outside nice anyway. so, look into somthing like this. http://www.music123.com/SMPro-Audio-...20887.Music123

i understand the price is outrageous. but something like this is what you should be going for.

[Osten Powers]

Take a look at the Studio construction & acoustics forum here on gearslutz!

[chris carter]

Closets are bad, unless you a) deaden the HOLY SNOT out of them (difficult to do with foam), or b) you LIKE the boxy obnoxious filtery sound.

If you want a great solution, here's what you do. Everybody write this down. This assumes using a cardioid microphone:

1) Go to Ross or some other mega discount store and buy two queen or king-sized plain comforters (ie. duvet).

2) Bust out your sewing machine and stich them together to make one big huge comforter. Now sew little loops along the top edge. You'll need at least three.

3) Go to the store and buy some little cup hooks and screw them into the ceiling in a "V" shape. The open part is where you will put the mic and the corner is where your back will be facing (for a vocalist).

4) Hang it up.

5) Stand/sit with your back into the corner of your curtain with the mic in front of you pointing into the curtain. If you want it really dead, move into the corner. If you want it a little more live, move further out of the "V". When you are done tracking, take it down (takes 30 seconds to put up / take down).

This will work way better than any of the reflection filter type devices with some extra benefits: 1) no comb filtering messing with the sound; 2) it will cost maybe $50. 3) doesn't mess with your sight lines; 4) faster to put up/take down. BTW - it will also help cut out other noise (computer fans, etc.)

Don't believe me? I now cut all vocals in the control room using this method.

[jr8084]

Hey thanks for all the replys everyone! It really help me out and save me from wasting money on something that wouldn't benifit me!

[solidstate]

I don't why everyone is making a big deal for something so simple. Hang some acoustic foam behind the singer, place the RF on the mic stand, place the mic fairly close(not too close though)to the RF, use a pop filter and voila. It should give you fairly dry vocals.

[chris carter]

Originally Posted by solidstate

I don't why everyone is making a big deal for something so simple. Hang some acoustic foam behind the singer, place the RF on the mic stand, place the mic fairly close(not too close though)to the RF, use a pop filter and voila. It should give you fairly dry vocals.

And I don't know why people spend money on the RF.... lol

The comforter trick IS pretty dang simple. It took me about 10 minutes worth of work and cost me less than $50. Works better too thumbsup

[Mudnoc]

Honesty speaking... My current booth (closet) is 5x9 and extremely dead (use a bunch of those cubicle walls and Auralex inside) and I get great results.. probably supporting what other members have said ("Unless it's completely dead.") Obviously everything is close mic'd and I mainly record hip-hop but it works for me..

Mudnoc "The Mad Engineer"

MySpace.com - Mudnoc "The Mad Engineer" - 33 - Male - ATLANTA, Georgia - www.myspace.com/mudnoc

[bencahill]

And I don't know why people spend money on the RF.... lol

Cos you can use it for more than vocals.

[chris carter]

I can do two mics on an acoustic guitar with the comforter setup. Actually, I can do that PLUS mic the vocal at the same time - that's three mics. I can do multiple mics on a guitar stack. You need additional RFs for any of those.

I'm not saying there aren't pluses for the RF, but the comforter method is definitely more flexible. What it ISN'T is something you can move around the room too easily or take to another studio that isn't set up for it. But as far as flexibility of what you can use it on, I think the comforter method wins hands down. I've used both the comforter method and the RF, so I'm comparing with real-world experience.

Not knockin' the thing, just saying that it is what it is. It's main strength is not it's effectiveness in cutting down reflections, or flexibilty of instrumentation. It's main strength is portability - and for that, it's awesome.

I just find it curious that it's so insanely popular in hip-hop where 99% of what people are using it for is vocals in their own place when there is a significantely cheaper and significantly more effective solution. Perhaps it's because the RF looks "blingy"

[jr8084]

Chris Carter, Can you post some pic's of the comforter setup so i can get a idea of how it looks like and i how i'll be able of putting one up myself if i choose to try it out. thanks

[chris carter]

Here are some photos. Sorry about the quality, but I just tried to throw this together really quickly and used my cell phone for convenience.

The first one shows the seam where the two comforters were stitched together along with one of the loops for hanging. This is VERY basic stitchwork that took me maybe 10 minutes for the entire project.

The second shows the loop hung from the ceiling. This curtain has three such loops and corrosponding hooks which make a right angle "V" shape. It takes me less than 30 seconds to hang it up or take it down and fold it up to store it away.

The third pic shows the whole thing with a mic set up. I tried to get my wife to stand in as a singer, but she was on her way to swim practice. But you can see from the pop filter where the vocalist obviously stands relative to the mic. The way the boom is poitioned kind of creates a bit of an optical illusion, but in reality there's about 4' between the mic and the corner.

The general principle is that the back of a cardioid mic rejects most sound (hence the name "cardioid"). So really, you need to cut down reflections entering the FRONT of the microphone. Because there is nothing behind the mic and, in fact, the vocal is uninhibited traveling out into the larger room, you don't get any boxiness or phase issues (what some people complain about with the RF). Sound going out into the room must bounce off at least one wall, come back and travel through the curtain. It then must bounce off the wall behind the curtain and travel back through the curtain yet again before it can hit the front of the microphone. As you can see, there is nothing blocking any sightlines between singer and producer and there's enough space for a wide variety of micing applications. If you wanted to get fancy, you could buy fancy looking comforters and use five hooks so it hangs a little straighter.

