catching alot of headphone bleed

KeMiKaL · 28th July 2007, 11:22 PM

when my artist records.. he likes his headphones to b awfully loud.... its bleeds into the mic when he record... then I go to apply some nice EQing thatll touch up his voice, the bleed becomes more audible... its drivin me nuts..

ive tried a gate but it only messes up the vocals rather than fix my problem...

Musiclab · 28th July 2007, 11:43 PM

get closed headphones

matthew.sawicki · 28th July 2007, 11:52 PM

Tell your artist to save his ears and turn down the cans. The best way to get bleed out of your mic is not to let it happen in the first place.

poncival · 29th July 2007, 12:00 AM

Yeah, sometimes in this situation you can sneak the send to the headphones down a little bit at a time WHILE HE IS SINGING and he might not notice- every dB counts! If that doesn't work (or if he says "why is it quieter now?") you have to confront the issue and see what is more important to him- having all that "inspiration" blasted into his ears til they bleed, or getting a decent "useable" vocal sound?

s.d.finley · 29th July 2007, 12:00 AM

Closed back headphones + Expander = minimal bleed...

poncival · 29th July 2007, 12:01 AM

I mean until his EARS bleed, not the headphones...

ninjaneer · 29th July 2007, 12:15 AM

+1 for closed headphones..

or a towel over the ones you have..
looks crazy but works.

deuc647 · 29th July 2007, 12:23 AM

use a gate

thefunkhunter · 29th July 2007, 12:39 AM

get some senheisser hd headphones good quality one of the best in the biz.

matthew.sawicki · 29th July 2007, 12:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KeMiKaL

ive tried a gate but it only messes up the vocals rather than fix my problem...

Quote:

Originally Posted by deuc647

use a gate

I think he already tried that.

Plus, gating a main vocal is never a very natural sounding thing, IMO.

swisha31 · 29th July 2007, 12:48 AM

just tell him the truth.....................tell him he is messing up the mix and needs to turn it down. as long as he can hear himself, through the track and at a pretty good level then that's all that matters anyway.

I woulda told him a while ago not to do that

deuc647 · 29th July 2007, 01:15 AM

Damn, i didnt even catch that

PettyCash · 29th July 2007, 02:24 AM

Simply just get headphones that fit more snug around the ears, and tell them to make sure that they wear the headphones properly over their head.

You cant tell the artist anything about having the volume lower, because you want to make sure that their mood for putting out a great performance is not comprimised.
So what ever they want, they get, as long as it contributes to a great performance on their end.

Put on your mix engineering cap afterwards and do what you got to do to drown out the bleed from the vocal take.
The bleed shouldnt be as bad now if you are using better fitted headphones, which will also allow you to not have the volume up as high, because the closed ear design will trap in more of the sound.

matthew.sawicki · 29th July 2007, 02:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PettyCash

You cant tell the artist anything about having the volume lower, because you want to make sure that their mood for putting out a great performance is not comprimised.
So what ever they want, they get, as long as it contributes to a great performance on their end.

I strongly disagree that any artist will ever need to have their headphones so loud that you can distinctly hear them in the mic. There's absolutely no reason to listen to music that loud.

If your artist can't deal, your artist is lame.

PettyCash · 29th July 2007, 06:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by matthew.sawicki

I strongly disagree that any artist will ever need to have their headphones so loud that you can distinctly hear them in the mic. There's absolutely no reason to listen to music that loud.

If your artist can't deal, your artist is lame.

I think you completely missed the point I was trying to make somewhere along the way of reading my post and scratching your ignorant head.

The point I was trying to make was that while trying to address an issue occuring during a studio session, you want to try and disturb the artist as little as possible.

Taking care of headphone bleed is not as simple as turning down the volume on that artist. As an engineer its your job to make sure you have all YOUR ends covered FIRST. If you have to buy closed ear headphones to lessen the effects of headphone bleed, then its your job to try and do so first before asking the artist to deal with hearing back less volume than what he or she desires.

