Identify this Dre and Daz Bass Sound!

[orangeoctane]

Hey guys!

I've always wondered what kind of synth or production technique is used for a particular bass sound that I've heard over the years by Dre and Daz. To me it's fattest bass of all time and for a long time I figured it was a Minimoog until I bought one (an Original and a Voyager) and am having a hell of a time recreating the sound so I'm thinking that either I'm not proficient enough as a programmer to tweak these boards into that sound or that it's not a MiniMoog afterall or there is a technique used in processing the sound that I haven't been able to figure out.

Anyway, here's a list of songs where the bass is heard. If you can identify the instrument used and/or the technique I'd be ETERNALLY GRATEFUL!

Tupac - Skandalouz (the bass in the very beginning of the song)
Tupac - California Love (remix)
Tupac - Check Out Time
Daz Dillenger - In California
Dr. Dre - Dre Day
Dr. Dre - Keep Their Heads Ringin (may be a different synth?)

--------------------
DEE4

[STARSKI]

that's either a mini moog or an SE-1 its all about getting the right patch and how you play it. those songs use a lot of pitch bending to get that growl sound. change the pitch bend from 2 to 12 to get a full octave to get that, but it has to be with the right sound!

[orangeoctane]

I've owned an SE-1 before and same thing. Could never really get *that sound*. I can play well enough to fake the performance but could never quite get that signature phat growl/buzz. It sounds like an oscillator does when it's played too low except theirs sounds musical.

[MYAMS]

Originally Posted by orangeoctane

I've owned an SE-1 before and same thing. Could never really get *that sound*. I can play well enough to fake the performance but could never quite get that signature phat growl/buzz. It sounds like an oscillator does when it's played too low except theirs sounds musical.

probably from the sources mentioned... just tweak someone and consider how the record was mixed

[lpuma]

I think that a part of the "phatness" come from the way these tracks been tracked/mixed/mastered.

here's a suggestion:

If you got a good pre try to DI the synth into the pre and record it.

If it's not enought rerecord it but drive the input of the pre then blend the saturated track with the clean one.

We did it the other day at a lil studio (the sound was from trilogy and the pre was a chandler TG2) and it really added some balls to the bass line, was a totally different style to... the studio guy is a schooled engineer and was like "wtf are you trying to do? we'll have phase issues yadada" but at the end he liked the result.

[orangeoctane]

so like maybe pushed hard (transformer or tube sat) on the way in and then a brickwalled LPF to kill the higher frequency and, more audible, distortion?

[STARSKI]

thats odd i seemed to have been able to get those sounds out of my SE-1 but i can see how a bit of distortion or harmonics might bring up the growling sound of it. but i think you should start with the right patch.

[Hot Lipps]

Dre Day is fa sho a Minimoog. I got a lil phatty and can come up wit some like that but not "like" it if you know what I mean. I run the LP thru a Big Muff at times as well to dirty it up some. I would go into the electronic forum and ask. Got some serious synth slutz who could help.

[Hot Lipps]

Originally Posted by STARSKI

thats odd i seemed to have been able to get those sounds out of my SE-1 but i can see how a bit of distortion or harmonics might bring up the growling sound of it. but i think you should start with the right patch.

I think it's really in the synth programming and the actual synth in general. The minimoog has no patch memory so not even Dre could program that exact same bass. I think the midimoog by Studio Electronics is the closet you can get without getting an actual model D, and even then only half of thoes used the actual parts and components of a minimoog. The second batch used different parts and components and won't sound quite the same. (or so I have been told)

[STARSKI]

Originally Posted by Hot Lipps

I think it's really in the synth programming and the actual synth in general. The minimoog has no patch memory so not even Dre could program that exact same bass. I think the midimoog by Studio Electronics is the closet you can get without getting an actual model D, and even then only half of thoes used the actual parts and components of a minimoog. The second batch used different parts and components and won't sound quite the same. (or so I have been told)

This is true but at the point that a lot of the Dre/ Death Row stuff was coming out, a lot of people were using SE-1's instead of mini-moogs. IMO they are very close and you can definitely get that kind of sound out of them.

