WHICH 2-CHANNEL HIGH END CONVERTERS FOR ITB R&B, HIPHOP AND POP PRODUCTION

[Marrone]

Hee fellow gearslutz!! Would like to hear you opinions on this. So what i am after is not which converters provide the best transparent conversion because i can imagine that for acoustical and especially classical music the lavry would probably be the best, but the best conversion regarding the style of music (R&B, HIPHOP and POP) and doing production ITB using a lot of quality samples where coloration is probably wanted. Very curious!! Thanks!!

Marrone

[H-Rezz]

I voted for the Lynx , in it's price range and beyond it's a very transparent convertor ,great depth and stereo image , IMO i would not be looking to a converter to color the sound ,they were never meant to do that unless they are billed that way like Crane Song Hedd or the UA converter ....... i would rely on nice DI boxes or Preamps to colour the sound ....

BTW all the those choices will get you pro results ...... that being said so will RME and Metric Halo converters , which are proly more in the Ensemble end of things ....

[Marrone]

Originally Posted by H-Rezz

I voted for the Lynx , in it's price range and beyond it's a very transparent convertor ,great depth and stereo image , IMO i would not be looking to a converter to color the sound ,they were never meant to do that unless they are billed that way like Crane Song Hedd or the UA converter ....... i would rely on nice DI boxes or Preamps to colour the sound ....

BTW all the those choices will get you pro results ...... that being said so will RME and Metric Halo converters , which are proly more in the Ensemble end of things ....

Thanks for your opinion! I know that Lynx is more bang for buck but this is not important in this poll. Furthermore i understand that you can also get coloring by using nice preamps etc. but if you only produce ITB than you will not be using nice preamps so you cannot use that to color the sound. Is it in this case nice to have a "colored" D/A A/D in order to record your output by making a ADDA loop and give those samples some nice life?

[Marrone]

O I forgot to ask. Please specify your choice. Tell us why you think the converter you chose is more suitable than the other ones for this style of music. Thanks!!thumbsup

[deuc647]

Rosetta 200, used to use them as my primary converters, but i like them as my mixdown converters now, they have a slight bump in the low end and i think they sound goo dfor hip hop and r&b

[rickrock305]

the rosetta is known to be a bit colored.


here's an idea for you...maybe check out the API A2D or Neve 1073 DPD. I have the Neve and it has a GREAT two channel converter, as well as two great preamps.

[H-Rezz]

Originally Posted by Marrone

Thanks for your opinion! I know that Lynx is more bang for buck but this is not important in this poll. Furthermore i understand that you can also get coloring by using nice preamps etc. but if you only produce ITB than you will not be using nice preamps so you cannot use that to color the sound. Is it in this case nice to have a "colored" D/A A/D in order to record your output by making a ADDA loop and give those samples some nice life?

You are looking at this wrong , first why would you want to do a loop to convert a sound back into itself ? If the convertor is doing it's job the difference should be negligible , when people say Apogee are 'coloured' this is not by intention more so they have an Apogee sound with a slight bump in the mids , this is not a 'colouring' solution just an observation people have noted when comparing them too converters deemed to be transparent like Prism,Mytek etc ......

I think RickRock gives you some great suggestions with pre and convertor together ......

IMO people miss-interpret this working ITB box thing , you have to record vocals,no? So what are you going to use , surely not your spdif input ?

For the sake of your vocals and any live instruments going ITB a good Preamp(and mic) and converter is indispenable , or the combination of the both like the API or Neve , no way around it .....you can use them to record vocs/instruments, colour stuff you think suffers from digititis like most Soft Synths do , and grin from ear to ear

[halfguard]

to use the api a2d with converter, dont you have to use the spdif?????????

[Marrone]

Come one guys! Please vote!thumbsup We only have a few votes now. Maybe i should put this topic in high end? You think?

[Switchcraft]

I own lavry, with that said, any of those are fine. This thread isnt relaly gonna ggive you any insight. Either listen to them or search each product name and see what has been said. There are no converters that are best for hip hop. They all record bass well.

[Marrone]

Originally Posted by Switchcraft

I own lavry, with that said, any of those are fine. This thread isnt relaly gonna ggive you any insight. Either listen to them or search each product name and see what has been said. There are no converters that are best for hip hop. They all record bass well.

I know that all converters record bass but still some converters like for example the ua2192 and the rosetta have different coloring in the low end. Therefore they could sound better on pop and R&B hiphop.

[boodah]

Originally Posted by halfguard

to use the api a2d with converter, dont you have to use the spdif?????????

Yes, you do. I finally got my A2D setup correctly yesterday (Thanks Tony for the contact at API).

Originally Posted by Marrone

Thanks for your opinion! I know that Lynx is more bang for buck but this is not important in this poll. Furthermore i understand that you can also get coloring by using nice preamps etc. but if you only produce ITB than you will not be using nice preamps so you cannot use that to color the sound. Is it in this case nice to have a "colored" D/A A/D in order to record your output by making a ADDA loop and give those samples some nice life?

