Is this idea a waste of my time? (Drum Question)

[Invisible Heroes]

First, let me say hello to you all since this is my very first post.

What I'd like to know is if I took a mono kick sample and ran it twice in two separate channels and panned each kick channel hard left and hard right and treated them with the same eq and dynamics and then resampled the false stero kick as a stereo sample would it give my kick that big sound I'm looking for in my drums?

Or would it be better for me to sidechain the kick through my compressor?

[matthew.sawicki]

Originally Posted by Invisible Heroes

First, let me say hello to you all since this is my very first post.

What I'd like to know is if I took a mono kick sample and ran it twice in two separate channels and panned each kick channel hard left and hard right and treated them with the same eq and dynamics and then resampled the false stero kick as a stereo sample would it give my kick that big sound I'm looking for in my drums?

Or would it be better for me to sidechain the kick through my compressor?

Well... the first situation will only result in your kick being louder, not in stereo.

As for number two... I don't think you really made sense. Sidechain the kick through what compressor, compressing what?

[Invisible Heroes]

Originally Posted by matthew.sawicki

Well... the first situation will only result in your kick being louder, not in stereo.

As for number two... I don't think you really made sense. Sidechain the kick through what compressor, compressing what?

What I'm hoping for a bigger drum sound meaning a louder and wider kick.

[piccazzo]

What I'm hoping for a bigger drum sound meaning a louder and wider kick.

That`s called mixing.A craft that takes time to learn.

[Invisible Heroes]

Originally Posted by piccazzo

That`s called mixing.A craft that takes time to learn.

Gee, thanks guy.

[TomiGran]

Hey,

I think you would just run in to a little bit of a phasing issue. I would leave the original kick where it is and try doing a little bit of parallel compression with a widener of some sort in the chain. You'd probably want to use a fast attack on the compression as not to have as much of a noticeable phasing issue on the transient with the original. In fact, if it were me, I'd leave the widener out of the picture all together. That's one way to get a fatter kick, but if a wide kick is what you're going for......I don't know....I've never really had to widen a kick channel. But there are many ways to do it. Tracking through good converters for one, seems to make everything sound wider.

[khameln]

Try stereo verb (with a high pass filter) or place a stereo chorus on a send, send a bit to it, and highpass that.

[The Byre]

Try adding some big, low, long-travelling reverb to the kick.

[Big 3rd]

The only way you get a "fake" stereo sound is to have the copied version be different in some way from the original, whether it's through eqing or adding delay. That's at least the basics of a stereo sound.

[khameln]

Yeah. with a kick, you really want to leave the foundation of it (the lower part) in mono though, because that's what's anchoring your song. So anything you do stereo-wise is usually better done by filtering off the low end and then applying some kind of stereo effect.

Copying the whole kick L/R and processing it differently just gives me the heebiejeebies.

[psycho_monkey]

Originally Posted by Invisible Heroes

Gee, thanks guy.

A slightly sarcastic response maybe, but you are kind of asking "how do I mix?" which can't really be answered in a post.

Answers are: compression/EQ/effects/other processing/kitchen sink. What would be MORE helpful is if you posted an example of what you're wanting to achieve, and what you've currently got.

As someone pointed out above, duplicating channels and panning hard left/right is exactly the same as sending one channel dead centre (ie to left AND right), although it'll sound a bit louder (+6dB maybe?). you need to process them differently to get any sense of width...which probably isn't the right approach for a kick drum.

[A-List]

^^maybe you and picazzo can make a tutorial thread on how to ask perfectly worded questions on gearslutz forums.

[Methlab]

Like a lot of guys are saying..stereo Reverb is what you are hearing, and that is why someone else mentioned getting good at mixing. Tricks like that come easy after you work at mixing for a long time.

[psycho_monkey]

Originally Posted by A-List

^^maybe you and picazzo can make a tutorial thread on how to ask perfectly worded questions on gearslutz forums.

No one said "perfect"...but vague questions are always answered by more questions.

What are "big" drums exactly? Dre? Bonham? Def Leppard??????

