UAD-2 - Manley Massive Passive in the queue

[infiniteposse]

Just caught this on the UAD forum:

New Stuff at Manley Labs

"Universal Audio's UAD DSP Manley Massive Passive plug-in nearing completion!
Just though you guys wanted a little update about this topic. We will begin beta testing the new Massive Passive plug-in soon. Target release date is 1st QTR 2010."

Very excited to see how this comes together. Likely another expensive one, but I'm still waiting with baited breath.

[K-Slash]

Well,

It seems that only for the Fatso Sr., Neve 33609 and Massive Passive, the UAD-2 is going to be worth it !

Now, just waiting for MkII versions of the classics to get into the party.

[salomonander]

wow...another eq that will sound just like the others...i'm getting tired of uad these days.

[arimaka]

Originally Posted by K-Slash

Well,

It seems that only for the Fatso Sr., Neve 33609 and Massive Passive, the UAD-2 is going to be worth it !

Now, just waiting for MkII versions of the classics to get into the party.

What do you mean mkII versions of the classics??
Better fairchild, 1176, LA-2A emulations??? Didn't know they where going to do that!!

[LokiProducer]

They did a survey a lil' while ago asking if it's customers would enjoy updated versions of their classics. I would guess the pultec, 1176, LA2a, and LA3a. maybe more, but I don't really see them doing ocean way's fairchild again.

This sounds new sounds good to me tho! This EQ isn't going to sound like the others with UAD because with Manley being the way they are about Tubes and skepticism of the digital world.. I'm sure it'll induce harmonics (tubes duh), have some saturation characteristics, maybe even some analog noise (which I think would be the only first in UAD land). I could be wrong tho.. However UAD has been growing in emulation like the rest of the market so I assume it'll be rockin'.

[K-Slash]

Originally Posted by arimaka

What do you mean mkII versions of the classics??
Better fairchild, 1176, LA-2A emulations??? Didn't know they where going to do that!!

Well it's NOT official, and it's NOT sure that they're going to do MkII versions, but there was some official talk and a survey about what people would love to see next for UAD plugins, and there was some words about it...

Lot of people are wanting enhanced versions of the Pultec, Fairchild, 1176 and LA-2A emulations...

The questions is WHEN ?

The fact is that UAD modelled only the curves from the EQs and the compression behaviour for the COMPs... Whereas Waves, IK Multimedia and Softube modelled saturation/distortion characteristics, and even transformers and so on for some of them.

And lot of people agree to say that soundwise and about the behaviour compared to the real deal, these latest native plugins are BETTER. Period.

With the UAD-2 offering more horsepower, I don't see why they wouldn't release it right ?

[audiomichael]

Originally Posted by K-Slash

The fact is that UAD modelled only the curves from the EQs and the compression behaviour for the COMPs...

What is this 'fact' based on?

[kreeper_6]

Originally Posted by salomonander

wow...another eq that will sound just like the others...i'm getting tired of uad these days.

You must not know much about EQ's then, or atleast why the Massive is not the usual UAD channel EQ.

[K-Slash]

Originally Posted by audiomichael

What is this 'fact' based on?

Based on measures an analysis some more "techy" people than me made.

Like here, starting at 3 minutes 05 seconds :
YouTube - Fairchild 670 and Pultec plugin test using UAD, T-Racks and URS

And some people and compressor junkies with better trained ears than me like bManic and such told the same things.

I also saw analysis at KVR Audio's forum, comparing Waves CLA and UAD versions of the LA-2A and 1176 but didn't have the link here.

[bmanic]

Originally Posted by audiomichael

What is this 'fact' based on?

It's extremely simple to check this fact yourself. Just run some sines through the thing and start looking for harmonic distortion. You'll find none. (make sure you do not compress or you'll add some harmonics due to gain riding.. even these can be measured and compared to the hardware and you'll quickly see how "wrong" they got the 1176).

UA ain't above marketing bullshit. If you ever thought that.. then I welcome you to the real world.

Cheers!
bManic

[Mr.HOLMES]

I dont understand UAD anymore.

