AFI - Sing the Sorrow

[mobius.media]

I thought we should have a thread just for AFI.

For starters, how were the guitars done? I think I read it was a Les Paul through a Plexi with maybe some Dual Rectifier here and there (?).

Any further info on guitars, pres, mics, and how they were layered would be awesome, because it was a unique sound, but still totally rocked.

Also, was the 'roominess' of the sound (sounds like verb on guit/vox) created during tracking or added in the mix?

[ButchVig]

Originally Posted by mobius.media

I thought we should have a thread just for AFI.

For starters, how were the guitars done? I think I read it was a Les Paul through a Plexi with maybe some Dual Rectifier here and there (?).

Any further info on guitars, pres, mics, and how they were layered would be awesome, because it was a unique sound, but still totally rocked.

Also, was the 'roominess' of the sound (sounds like verb on guit/vox) created during tracking or added in the mix?

These are good questions for Joe, he will know what we used on everything.

Joe and I should get into a discussion how we tracked the band! I think we recorded to tape, and I had to manually change a drum machine click track on the fly for all the tempo changes. It was nerve-wracking!

[JoeMc]

Originally Posted by ButchVig

These are good questions for Joe, he will know what we used on everything.

Joe and I should get into a discussion how we tracked the band! I think we recorded to tape, and I had to manually change a drum machine click track on the fly for all the tempo changes. It was nerve-wracking!

As long as I can unlock my drug addled brain!!!

[JoeMc]

Originally Posted by mobius.media

I thought we should have a thread just for AFI.

For starters, how were the guitars done? I think I read it was a Les Paul through a Plexi with maybe some Dual Rectifier here and there (?).

Any further info on guitars, pres, mics, and how they were layered would be awesome, because it was a unique sound, but still totally rocked.

Also, was the 'roominess' of the sound (sounds like verb on guit/vox) created during tracking or added in the mix?

Guitars: Les Pauls (one for each "side") through a bradshaw mod plexi and a a dual rectifier. Chandler TG-2 mic pre's. Royer 121 and a U67 on each Marshall 4x12 (greenbacks) all four mics mixed and sent through a Pultec EQP1A to tape.
I've used this set up often. The uniqueness of the sound comes from Jade's playing. Any reverb/room was added in the mix.

[JoeMc]

Originally Posted by ButchVig

These are good questions for Joe, he will know what we used on everything.

Joe and I should get into a discussion how we tracked the band! I think we recorded to tape, and I had to manually change a drum machine click track on the fly for all the tempo changes. It was nerve-wracking!

Yes - Pre Pro Tool tempo maps!!! Butch did in fact "play" the click while the band was tracking. Take after take!!!

[mobius.media]

Originally Posted by JoeMc

Guitars: Les Pauls (one for each "side") through a bradshaw mod plexi and a a dual rectifier. Chandler TG-2 mic pre's. Royer 121 and a U67 on each Marshall 4x12 (greenbacks) all four mics mixed and sent through a Pultec EQP1A to tape.
I've used this set up often.

Was each Les Paul performance split to the two amps, with one performance per side?

ie.
L = performance 1, Les Paul 1, Plexi and Rectifier layered
R = performance 2, Les Paul 2, Plexi and Rectifier layered

Also how many inches off do you position LDC's like U67's or U87's on cabs? I'd be afraid of blowing them out.

Originally Posted by JoeMc

Yes - Pre Pro Tool tempo maps!!! Butch did in fact "play" the click while the band was tracking. Take after take!!!

Wow, so this was one of those albums where the click was sculpted based the performances. On some, most, or all songs, if you recall?

Butch, also mentioned something about tape. Was this a tape or all PT album?

Thanks.

[JoeMc]

Originally Posted by mobius.media

Was each Les Paul performance split to the two amps, with one performance per side?

ie.
L = performance 1, Les Paul 1, Plexi and Rectifier layered
R = performance 2, Les Paul 2, Plexi and Rectifier layered

Also how many inches off do you position LDC's like U67's or U87's on cabs? I'd be afraid of blowing them out.
.