[IM WHO YOU THINK]

It seems to me that Daz uses a bunch of JD990 sounds on the Dog pound albums.

[MYAMS]

Originally Posted by Hot Lipps

Dre Day is fa sho a Minimoog. I got a lil phatty and can come up wit some like that but not "like" it if you know what I mean. I run the LP thru a Big Muff at times as well to dirty it up some. I would go into the electronic forum and ask. Got some serious synth slutz who could help.

wouldnt recommend it those dudes suck... amateur enthusiast- stay away... Very hateful and in there own "world" if you know what I mean.

[alexp]

Originally Posted by MYAMS

wouldnt recommend it those dudes suck... amateur enthusiast- stay away... Very hateful and in there own "world" if you know what I mean.

Nah bitch, we just are hateful of idiots like you. Post up for sure guys your welcome over there. Myams, is a little bitch and is most certainly not welcome. We know your not all as retarded, stuck up, arrogant and just plain dumb as this hilarious moron, so by all means come say hey, and ask away!!


As for this, I would wager that its probably a Voyager as Dre seems to love the thing! If you dont have one, experiment with any sort of monosynth. Definitely put it through some sort of big sounding eq(any Allen & Heath board), and maybe a little distortion. The best is to try sampling the sound through your monitors, clipped a bit, and then once its in the sampler, go through and resample through a nice eq section. Should get you pretty close to what your looking for.


alexP (who is super friendly like the rest of the electronic music section)

[g22]

not sure if this applies to analog synths, but tweaking the cutoff and resonance helps me get a similar sound on a digital synth.

also, take into considertion some of those tracks may have been done with a bass guitar run through an effects pedal, but i'm sure alot of the 90's westcoast fat synth bass can be reproduced very well on a minimoog. you'll probably never get it to sound exact, but that will give you a better sound than most synths. i'd keep it.

i'm not familiar with how it operates, but if u can try layering a sine wave with a sawtooth, with the sine at like octave -3, 0r -4 and the sawtooth around -2. that would give you the buzz/growl along with the deep sub bass. eq'ing/compression is probably crucial as well. also when you get something you like, try adding a slight wah effect for extra growl.

[cal1]

skandalouz and check out time have real bass guitars.

[butterfly]

................Another thing to consider, is that the early 90's stuff will have been tracked to tape.

[Hot Lipps]

Originally Posted by butterfly

................Another thing to consider, is that the early 90's stuff will have been tracked to tape.

That too.

[Teo Macero]

Originally Posted by alexp

Nah bitch, we just are hateful of idiots like you. Post up for sure guys your welcome over there. Myams, is a little bitch and is most certainly not welcome. We know your not all as retarded, stuck up, arrogant and just plain dumb as this hilarious moron, so by all means come say hey, and ask away!!


As for this, I would wager that its probably a Voyager as Dre seems to love the thing! If you dont have one, experiment with any sort of monosynth. Definitely put it through some sort of big sounding eq(any Allen & Heath board), and maybe a little distortion. The best is to try sampling the sound through your monitors, clipped a bit, and then once its in the sampler, go through and resample through a nice eq section. Should get you pretty close to what your looking for.


alexP (who is super friendly like the rest of the electronic music section)

yea, that wasn't hateful at all.....

[CDS]

Originally Posted by orangeoctane

Hey guys!

I've always wondered what kind of synth or production technique is used for a particular bass sound that I've heard over the years by Dre and Daz. To me it's fattest bass of all time and for a long time I figured it was a Minimoog until I bought one (an Original and a Voyager) and am having a hell of a time recreating the sound so I'm thinking that either I'm not proficient enough as a programmer to tweak these boards into that sound or that it's not a MiniMoog afterall or there is a technique used in processing the sound that I haven't been able to figure out.

Anyway, here's a list of songs where the bass is heard. If you can identify the instrument used and/or the technique I'd be ETERNALLY GRATEFUL!