Is there quantity or qualty in the game?
So every 3-4 months they have new plug ins..... that makes me sceptic a lot.

OK THE EMT 250 is fantastic well done!

They should take care first that thier classics 1176 / LA2A / LA3A as well as faichild can compete with the native qualty from Softube and Waves etc. before they go on to medell something else. I am really pissed that the native plugs of the above named types sound better as my DSP version which was a ****ing expensive DSP CARD....

The Question is when is UAD gping to start to modell not only the relase and attack beahvoir but also the sound shaping and saturation caracteristics of the gear?
It is there yes but in very low doses and when I think of the inner life of a fairchild I belive when it is working hard you have to hear something realy going on.

If they really want to stand out form native plug ins they should hurry up otherwise I will sell my UAD Quad Card.

It is simple and easy just install the demo of the Waves fairchild and run a dynamik vocal sampel thourgh it the compressor is not working hard and you can hear nice saturation going on... I dont want that it sounds exact like the real deal how could that be analouge is still a bit up front but something of the magic off all the tubes and transformers which are in the original unit must be in the sonics included...and Waves did this vey very well IMO.....

Since the newer native Versions I am disapointed for the hard earned money I spent to UAD for every single plug in plus the costs of the DSP Cards.
I bought two expensive UAD one Cards 3 years later one expensive UAD 2 Qaud Card... so they made money with every user like me.... now is the day where they can proof taht it was worth the cash....

[Synergy Media]

Originally Posted by Mr.HOLMES

I dont understand UAD anymore.

Ok, remind me how old those UAD plugs are? Wahh, something made YEARS later sounds better. You'll be able to run hundreds of the old plugs on the new hardware I'm sure. Now that the hardware has evolved I'm sure they will make new versions.

I'm sure they would have considered them on the UAD-1 if there wasn't soo much bitching about how people couldn't run the 1000's of neve plugs they wanted to.

Originally Posted by Mr.HOLMES

Is there quantity or qualty in the game?
So every 3-4 months they have new plug ins..... that makes me sceptic a lot.

I believe it's about having more then one team... this EQ has been in development for over a year

[SoundEng1]

Varimu would have been much cooler, Oh Well.

[electricsound]

Originally Posted by SoundEng1

Varimu would have been much cooler, Oh Well.

and someone would still feel it necessary to whinge about "yet another compressor"...

[Mr.HOLMES]

Originally Posted by Synergy Media

Ok, remind me how old those UAD plugs are? Wahh, something made YEARS later sounds better. You'll be able to run hundreds of the old plugs on the new hardware I'm sure. Now that the hardware has evolved I'm sure they will make new versions.

I'm sure they would have considered them on the UAD-1 if there wasn't soo much bitching about how people couldn't run the 1000's of neve plugs they wanted to.

I just can speak for myself.
I do not need 100 instances of 1176 and I do not need 1000 instances of any other plug in. I am pretty happy with about 3-6 instances of an 1176 in basic rock mix may 2 instances LA2A and I am pretty damm happy.

Now I see native stuff for example the Softube FET is so darn near to the real hardware that the UAD Blackface Plug In is a LAME DUCK.

Ok times have changed I know but I asked why the hell they are not keeping up to date the classics tools every enginner even in small digital places like mine go crazy about.

Originally Posted by Synergy Media

I believe it's about having more then one team... this EQ has been in development for over a year

I dont care how many teams they have!
I paid pretty much money in my store for three cards two UAD-1 and one UAD-2 Quad cards all over all....
3.100,00 Euros = 4441,00 US $ + near 500 US $ for plug ins at thier store.

I think I can say with all respect to thier work that my investment should be worth to get the best emualtions in the market I can buy for my hard earned cash.

And that is at the moment 2010 not the case anymore, except the newer plug ins such as the NEVE 33609 the Neve EQs and the EMT 250.

Thats my opinion... SORRY UAD.

I am willed to pay an small upgrade fee to MKII Versions.

But again check the Softube FET against the real hardware and there is not a lot of crtice left in comparsion I did it and the UAD 1176 plug was LAME in comparsion....