I disagree with the ITB not needing preamps. The purpose of me getting the A2D is so that I can run the drums thru the pre and record onto a new track with that character.

[TonyBelmont]

Originally Posted by Marrone

I know that all converters record bass but still some converters like for example the ua2192 and the rosetta have different coloring in the low end. Therefore they could sound better on pop and R&B hiphop.

I think you are putting to much of an emphasis on the converters... Most of the big name engineers mixing the songs we consider great, could care less about the converters... seriously.

Mics, preamps, technique... creative mixing is what's really important. Any good converter that fits your price range will work well for hip hop... One unit that is not on your list, but very good is the Crane Song HEDD192. That unit allows you to shape the sound by adding harmonic distortion... It sounds like that's what you are looking for.

[azwun25]

i voted lynx. i own a 2b (2 in 6 out) and i a/b'd it with the rosetta 200 for several days in my room and the difference between the conversion was so slight i couldn't justify spending double on the apogee. just my opinion

[Marrone]

Originally Posted by boodah

Yes, you do. I finally got my A2D setup correctly yesterday (Thanks Tony for the contact at API).



I disagree with the ITB not needing preamps. The purpose of me getting the A2D is so that I can run the drums thru the pre and record onto a new track with that character.

Sorry i wasn't really clear. I meant that I do not use preamps while mixing, but using the api to color the sound of drums is a very good idea!!! Thanks!!

[Marrone]

Originally Posted by TonyBelmont

I think you are putting to much of an emphasis on the converters... Most of the big name engineers mixing the songs we consider great, could care less about the converters... seriously.

Mics, preamps, technique... creative mixing is what's really important. Any good converter that fits your price range will work well for hip hop... One unit that is not on your list, but very good is the Crane Song HEDD192. That unit allows you to shape the sound by adding harmonic distortion... It sounds like that's what you are looking for.

Hee Tony!! thanks for your reply, I know that the HEDD is great! Especially for adding the amount of coloring that you want but unfortunately it does not fit in my budget. I have 3500 dollars for 2 ch adda and a preamp. What would you advice? I know you love the API AD2 and I also think this would be very interesting for me since i do mainly R&B, Pop and Hiphop and on-board A/D conversion sounds very nice!! Just one thing i am afraid of and that is that it maybe will not fit my voice since i read that this is a fast preamp. What do you think? Here you can hear what kind of voice i have.. www.soundclick.com/marroneproductions
Its quite old but it is what i can provide the easiest. Any other one please also feel free to chime in.thumbsup

[NesNeedsGear]

for $3500....

i think you may be able to find used Lavry ADA and a Great river mp1nv/Brent averill/Chandler Germanium pre.

[TonyBelmont]

Originally Posted by Marrone

Hee Tony!! thanks for your reply, I know that the HEDD is great! Especially for adding the amount of coloring that you want but unfortunately it does not fit in my budget. I have 3500 dollars for 2 ch adda and a preamp. What would you advice? I know you love the API AD2 and I also think this would be very interesting for me since i do mainly R&B, Pop and Hiphop and on-board A/D conversion sounds very nice!! Just one thing i am afraid of and that is that it maybe will not fit my voice since i read that this is a fast preamp. What do you think? Here you can hear what kind of voice i have.. www.soundclick.com/marroneproductions
Its quite old but it is what i can provide the easiest. Any other one please also feel free to chime in.thumbsup

For your budget, I would get something like the RME ADI-2, and an Aurora Audio GTQ2.

The API is a great piece, but because you need D/A, it doesn't seem like as good of a fit as the RME/ Aurora combo.

[Stitch333]

There are quite a few other 'high end' converters you're overlooking:
mytek, prismsound, lucid, RME, Benchmark, weiss, etc...
I personally dig my apogees

I had quite a few records on the radio in Philly that were kut with the stock pre/converters on an 001 back in the day

[H-Rezz]

Originally Posted by halfguard

to use the api a2d with converter, dont you have to use the spdif?????????

My point was you cann't use your spdif as a mic pre

[KevWest]

sometimes i wonder how much thought do the pros really put into thigns lke this. I read interviews from pro rappers and producers who are very uneducated technically, ive heard hits pushed out of mboxes and mixes done on $100 bookshelf speakers. Ive heard several producers on several occasions even say things like mpcs arent digital. I know this is probabaly taking away from the thread but one has to wonder how much extra thought is put into having better quality vs just going out and putting together good songs wtih what you have. These people clearly are lacking in a lot of technical knowledge and still put out good music. I think sometimes the flaws and imperfections may be what makes it special. Thoughts?

[ShaneFontane]

Originally Posted by xabiton

sometimes i wonder how much thought do the pros really put into thigns lke this. I read interviews from pro rappers and producers who are very uneducated technically, ive heard hits pushed out of mboxes and mixes done on $100 bookshelf speakers.

honestly, i think the gear is more for our ego. because at the end of the day - its the vibe that is captured that is really where it's at.

