New JBL LSR4300 "self-tuning" monitors...

[AlexLakis]

http://www.jblpro.com/pressroom/LSR4...ndAccurate.htm

Self tuning monitors? News to me...Does it work?

[Ethan Winer]

Alex,

> Does it work? <

I don't see how it possibly could. There's a lot of interest in active control (EQ, DSP) to replace big ugly bass traps and other room treatment, so you can't blame them for trying. But even in theory this is doomed to fail for many reasons. The text below if from my Acoustics FAQ.

--Ethan

Another common misconception is that equalization can be used to counter the effects of acoustic problems. But since every location in the room responds differently, no single EQ curve can give a flat response everywhere. Over a physical span of just a few inches the frequency response can vary significantly. Even if you aim to correct the response only where you sit, there's a bigger problem: It's impossible to counter very large cancellations. If acoustic interference causes a 25 dB dip at 60 Hz, adding that much boost with an equalizer to compensate will reduce the available volume (headroom) by the same amount. Such an extreme boost will increase low frequency distortion in the loudspeakers too. And at other room locations where 60 Hz is already too loud, applying EQ boost will make the problem much worse. Even if EQ could successfully raise a null, the large high-Q boost needed will create electrical ringing at that frequency. Likewise, EQ cut to reduce a peak will not reduce the peak's acoustic ringing. EQ cannot always help at higher frequencies either. If a room has ringing tones that continue after the sound source stops, EQ might make the ringing a little softer but it will still be present. However, equalization can help a little to tame low frequency peaks (only) caused by natural room resonance, as opposed to peaks and nulls due to acoustic interference, if used in moderation.

[theblue1]

Not to mention what EQ does to phase relationships in the signal.

I've never been convinced that expensive acoustic treatments were the only way to go -- but I don't think it can be properly argued that equalization (no matter how carefully calibrated) can approach the results of a properly designed and tuned monitoring room.

My $2/100...

[audiothings]

as i recall, the 6328 had promised a better bass response at the engineer's position/the place where the test microphone is placed only... under certain circumstances, i can see this as being an advantage...

Not to mention what EQ does to phase relationships in the signal.

well, i do belong to the "avoid eq as far as possible" approach, but i also think that this phase thing is slightly overrated. The adverse effects of adding eq can certainly not be ignored, but i would avoid generalisations.


self.

[Haikus]

I have a pair of the 8inch monitors... stunning pair of monitors...
the RMC mic really helps tighten the bottom end... i have it running digital 24/96..
mixing on them is a pleasure... with 1 MAJOR default tho !
Jbls have always had this problem where while mixing and monitoring from the jbls the top end sounds bright and very clear.. but once you bounce your mix and monitor it thru a different pair of monitors or home stereo... you notice a dramatic change in the top end ! the mix sounds Dull !... missing the presence ranges....
So! as far as tuning comes into place it might tune the bottom end but the soft dome tweeters side of things remains bright sounds great but hurts when your mix is bounced and herd thru different monitors !!
so now i have to re tune my monitors after the RMC has taken place.. and i havent been able to find the problematic freq and also the level of dnb i must cut and the bandwidth of the freq range to attenuate !
Dammit !


dfegad JBL !!! RMC !!!!

Haikus

"Ever been inside a Digital Stereo Field"

www.myspace.com/hykus

[LoopQuantum]

Heard the LSR4326 (6") and the LSR4328 (8")

Problem with everyone's perception on these monitors, I've found, is that they are good/bad based on how the RMC Calibration works. Setting this aside, the monitors just sound damn good. Untuned. I recently did a comparison between the 6" 4326's, ADAM P11A, and Dynaudio BM5A (which I've used extensively). Honestly, the JBL's were my favorites. The ADAM P Series stuff doesn't handle low/lowmids nearly as well as the S Series, as they just use a tradtional paper cone. This is really where the JBL's sounded great.

I Seem to recall listening to the older JBL 6 series active stuff, and finding the low end to be a bit too tubby and rounded. doesn't seen to be the case with these new ones at all.

Bottom Line: Untuned, Forgetting the EQ Correction gimmick, these monitors sound great. Brutally honest, especially for how cheap they are.

NO, I don't work for JBL, But woul dlike to for a month just so I could get a deal on a pair.

[3rd world order]

run awayyyyyyy...

[AlexLakis]

"Hold on, just lemme cut a little out of the middle..."

[WeekendWanker]

My knowledge of acoustics pretty much stops with egg cartons so forgive me if this is s stupid question, but isn't the idea that you set up the calibration mic in the mixing position so the EQ is set for just that spot? Surely nobody believes that this replaces having a well designed sonic environment, but for the growing legions of people, like myself, who are mixing in extra bedrooms this seems like a pretty good idea.

[lovingj]

Originally Posted by Weekend******

My knowledge of acoustics pretty much stops with egg cartons so forgive me if this is s stupid question, but isn't the idea that you set up the calibration mic in the mixing position so the EQ is set for just that spot? Surely nobody believes that this replaces having a well designed sonic environment, but for the growing legions of people, like myself, who are mixing in extra bedrooms this seems like a pretty good idea.

I've had the 4328s for 4 months now. They work great and have improved my mixes tremendously. Really helps with room acoustics at the mix position. Not the end all solution, but helps greatly.

[GGreen]

You cannot 'cure' problems that occur in the time and frequency domain by adjusting the frequency of your source.

Nodes are still nodes , reflections are still reflections ,

spending 500 bucks on simple but effective trapping will do a much better job.

Eq on the outputs was a fad in the 70's it didnt work then , it doesnt work now.

DSP trickery or not 'you cannot polish a turd'

GFX

[Switchcraft]

I have spoken to alot of major engineers who say they are great and can help rooms that are not perfect.