Correct - I print all amps/mics to one track. The blend we gat is the one you hear. Only pussies print every mic (and a DI) to seperate tracks. Be a man (or a chick) and commit to a sound. All of your favorite records were made that way.

[JoeMc]

Oh - mics are 2-3 inches from the grill. All phase between the mics is checked out.

[JoeMc]

Originally Posted by mobius.media

Wow, so this was one of those albums where the click was sculpted based the performances. On some, most, or all songs, if you recall?

Butch, also mentioned something about tape. Was this a tape or all PT album?

Thanks.

Every song. No tempo maps in PT. All human.
Only vocals - lead, bg and gangs - were recorded to PT. Only because we ran out of tracks.

[mobius.media]

Wow. I'm totally impressed by all of that, particularly with the purely human timing - I love that sort of thing.

Are there any other big bands you've done this approach with, like for example, was Travis Barker to a click with Blink 182 or Boxcar Racer? Or Against Me's New Wave?

Also, how many takes do you generally do of each song with this 'live' approach, and how do you know when you have it right?

And I'm curious how the production in these terms - tape, click, etc. - varied with Decemberunderground and if Blink, Boxcar or Against Me were tape as well.

Great thread. Thanks again!

[Raw-Tracks]

Originally Posted by JoeMc

Only pussies print every mic (and a DI) to seperate tracks. Be a man (or a chick) and commit to a sound. All of your favorite records were made that way.

Absolute poetry. I couldn't agree more!

[Krank]

Were the rhythm guitars with this setup hard panned?

[ButchVig]

Originally Posted by JoeMc

Every song. No tempo maps in PT. All human.
Only vocals - lead, bg and gangs - were recorded to PT. Only because we ran out of tracks.

Cutting the basics was nerve wracking. In rehearsals we had taken notes of where the tempo was at when a section of a song felt good. And some of the song had up to 10 tempo changes.

Instead of pre-programming them in PT, I programmed the tempo changes with different percussion changes in a cheap drum machine. I had to switch tempos on the fly and stay in sync with Adam. Sweaty palms, sweaty palms indeed....but it kept us on our toes...and it ended up sounding great!

[mobius.media]

Originally Posted by JoeMc

Yes - Pre Pro Tool tempo maps!!! Butch did in fact "play" the click while the band was tracking. Take after take!!!

Originally Posted by ButchVig

Instead of pre-programming them in PT, I programmed the tempo changes with different percussion changes in a cheap drum machine. I had to switch tempos on the fly and stay in sync with Adam.

Could the band hear this click as they played, or was all this click work done solely to facilitate editing (ie cutting/pasting the tape)?

[heyman]

Butch and Joe... thanks for the heads up.. I happen to think that was one of the best sounding records as well as great songs..

Love the guitar sounds.. not overly distorted.. Big and heavy but still articulate as well.

[JoeMc]

Originally Posted by mobius.media

Wow. I'm totally impressed by all of that, particularly with the purely human timing - I love that sort of thing.

Are there any other big bands you've done this approach with, like for example, was Travis Barker to a click with Blink 182 or Boxcar Racer? Or Against Me's New Wave?

Also, how many takes do you generally do of each song with this 'live' approach, and how do you know when you have it right?

And I'm curious how the production in these terms - tape, click, etc. - varied with Decemberunderground and if Blink, Boxcar or Against Me were tape as well.

Great thread. Thanks again!

Blink, Boxcar and AFI were recorded to tape. Against Me to Pro Tools

Travis played to a click as a challenge. Although I'm not sure he needed one. On Boxcar and on Take Off.... most of the drum takes were the first full take. There would be a take to hear the tones and get the headphones working - usually half a take, then off we'd go. I think there were a few punch-ins (remember, this was recorded to tape) and a couple of edits between takes (no more then 3 takes if I recall).

As for the number of takes - well that depends on the drummer.

[JoeMc]

Originally Posted by Krank

Were the rhythm guitars with this setup hard panned?

Yes. Sometimes a centered third guitar would be in the chorus.