[jr8084]

Cool, Thanks for the visual of it and im gonna give it a try! And if it ends up working out great for me then it saved me some 250 dollers and if it doesn't then im only out 50 and ill try the RF. But thanks alot for the tip tho chris

[Chris Lago]

Chris, I just don't know if my clients would like the aesthetics of the whole thing. I want my home studio to still look professional.

[chris carter]

Originally Posted by chrislago

Chris, I just don't know if my clients would like the aesthetics of the whole thing. I want my home studio to still look professional.

Hmmmm... I have lots of clients

[babyface_finsta]

Mudnoc.... Just checked out your Myspace... Dope!!!

[Simon FP]

^^ yeah that mad engineer track was on point

I record vocal with the same approach as chris carter but i put a lot more things to deaden the room.
I put a mattress with a duvet over behind the rapper, 4 layer of duvet on a side, a standing futon on the other and all the cushion i find in the corners.
that work good, it's just a hassle to setup but I don't care I don't record that often so I never compromise.

[Swami Digital]

Originally Posted by chrislago

Chris, I just don't know if my clients would like the aesthetics of the whole thing. I want my home studio to still look professional.

Hang a nice looking curtain in front of the comforters?

[ether88]

Originally Posted by chrislago
Chris, I just don't know if my clients would like the aesthetics of the whole thing. I want my home studio to still look professional.
Hang a nice looking curtain in front of the comforters?

if your good it doesnt matter...
-look at great river pres/RNP/ect ugly, but way better then gold mpa, p solo (shiny pretty ones)

When i get my new set-up It'll be with something like this or Simple Soundbooth

[solidstate]

Originally Posted by chris carter

Here are some photos. Sorry about the quality, but I just tried to throw this together really quickly and used my cell phone for convenience.

The first one shows the seam where the two comforters were stitched together along with one of the loops for hanging. This is VERY basic stitchwork that took me maybe 10 minutes for the entire project.

The second shows the loop hung from the ceiling. This curtain has three such loops and corrosponding hooks which make a right angle "V" shape. It takes me less than 30 seconds to hang it up or take it down and fold it up to store it away.

The third pic shows the whole thing with a mic set up. I tried to get my wife to stand in as a singer, but she was on her way to swim practice. But you can see from the pop filter where the vocalist obviously stands relative to the mic. The way the boom is poitioned kind of creates a bit of an optical illusion, but in reality there's about 4' between the mic and the corner.

The general principle is that the back of a cardioid mic rejects most sound (hence the name "cardioid"). So really, you need to cut down reflections entering the FRONT of the microphone. Because there is nothing behind the mic and, in fact, the vocal is uninhibited traveling out into the larger room, you don't get any boxiness or phase issues (what some people complain about with the RF). Sound going out into the room must bounce off at least one wall, come back and travel through the curtain. It then must bounce off the wall behind the curtain and travel back through the curtain yet again before it can hit the front of the microphone. As you can see, there is nothing blocking any sightlines between singer and producer and there's enough space for a wide variety of micing applications. If you wanted to get fancy, you could buy fancy looking comforters and use five hooks so it hangs a little straighter.

I don't thing you need hangin' that thing in your room to get dry vocals. The RF, if used properly, reject comb filtering. Just use some studio foam on the wall behind the singer. If you want a drier sound put a couple of acoustic tiles on the ceiling too. But that's about it. RF+studio foam look way better/more professional too

[chris carter]

Originally Posted by ether88

if your good it doesnt matter...
-look at great river pres/RNP/ect ugly, but way better then gold mpa, p solo (shiny pretty ones)

When i get my new set-up It'll be with something like this or Simple Soundbooth

That simple soundbooth thing is a cool idea. The only thing is that it's set up backwards. Have the cardioid mic pointing INTO the booth, not away from it. This is the single biggest mistake I see people make when trying to cut down reflections because they don't take into consideration the actual physics. On the surface it SEEMS like pointing your voice into the booth is the right approach, but when you really think about it, you are working against the laws of physics instead of with them.

[chris carter]

Originally Posted by solidstate

I don't thing you need hangin' that thing in your room to get dry vocals. The RF, if used properly, reject comb filtering. Just use some studio foam on the wall behind the singer. If you want a drier sound put a couple of acoustic tiles on the ceiling too. But that's about it. RF+studio foam look way better/more professional too

Where's the 'hitting head against wall' smiley???

[solidstate]

Originally Posted by chris carter

Where's the 'hitting head against wall' smiley???

Well, we all have different opinions, do we? No offense, but i'm not a fan of DIY stuff..

[Nahuel]

My setup looks a lot like Chris one exept I do it in the middle of the room with 3 conforters hanged on paravents (like a "u" behind the vocalist) I use the RF in addition, I had a thread about that in here where I've been schooled by a couple of cool heads:

DIY-ing the world cheapest vocal booth/reflection filter

[voicegenius]

Or you can take tips from this dude... I did....

Winter fun with PVC


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