Of course if they want to hear it so loud that closed ear headphones dont help, then its obviously way too loud and they must be near hearing loss. Cheap headphones or open ear headphone designs can leak an audiable amount of sound into your recording even at typical monitoring levels, which is why you have the alternative of using a fully closed ear design.

Matthew here is a good thought...... maybe you will learn the benefit of thinking about and handling all artists in a better matter when you finally have enough experience and gain the opportunity to work with some real good artists. Think about that....

t.dizzle · 29th July 2007, 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PettyCash

Matthew here is a good thought...... maybe you will learn the benefit of thinking about and handling all artists in a better matter when you finally have enough experience and gain the opportunity to work with some real good artists. Think about that....

matthew.sawicki · 29th July 2007, 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PettyCash

I think you completely missed the point I was trying to make somewhere along the way of reading my post and scratching your ignorant head.

The point I was trying to make was that while trying to address an issue occuring during a studio session, you want to try and disturb the artist as little as possible.

Taking care of headphone bleed is not as simple as turning down the volume on that artist. As an engineer its your job to make sure you have all YOUR ends covered FIRST. If you have to buy closed ear headphones to lessen the effects of headphone bleed, then its your job to try and do so first before asking the artist to deal with hearing back less volume than what he or she desires.

Of course if they want to hear it so loud that closed ear headphones dont help, then its obviously way too loud and they must be near hearing loss. Cheap headphones or open ear headphone designs can leak an audiable amount of sound into your recording even at typical monitoring levels, which is why you have the alternative of using a fully closed ear design.

Matthew here is a good thought...... maybe you will learn the benefit of thinking about and handling all artists in a better matter when you finally have enough experience and gain the opportunity to work with some real good artists. Think about that....

I'm not having a headphones problem, nor do my artists ever say anything about needing more volume that would ever bleed into my mic. I work with artists that are just swell btw...

yaboicheeze · 29th July 2007, 12:22 PM

yeah you definatly need better headphones go spend $200 on a nice pair that fits properly ....... dont gate your vocals ............bad idea........thats good for silence spaces in beats and sh!t like that but not when it comes to dry rap vocals...... if you get a n decent pair of headphones just make sure your artist is wearing them properly........ not only on one ear and sh!t like that ya feel me...... im the same way i turn my headphones up as loud as possible and i never have this problem because i have decent headphones.......also ..........if you already have closed headphones and you are having this problem still you might have your mic way to loud

Stitch333 · 29th July 2007, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by matthew.sawicki

I strongly disagree that any artist will ever need to have their headphones so loud that you can distinctly hear them in the mic.

as an engineer, or even producer, that is not your call to make how loud an artist wants to have their cans. And if you are making choices like that for an artist in your booth, you are not a good engineer at all. If you actually work with more than a couple of artists (who wont be told what to do by you) you will run into this situation.
Go listen to some accapellas of 'big artists'...very often you will hear that same bleed.

FWIW
Closed cans do it every time in my sessions for monitor mix isolation.
But even a little monitor bleed is really unnoticable in the mix.

BunDLeZ · 30th July 2007, 02:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thefunkhunter

get some senheisser hd headphones good quality one of the best in the biz.

I got tha HD 580...Very little bleed!!!

bitman · 30th July 2007, 03:52 AM

Pfft!

Extreme Isolation Headphones. $89.00 new.
Done.

matthew.sawicki · 30th July 2007, 04:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stitch333

as an engineer, or even producer, that is not your call to make how loud an artist wants to have their cans. And if you are making choices like that for an artist in your booth, you are not a good engineer at all. If you actually work with more than a couple of artists (who wont be told what to do by you) you will run into this situation.
Go listen to some accapellas of 'big artists'...very often you will hear that same bleed.