Tupac - Skandalouz (the bass in the very beginning of the song)
Tupac - California Love (remix)
Tupac - Check Out Time
Daz Dillenger - In California
Dr. Dre - Dre Day
Dr. Dre - Keep Their Heads Ringin (may be a different synth?)

--------------------
DEE4

California Love (RMX) is one of the best produced beats of all time IMO... and that bass is indeed strong..

But it is a Mini Moog with mixing (SSL) on it.. even though you will not get that sound without proper "mixing", what is used during mixing that may help you at the production stage is the BF76 plugin (those tracks used the hardware unit UA 1176) in protools and for easy measure add some maxx-bass but you can boost the low mid a bit and get what your looking for... the most important thing about that bass is the limiter (BF76) keeping the signal headroom controlled and centered...

Reason 4.0 has all these sounds in it stock... all of the classic keyboards are in there but they do not name them after the keyboard themselves though..

I use to underestimate Reason until a few years ago I witnessed the producer Rocwilder redo the entire intro to MJ "Beat It" to a beat in his truck with just a laptop. All those classic keyboards are in there, take some time to go through them to find what your looking for.

[megah]

Hi

I read somewhere before i did music

That they always layered an synth bass and a real bass played by mike elizondo so maybe you should check that out

[Jermaine]

Originally Posted by megah

Hi

I read somewhere before i did music

That they always layered an synth bass and a real bass played by mike elizondo so maybe you should check that out

its very difficult do layer a bass guitar and a synth, that they sound like one. but dre has the best players and producers.

but was a bassist too, and i recorded these bass with my real guitar and synth effects on it (like bootsy collins).

[STARSKI]

Originally Posted by megah

Hi

I read somewhere before i did music

That they always layered an synth bass and a real bass played by mike elizondo so maybe you should check that out

That is a classic funk technique, after all, all the Dre stuff from that era was based on P-Funk (G-Funk). A lot of the times the real bass is playing a slightly different bassline though giving it a layered funky type of groove to it. I don't see it being so hard to get that type of sound from a lot of the virtual synths which have gotten very good and/ or a SE-1 or Minimoog voyager. It might never be the "exact" patch that you are hearing but it's not that hard to get very close. I was just listening to one of my older tracks that had a bass on it like that which used my SE-1. Good playing technique helps a lot with that bending growl.

[tonyscarbones]

Daz production is as wack as his raps

[phillysoulman]

Its all about great musicianship...nothing more,nothing less.

Ive had Bernie Worell in the studio several times...no "magical pres".. and other bullshit..just him and his Mini Moog, clav and grand piano.
You either have it,or you dont.
Its just that plain and simple.

[Preme Diesel]

Originally Posted by alexp

Nah bitch, we just are hateful of idiots like you. Post up for sure guys your welcome over there. Myams, is a little bitch and is most certainly not welcome. We know your not all as retarded, stuck up, arrogant and just plain dumb as this hilarious moron, so by all means come say hey, and ask away!!


As for this, I would wager that its probably a Voyager as Dre seems to love the thing! If you dont have one, experiment with any sort of monosynth. Definitely put it through some sort of big sounding eq(any Allen & Heath board), and maybe a little distortion. The best is to try sampling the sound through your monitors, clipped a bit, and then once its in the sampler, go through and resample through a nice eq section. Should get you pretty close to what your looking for.


alexP (who is super friendly like the rest of the electronic music section)

haha, the irony of your reply is great.

[huh]

Originally Posted by tonyscarbones

Daz production is as wack as his raps

I loved his Deathrow era production

[Jermaine]

Originally Posted by phillysoulman

Its all about great musicianship...nothing more,nothing less.

Ive had Bernie Worell in the studio several times...no "magical pres".. and other bullshit..just him and his Mini Moog, clav and grand piano.
You either have it,or you dont.
Its just that plain and simple.

YOU GOT BERNIE IN THE STUDIO!?!?!?!? man, please tell me everything!!!! no joke, bernie is my biggest influence!
how do you recorded the moog, straight to the console, without effects? man, you are lucky! :)