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Acereject
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#1
23rd June 2009
Old 23rd June 2009
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Cool AbsoluteGarbage remasters

Hey Butch (and Billy and Mike)

Thanx for taking the time to guest mod this forum, and for replying to a lot of the questions posed, most of your answers havge been really interesting and full of nuggets of info.

I was wondering how the process of remastering the tracks for Absolute Garbage took place, it's been noted that all of the tracks have had minor changes, and even some of them quite significant, some examples: the heavier bass on Cherry Lips and Special, some changes in "Push it"'s middle-8 and the removal of a vocal from "Only Happy".

Were these just aesthetic changes made to update the original tracks to fit in with the contemporary music trends, or were they fixes to the tracks you had been wanting the chance to go back and change since they were first released? Was there any tracks missing off Absolute Garbage you feel in hindsight could have been there?

For the most part, I love the remasters of the tracks, as well as "Tell Me Where it Hurts" and the "...Crying" remix. It has made me wonder about the possibility of remastered editions being completed for the original albums similar to the work on the AG inclusions?

I would love to hear some of the earlier stuff including old b-sides or demos remastered to today's audio standard, especially the aVersion 2.0 album. Billy Bush said he felt that the albums hadn't been recognised for their contribution to music, and I genuinely feel that a re-issue of them would encourage a rethink and reappraisal of them.

Anyway, thanx in advance for taking the time to read this and hope you get the time to reply!

Regards
Paul Anderson
Glasgow, Scotland
#2
24th June 2009
Old 24th June 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acereject View Post
Hey Butch (and Billy and Mike)

Thanx for taking the time to guest mod this forum, and for replying to a lot of the questions posed, most of your answers havge been really interesting and full of nuggets of info.

I was wondering how the process of remastering the tracks for Absolute Garbage took place, it's been noted that all of the tracks have had minor changes, and even some of them quite significant, some examples: the heavier bass on Cherry Lips and Special, some changes in "Push it"'s middle-8 and the removal of a vocal from "Only Happy".

Were these just aesthetic changes made to update the original tracks to fit in with the contemporary music trends, or were they fixes to the tracks you had been wanting the chance to go back and change since they were first released? Was there any tracks missing off Absolute Garbage you feel in hindsight could have been there?

For the most part, I love the remasters of the tracks, as well as "Tell Me Where it Hurts" and the "...Crying" remix. It has made me wonder about the possibility of remastered editions being completed for the original albums similar to the work on the AG inclusions?

I would love to hear some of the earlier stuff including old b-sides or demos remastered to today's audio standard, especially the aVersion 2.0 album. Billy Bush said he felt that the albums hadn't been recognised for their contribution to music, and I genuinely feel that a re-issue of them would encourage a rethink and reappraisal of them.

Anyway, thanx in advance for taking the time to read this and hope you get the time to reply!

Regards
Paul Anderson
Glasgow, Scotland
I think BV can probably expand on this, but as for changes made during the remastering it's good to keep in mind that during the original mastering on every album a lot of editing and changes occurred and sometimes those weren't documented. Going back and remastering them often meant trying to remember which version was used for which section of the song. There's sometimes 10-12 versions of each song with minor differences and we would often edit between them during mastering.

Also, sometimes after all is said and done, you look back at a song that was released some time ago you realize that maybe the bass or guitars should have been turned up!

But another reason is that some of the mixes don't exist any more:

When a band finishes an album for a major label, the label gets ownership and takes possession of the masters. (the stereo mixes both pre and post mastering) In Garbage's case, that original label was Almo Sounds in North America and Mushroom in the rest of the world. Seemingly every album cycle we went through found the band on some other label due to the consolidation of the industry. Almo to Interscope to Geffen, Mushroom to Warners, etc.

When we were starting to collate the material for Absolute Garbage, we couldn't find the analog masters for first album. None of the labels have them, none of the mastering facilities have them. Somehow the labels managed to lose ALL of the original stereo mixes.

The only thing we could find in the archives were a rather incomplete and damaged set of 16bit 44.1k safety DAT mixes. Emily at The Lodge did a pretty amazing job of putting it all together even though it was a far from optimal situation.




So if you happen to be sitting on a stack of 1/2" tapes that say Garbage, get ahold of me, will ya?
Acereject
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#3
24th June 2009
Old 24th June 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy Bush View Post
When we were starting to collate the material for Absolute Garbage, we couldn't find the analog masters for first album. None of the labels have them, none of the mastering facilities have them. Somehow the labels managed to lose ALL of the original stereo mixes.

The only thing we could find in the archives were a rather incomplete and damaged set of 16bit 44.1k safety DAT mixes. Emily at The Lodge did a pretty amazing job of putting it all together even though it was a far from optimal situation.

So if you happen to be sitting on a stack of 1/2" tapes that say Garbage, get ahold of me, will ya?
Sorry I don't have any! I have a picture of a Smart Studios DAT that has Shirley's handwriting saying "Alien Sex Fiend" and "Sensitive Guy" (whatever song that was!) on it, if that helps track down something

I've read both Shirley and Butch say in the past that the masters were lost. Emily really did an amazing job with what she had to work with then.

Actually Billy, I was gonna try to ask you about some of these things in person, I was one of the pair of crazy fans who was standing behind you at Shirley's Famous Scots thing last month but we bottled out of saying hi (as you were deep in conversation and we don't have it in us to be rude) and almost didn't manage to speak to Shirley either but she gave us 5 mins of our time which was very greatly appreciated!
#4
25th June 2009
Old 25th June 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acereject View Post
Sorry I don't have any! I have a picture of a Smart Studios DAT that has Shirley's handwriting saying "Alien Sex Fiend" and "Sensitive Guy" (whatever song that was!) on it, if that helps track down something

I've read both Shirley and Butch say in the past that the masters were lost. Emily really did an amazing job with what she had to work with then.