Come on, without knowing exactly what sort of sound someone's going for, advice is difficult to give. And given the other comments in the post, any advice someone DOES give is likely to be misunderstood. Saying "put some reverb on the kick", as accurate as it may be, could be misunderstood in so many ways. In my work with music technology A-Level students, I've heard a million different ways to mess up reverb...

The best advice here should be to go do some reading, some experimenting, and come back with more questions once you've got a handle on some of the basics.

[A-List]

^^ agreed

[Invisible Heroes]

Originally Posted by psycho_monkey

No one said "perfect"...but vague questions are always answered by more questions.

What are "big" drums exactly? Dre? Bonham? Def Leppard??????

Come on, without knowing exactly what sort of sound someone's going for, advice is difficult to give. And given the other comments in the post, any advice someone DOES give is likely to be misunderstood. Saying "put some reverb on the kick", as accurate as it may be, could be misunderstood in so many ways. In my work with music technology A-Level students, I've heard a million different ways to mess up reverb...

The best advice here should be to go do some reading, some experimenting, and come back with more questions once you've got a handle on some of the basics.

When I say I want that big and wide drum sound I'm talking about the smack you in the face Just Blaze and Dr. Dre drum sound.

[A-List]

just blaze 2000 or 2006?
Dr Dre 1990 or 2003?
we need exact details.

just kidding

[Invisible Heroes]

Originally Posted by A-List

just blaze 2000 or 2006?
Dr Dre 1990 or 2003?
we need exact details.

just kidding

Fabolous - Return of the Hustle produced by Just Blaze
Jay-Z - Lost Ones produced by Dr. Dre

[piccazzo]

When I say I want that big and wide drum sound I'm talking about the smack you in the face Just Blaze and Dr. Dre drum sound.

My answer still stands , Mixing & Mastering.
I heard Dre does a lot of mixing himself but has good people who he leaves the mastering to.And if you listen to a lotta of dre tracks that HUGE sound is more in his arrangement that in the sounds themselfs.Very Sparce productions with just a few key elements , drums of course beeing one of them.

Good samples , Good arrangements and exxelent mastering will get you a long way.

Fabolous - Return of the Hustle produced by Just Blaze is no that impressive in my mind but a good track thoug.
There`s a few videos of Just Blaze making that track on youtube or myspace so check em out and you get a little more insight in how he did that track.

To sum up what u might need or need to to,
Big speakers or a sub , so you hear what happens in the low freq
Study intrumentals and listen to the productions
Study tutorials on mixing and mastering
Get the best samples you can find and layer them
Master techniques like paralell & bus compression
Eq is a tool that make good sounds better , and bad sounds ok

And frankly 99,99 % of the population on earth can`t hear the difference between the drum sounds on a Dre track or a Just Blaze track so focus more on making good songs than getting hung up on trying to get that perfect drum sound.

Just my 2 cents...

[KevWest]

Originally Posted by Methlab

Like a lot of guys are saying..stereo Reverb is what you are hearing, and that is why someone else mentioned getting good at mixing. Tricks like that come easy after you work at mixing for a long time.

u have the best avys

[Invisible Heroes]

Originally Posted by piccazzo

My answer still stands , Mixing & Mastering.
I heard Dre does a lot of mixing himself but has good people who he leaves the mastering to.And if you listen to a lotta of dre tracks that HUGE sound is more in his arrangement that in the sounds themselfs.Very Sparce productions with just a few key elements , drums of course beeing one of them.

Good samples , Good arrangements and exxelent mastering will get you a long way.

Fabolous - Return of the Hustle produced by Just Blaze is no that impressive in my mind but a good track thoug.
There`s a few videos of Just Blaze making that track on youtube or myspace so check em out and you get a little more insight in how he did that track.

To sum up what u might need or need to to,
Big speakers or a sub , so you hear what happens in the low freq
Study intrumentals and listen to the productions
Study tutorials on mixing and mastering
Get the best samples you can find and layer them
Master techniques like paralell & bus compression
Eq is a tool that make good sounds better , and bad sounds ok

And frankly 99,99 % of the population on earth can`t hear the difference between the drum sounds on a Dre track or a Just Blaze track so focus more on making good songs than getting hung up on trying to get that perfect drum sound.

Just my 2 cents...

Thanks. I found a tutorial that helped me figure out the sound I wanted to get and it worked great.