FWIW
Closed cans do it every time in my sessions for monitor mix isolation.
But even a little monitor bleed is really unnoticable in the mix.

I hear ya completely, I guess I just haven't run into that situation. My headphones have never really presented a problem though.

MERC476 · 30th July 2007, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BunDLeZ

I got tha HD 580...Very little bleed!!!

I went from the Sony MDR 7506 to the Sennheiser HD 280's totally killed all the bleeding for me.

DAH · 30th July 2007, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BunDLeZ

I got tha HD 580...Very little bleed!!!

+1

Mod Masochist · 31st July 2007, 05:41 AM

Seinheisers are great,

ultrasones are better,

if he wont let you turn the headphones down then throw him a pair of studio cans. After a few takes he will want the comfort back. your phones are easy to blow with these guys that are half deaf.

Find out why he wants the headphones up, maybe he just needs to hear his voice more and doesnt really want to ask. Ive always found comunication is hard to get from those who don't understand much of the studio side of things.

my two $0.01

DP

stevep · 31st July 2007, 06:07 AM

if he wants it loud , why not just track the vocals in the control room ?

Sen 280 are some good closed cans and are around 99$

i always start with the open cans and if there is to much bleed (mostly click track) i give them the closed ones

Fretbored · 31st July 2007, 06:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KeMiKaL

when my artist records.. he likes his headphones to b awfully loud.... its bleeds into the mic when he record... then I go to apply some nice EQing thatll touch up his voice, the bleed becomes more audible... its drivin me nuts..

ive tried a gate but it only messes up the vocals rather than fix my problem...

This sort of mistake should never make it past tracking. Solo the vocal before you print. If the bleed is that out of hand and you're out of headphones, cram some ipod earbuds in his ears.

PettyCash · 31st July 2007, 07:41 AM

Audio Technica ATHM40fs. Very tight fitting over the head and ears with out feeling annoying and uncomfortable, which is great to have for long ass hours of monitoring/playback.

PettyCash · 31st July 2007, 08:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KeMiKaL

when my artist records.. he likes his headphones to b awfully loud.... its bleeds into the mic when he record... then I go to apply some nice EQing thatll touch up his voice, the bleed becomes more audible... its drivin me nuts..

ive tried a gate but it only messes up the vocals rather than fix my problem...

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28th July 2007, 11:22 PM	#1
KeMiKaL Gear maniac Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 181	catching alot of headphone bleed when my artist records.. he likes his headphones to b awfully loud.... its bleeds into the mic when he record... then I go to apply some nice EQing thatll touch up his voice, the bleed becomes more audible... its drivin me nuts.. ive tried a gate but it only messes up the vocals rather than fix my problem... __________________ www.espeetheproducer.com Won't Stop Till I Hit Platinum And Then Some

28th July 2007, 11:43 PM	#2
Musiclab Lives for gear Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Elmont NY Posts: 3,222	get closed headphones __________________ Lou Gimenez www.musiclabnyc.com

28th July 2007, 11:52 PM	#3
matthew.sawicki Lives for gear Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: St. Louis Posts: 520	Tell your artist to save his ears and turn down the cans. The best way to get bleed out of your mic is not to let it happen in the first place. __________________ Matthew Sawicki www.suburbanprostudios.com follow me on twitter! twitter.com/matthewsawicki

29th July 2007, 12:00 AM	#4
poncival Lives for gear Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Mesa, AZ Posts: 622	Yeah, sometimes in this situation you can sneak the send to the headphones down a little bit at a time WHILE HE IS SINGING and he might not notice- every dB counts! If that doesn't work (or if he says "why is it quieter now?") you have to confront the issue and see what is more important to him- having all that "inspiration" blasted into his ears til they bleed, or getting a decent "useable" vocal sound? __________________ myspace.com/poncival www.thesaltmine.com

29th July 2007, 12:00 AM	#5
s.d.finley Lives for gear Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 2,039	Closed back headphones + Expander = minimal bleed... __________________ sdf www.digitalwarehausproductions.com

29th July 2007, 12:01 AM	#6
poncival Lives for gear Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Mesa, AZ Posts: 622	I mean until his EARS bleed, not the headphones... __________________ myspace.com/poncival www.thesaltmine.com

29th July 2007, 12:15 AM	#7
ninjaneer Gear maniac Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 297	+1 for closed headphones.. or a towel over the ones you have.. looks crazy but works.

