Riding Your Master

[LumenStudio]

To Dave and all. Who rides the master fader instead of using a 2-buss comp on the stereo mix?

This came up in the Any Wallace thread and I'd like to hear more about what results people get using this.

What happens when you go to mastering when using this technique?

Cheers

[Dave Pensado]

I actually thot I invented that, and found out everyone does it. Well, not everyone, but more people than you think. I move ALL the faders. I like the sound of things that mimic a live band (as opposed to dead bands). Sometimes riding the MF is the only solution for making the last chorus scream. I push the kik up every 2-4 bars, pull bass up in chorus, snare up in spots, etc.

[M2E]

Originally posted by Dave Pensado
I actually thot I invented that, and found out everyone does it. Well, not everyone, but more people than you think. I move ALL the faders. I like the sound of things that mimic a live band (as opposed to dead bands). Sometimes riding the MF is the only solution for making the last chorus scream. I push the kik up every 2-4 bars, pull bass up in chorus, snare up in spots, etc.

I can tell you did that in the Mya Mix of Fallin. Great mix by the way. When the end of Fallin hits you can tell you must have raised it about 2db. Or More even-HUH?

M2E

[djui5]

When you guy's ride your master.....do you start with the fader at 0 and at some point bring it down for whatever reason or do you start with the fader at -4 or something and ride it through the song?


Never rode the master while mixing....just curious.

[DirkB]

I was a heavy automater before, but kick, bas and master fader where a no-no-rider in my place; don't know why, just wouldn't do it. After the AW thread, I experimented with it on 2-3 mixes I'm finishing and it work superb. Just 0.5-1dB of gain on the master fader really can build up the chorus...

Greetings,
Dirk

[toolstudio]

Hi,

I always start at -2 at the master fader on the SSL so I have a bit air to do some rides.
I always ride groups and master during the song. If not I could always ofline trim the 2 dBs. (thanks to G Software V4 for the offline trims)


wolfgang

toolhouse studios, germany

[David R.]

The master is usually set for the loudest part of the song in my mixes. On the quiet intro or the soft verse, I creep it up however many db I can while maintaniing the integrity of the quieter part. If I think someone can hear a fader move, it's too much.

Never had a mastering engineer comment on this part of my mix, so no news is good news I guess.

[DirkB]

Originally posted by David R.
On the quiet intro or the soft verse, I creep it up however many db I can while maintaniing the integrity of the quieter part.

Then your doint the exact opposite...

Greetings,
Dirk

[djui5]

Originally posted by toolstudio
Hi,

I always start at -2 at the master fader on the SSL so I have a bit air to do some rides.
I always ride groups and master during the song. If not I could always ofline trim the 2 dBs. (thanks to G Software V4 for the offline trims)


wolfgang

toolhouse studios, germany

Thanks...that's what I was looking for.

Guess I need to stop being lazy and just go experiment myself.

[Extreme Mixing]

Originally posted by David R.
If I think someone can hear a fader move, it's too much.

\

I think you might be being too subtle... I want people to hear and feel that I've been there in one of my mixes.

I'm looking forward to hearing more from Dave. In my opinion, he's one of the very best out there right now. I've been listening to Pink "Misundaztood" in the car a lot lately. Great writing and a great singer, too. I love the voc delay FX on "Get This Party Started". Very nice work.

Steve

[picksail]

Damn it. I must have misinterpreted the topic because, when I asked my wife to "ride the master", she slapped me then banished me to the giant maroon sofa for the night.

[Lindell 2nd]

Originally posted by picksail
Damn it. I must have misinterpreted the topic because, when I asked my wife to "ride the master", she slapped me then banished me to the giant maroon sofa for the night.

hahahahaaaa

[DirkB]

Originally posted by rme uk
There's one thing that I don't understand:

When the song gets compressed and maximised to death afterwards how can riding the masterfader be heard anyway??

To my ears, running a mix 1dB into a limiter sounds louder than backing the mix 1dB off and not have the limiter limiting .

Greetings,
Dirk

[toolstudio]

Originally posted by DirkB
To my ears, running a mix 1dB into a limiter sounds louder than backing the mix 1dB off and not have the limiter limiting .

Greetings,
Dirk

Yeah you are right, if you have the Limiter after ther Master Fader, than I wouln't change the master, as you generate element level shifts.

On an SSL where I work, the master fader is after the Quad Compressor, so you don't change the compressor when you change the master.


wolfgang

toolhouse studios, germany

[Fidelis]

everything I do is ITB. So i have a bus mix setup that starts with a compressor, then an eq and Phoenix at the end. I do my volume "rides" at the EQ plugin, after the compressor, so it wont mess with it. Works great!