I mean, i was just in a session the other day and we used some vintage neve pres, pt hd3 and more but at the same time monitored through some crappy maudio speakers cause the genelecs are out right now. we even had a ssl compressor unplugged sitting on a box!

my point being, whereas some people may be like - well, i cant mix on crappy maudio speakers or i need that sick ssl bus comp - we just smashed through this remix that was commissioned by a major. what got us through the session was THE MUSIC not the gear.

[tengu]

A 2192 would be perfect for your needs.

It adds a nice boost in the lower mids and a bit of "sparkle" everywhere else.

A beefy sound that I would describe as "authentic" in a hip-hop sense.

I ran some ITB mixes through a 2192 into a Portico 5043 and back in through the 2192 and it sounded "very nice".

YMMV.

[Marrone]

What if i will go for the API and a Lavry Black. Would that be a good idea?

[jdjustice]

i voted Apogee, but UA would suit the style of music just as well.

Tony Belmont has a good point about over-emphasizing conversion importance.
you can get fairly good converters in any interface for hundreds, not thousands, of dollars.
thousand-dollar converters are nowhere near as important imo as a great preamp and good outboard compressor.

so the last thing i would upgrade in my studio, after i had outboard preamps, compressors, equalizers, etc, would be the converters.

about the API: the preamps are great, and that is obviously important.
i don't know about the quality of the converters, but i am sure they will be fine.

what you get with the API A²D is a 2-channel preamp, plus converters, for the price of a good 2-channel preamp.
i understand there are some issues regarding the clocking on the unit with regards to either not being able to slave it to certain master clocks (Big Ben etc) or something along those lines, but i have also heard that API is working on a fix for that issue that should be coming soon.

what converters/interface are you using now?
maybe just get the preamp(s) and then later look at converters after you have a couple of outboard compressors and great preamplification.


~j.d.

[boodah]

Originally Posted by jdjustice

i voted Apogee, but UA would suit the style of music just as well.

Tony Belmont has a good point about over-emphasizing conversion importance.
you can get fairly good converters in any interface for hundreds, not thousands, of dollars.
thousand-dollar converters are nowhere near as important imo as a great preamp and good outboard compressor.

so the last thing i would upgrade in my studio, after i had outboard preamps, compressors, equalizers, etc, would be the converters.

about the API: the preamps are great, and that is obviously important.
i don't know about the quality of the converters, but i am sure they will be fine.

what you get with the API A²D is a 2-channel preamp, plus converters, for the price of a good 2-channel preamp.
i understand there are some issues regarding the clocking on the unit with regards to either not being able to slave it to certain master clocks (Big Ben etc) or something along those lines, but i have also heard that API is working on a fix for that issue that should be coming soon.

what converters/interface are you using now?
maybe just get the preamp(s) and then later look at converters after you have a couple of outboard compressors and great preamplification.


~j.d.

API A2D only accepts Super Word Clock.

[andrewj]

Originally Posted by Marrone

What if i will go for the API and a Lavry Black. Would that be a good idea?

or replace the lavry black with the benchmark DA!!! yummy

actually the lavry is also nice! i would prefer the blue line of lavry!

the hottest converter to me is the crane song HEDD.

for your budget i would also think about the metric halo interfaces which are real hot and definately underrated by some guys here! think about an uln-2 for 1200 euros. they have some nice clean integrated pres inside also! no highend tools, but much better than a lot of those middle class pres used in hundreds of records.

for pre i would recommend the Brant Averill 1272. hmm thne you have some money left. well what about that: metric halo mio2882 with 8inout for $1500 in combination with the brent averill 1272 for $1895 or something like that. or wait for the SSL X-Logic Alpha VHD Pre (guys it is time to pay me for that advertising show LOL) a definately hot four channel micpre with clean or coloured highquality preamping!

[Dallas4lr]

Originally Posted by andrewj

or replace the lavry black with the benchmark DA!!! yummy

actually the lavry is also nice! i would prefer the blue line of lavry!

the hottest converter to me is the crane song HEDD.

for your budget i would also think about the metric halo interfaces which are real hot and definately underrated by some guys here! think about an uln-2 for 1200 euros. they have some nice clean integrated pres inside also! no highend tools, but much better than a lot of those middle class pres used in hundreds of records.

for pre i would recommend the Brant Averill 1272. hmm thne you have some money left. well what about that: metric halo mio2882 with 8inout for $1500 in combination with the brent averill 1272 for $1895 or something like that. or wait for the SSL X-Logic Alpha VHD Pre (guys it is time to pay me for that advertising show LOL) a definately hot four channel micpre with clean or coloured highquality preamping!

Not sure,

Because its been about 5 years since I've used thier stuff, but from what I remember the metric halo stuff only works with MACS.


Dallas

[andrewj]

sorry i did not get that you work windowsbased! than you might find something else! lynk or apogee perhaps! but to me the mhs are great, but your right they are mac based!