29th July 2007, 12:23 AM	#8
deuc647 Lives for gear Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 1,308	use a gate

29th July 2007, 12:39 AM	#9
thefunkhunter Gear interested Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 25	senheisser hd get some senheisser hd headphones good quality one of the best in the biz.

29th July 2007, 12:48 AM	#11
swisha31 Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Hell's Kitchen AKA Mississippi Posts: 679	just tell him the truth.....................tell him he is messing up the mix and needs to turn it down. as long as he can hear himself, through the track and at a pretty good level then that's all that matters anyway. I woulda told him a while ago not to do that

29th July 2007, 01:15 AM	#12
deuc647 Lives for gear Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 1,308	Damn, i didnt even catch that

29th July 2007, 02:24 AM	#13
PettyCash Lives for gear Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 1,705	Simply just get headphones that fit more snug around the ears, and tell them to make sure that they wear the headphones properly over their head. You cant tell the artist anything about having the volume lower, because you want to make sure that their mood for putting out a great performance is not comprimised. So what ever they want, they get, as long as it contributes to a great performance on their end. Put on your mix engineering cap afterwards and do what you got to do to drown out the bleed from the vocal take. The bleed shouldnt be as bad now if you are using better fitted headphones, which will also allow you to not have the volume up as high, because the closed ear design will trap in more of the sound.

29th July 2007, 12:22 PM	#18
yaboicheeze Gear nut Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: tha 303 and tha 510 Posts: 106	yeah you definatly need better headphones go spend $200 on a nice pair that fits properly ....... dont gate your vocals ............bad idea........thats good for silence spaces in beats and sh!t like that but not when it comes to dry rap vocals...... if you get a n decent pair of headphones just make sure your artist is wearing them properly........ not only on one ear and sh!t like that ya feel me...... im the same way i turn my headphones up as loud as possible and i never have this problem because i have decent headphones.......also ..........if you already have closed headphones and you are having this problem still you might have your mic way to loud __________________ http://www.myspace.com/yaboicheezeigotbeatz http://www.myspace.com/slapmatikproductionz

30th July 2007, 03:52 AM	#21
bitman Lives for gear Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Keystone, CO Posts: 649	Pfft! Extreme Isolation Headphones. $89.00 new. Done.

31st July 2007, 05:41 AM	#25
Mod Masochist Gear interested Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Seattle Washington Posts: 29	Seinheisers are great, ultrasones are better, if he wont let you turn the headphones down then throw him a pair of studio cans. After a few takes he will want the comfort back. your phones are easy to blow with these guys that are half deaf. Find out why he wants the headphones up, maybe he just needs to hear his voice more and doesnt really want to ask. Ive always found comunication is hard to get from those who don't understand much of the studio side of things. my two $0.01 DP

31st July 2007, 06:07 AM	#26
stevep Lives for Jesus Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: orange county ca. Posts: 2,938	if he wants it loud , why not just track the vocals in the control room ? Sen 280 are some good closed cans and are around 99$ i always start with the open cans and if there is to much bleed (mostly click track) i give them the closed ones __________________ Steve Perkins Creation Recording Studios .com Take a Kid Fishing Outreach John 3:16

31st July 2007, 07:41 AM	#28
PettyCash Lives for gear Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 1,705	Audio Technica ATHM40fs. Very tight fitting over the head and ears with out feeling annoying and uncomfortable, which is great to have for long ass hours of monitoring/playback.