Actually Billy, I was gonna try to ask you about some of these things in person, I was one of the pair of crazy fans who was standing behind you at Shirley's Famous Scots thing last month but we bottled out of saying hi (as you were deep in conversation and we don't have it in us to be rude) and almost didn't manage to speak to Shirley either but she gave us 5 mins of our time which was very greatly appreciated!
Man I was PISSED when we couldn't find the masters to the first album. Some of the changes you hear in Absolute Garbage are taken from alt versions. Emily did a killer job mastering...she's a star!

That song "sensitve guy" is a REALLy bad jam we did late night at Smart after WAY too many cocktails!!!
Acereject
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#5
25th June 2009
Old 25th June 2009
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Re: Sensitive Guy

Quote:
Originally Posted by ButchVig View Post
Man I was PISSED when we couldn't find the masters to the first album. Some of the changes you hear in Absolute Garbage are taken from alt versions. Emily did a killer job mastering...she's a star!

That song "sensitve guy" is a REALLy bad jam we did late night at Smart after WAY too many cocktails!!!


I have NO IDEA how I got this screenshot, or what footage it came from, but I have a feeling it was in a doc of some kind about Smart rather than Garbage, and ended up circulating around hardcore fans a while ago.

Thanx Butch for clearing up what that title was!

I guess the loss of the masters is also stalling the B-sides project? It's a shame, a lot of people would have loved to have access to the old stuff without having to resort to eBay, or to hear some of the tracks that went unreleased when the Bleed Like Me singles stopped, like "Guilty".
#6
25th June 2009
Old 25th June 2009
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What do you guys think happened to the masters??
I worked in a mastering place for a few months, and it was so chock-full of archives and backups and all that jazz... it was like every spare compartment and cupboard had backups just in case someone at sometime wanted their originals... You'd think you are going into a closet but it's full of CD's DVD's tapes, etc. What a great place. I miss it :(

Blows minds that a fairly large band can't get their hands on their debut cd original.
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26th June 2009
Old 26th June 2009
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Originally Posted by fooman View Post
What do you guys think happened to the masters??
I worked in a mastering place for a few months, and it was so chock-full of archives and backups and all that jazz... it was like every spare compartment and cupboard had backups just in case someone at sometime wanted their originals... You'd think you are going into a closet but it's full of CD's DVD's tapes, etc. What a great place. I miss it :(

Blows minds that a fairly large band can't get their hands on their debut cd original.


Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised that they ended up in a dumpster somewhere.. Or left behind in an office or garage when a label got shut down.

We searched for more than a year for them.
#8
26th June 2009
Old 26th June 2009
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Butch and Billy,

Butch let me say it was a pleasure to meet you and set you up at the Universal owned Rondor Studio on Sepulveda. I love the work that all of you turned out on those Garbage records. They sounded great too.

Wow that sucks about the Masters. I was the last staff engineer at Rondor before they closed the doors and sold to Universal. I did not have control or access to the offsite storage nor did I know the contents. I can say however that they were not in my vault behind Studio A and the computer room. I know that Nick or myself would have seen to it that they were correctly archived and tracked.

That is a bummer. I am sorry to hear that. I would have been pissed too. There really is no excuse for losing Masters and Duplicates.

Chris
Acereject
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#9
30th June 2009
Old 30th June 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justicetones View Post
Butch and Billy,

Butch let me say it was a pleasure to meet you and set you up at the Universal owned Rondor Studio on Sepulveda. I love the work that all of you turned out on those Garbage records. They sounded great too.

Wow that sucks about the Masters. I was the last staff engineer at Rondor before they closed the doors and sold to Universal. I did not have control or access to the offsite storage nor did I know the contents. I can say however that they were not in my vault behind Studio A and the computer room. I know that Nick or myself would have seen to it that they were correctly archived and tracked.

That is a bummer. I am sorry to hear that. I would have been pissed too. There really is no excuse for losing Masters and Duplicates.

Chris
You'd have worked on "Soldier Through This" and "Get Busy With The Fizzy" I guess? February 99 I think Garbage were in Rondor for the YLSF single B-sides.

I still love "Soldier Through This" to this day, one of the strongest Garbage tracks, and the b-side to the CD2 of the fifth single from the album cycle. It shouldn't be such a classic track, but it is and it's a fan favourite. I love that it sounds so loose and untouched, almost like it was recorded in one take.

It's no excuse TWO record companies losing masters and duplicates for a record that brought in 4 million plus sales. Absolute Disgrace!!!!!
#10
30th June 2009
Old 30th June 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justicetones View Post
Butch and Billy,

Butch let me say it was a pleasure to meet you and set you up at the Universal owned Rondor Studio on Sepulveda. I love the work that all of you turned out on those Garbage records. They sounded great too.

Wow that sucks about the Masters. I was the last staff engineer at Rondor before they closed the doors and sold to Universal. I did not have control or access to the offsite storage nor did I know the contents. I can say however that they were not in my vault behind Studio A and the computer room. I know that Nick or myself would have seen to it that they were correctly archived and tracked.

That is a bummer. I am sorry to hear that. I would have been pissed too. There really is no excuse for losing Masters and Duplicates.

Chris
Thanx for checking Chris!

Maybe one of these days they'll turn up in someone's basement or attic, but since they are labeled "garbage" I'm sure they already got tossed in the garbage!
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