[Mr.HOLMES]

Originally Posted by SoundEng1

Varimu would have been much cooler, Oh Well.

The fairchild is an VARIMU....we still need an MKII version of it.

[Silver Sonya]

We all know that as soon as they do a MKII, someone will claim MKI was warmer.

They'll have to make a "classic" version.

GS madness! Boo ya!

- c

[Mr.HOLMES]

Originally Posted by Silver Sonya

We all know that as soon as they do a MKII, someone will claim MKI was warmer.

They'll have to make a "classic" version.

GS madness! Boo ya!

- c

Sorry I am not mad I trust my ears....

[kreeper_6]

You people are fackin' spoiled!

[ProducerBoy]

Originally Posted by kreeper_6

You people are fackin' spoiled!

Haha

People expect too much from software companies. Without looking behind the curtain and at the books, people expect a level of agility that isn't going to happen.

I predict a pendulum of consumer movement here.

Right now, UA's decade old software is sounding a little long in the tooth against the new kids (Softube's FET comp, Waves CLA...). So, people snub their nose at UA and run over to the hot new thing.

UA, who is trying to stay in touch with their customer's desires, releases something a little down the road that gives them the edge. The shine wears off the Softube stuff. Waves starts sending out their WUP is due emails, and customers start looking back at UA.

Then Waves or some cool smaller company comes back with something new and so swings the consumer pendulum in an often fickle consumer base.

[steff3]

Originally Posted by Mr.HOLMES

I dont understand UAD anymore.

Is there quantity or qualty in the game?
So every 3-4 months they have new plug ins..... that makes me sceptic a lot.

OK THE EMT 250 is fantastic well done!

They should take care first that thier classics 1176 / LA2A / LA3A as well as faichild can compete with the native qualty from Softube and Waves etc. before they go on to medell something else.

Well, if you look at the Fatso Jr - it eats up the new DSP chips. If they do high q stuff of the old - how much can you run on a current quad? They need better hardware IMHO - the UAD2 single is expensive but, kick it, ways too underpowered. They should replace the line with a Duo, Quad and Octo at the prices of the current models.

What will we see in native processing this year? 12core or 16 core with additional processing on grapic cards ...

The games has chanced dramatically since they released the UAD1, not sure if the UAD2 line is up for todays standards.

best

[Ermz]

The DSP thing is heading toward byebye land until these companies start putting some serious processing grunt into their chips. The current generation of native plug-ins sound rather good, and are perfectly capable of running competently on a modern CPU. Once the new generation of hardware turns over, it's going to feel a little silly to invest in an over-priced DSP platform that's loaded with largely legacy plug-ins that don't hold up to native offerings, and can't even be run in as many instances to boot.

I just can't understand why anyone would be in the market for UAD or PTHD these days, apart from the concession of conforming to industry standards.

All the same I'm happy to you UAD owners for getting some more options with your plug-ins. I hope the Massive Passive plug-in is as good as Nebula's inevitable take on it will be.

[bmanic]

Originally Posted by steff3

Well, if you look at the Fatso Jr - it eats up the new DSP chips. If they do high q stuff of the old - how much can you run on a current quad? They need better hardware IMHO - the UAD2 single is expensive but, kick it, ways too underpowered. They should replace the line with a Duo, Quad and Octo at the prices of the current models.

What will we see in native processing this year? 12core or 16 core with additional processing on grapic cards ...

The games has chanced dramatically since they released the UAD1, not sure if the UAD2 line is up for todays standards.

best

Bingo! This is exactly what some of us have been saying since the UAD1 days. The card is a dongle. It is their copy protection. Anybody thinking that they are actually getting a DSP "bargain" and a powerhouse is dreaming. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad that the UAD2 got once again all the "OMG!! Itzzz superz powerfulz! Greatz!!!" hype upon release. Good thing they released the Fatso Jr. this early so people can actually see how underpowered it is, even the Quad.

My guess is that the future in DSP processing will come from Nvidia and ATI. They are already very far ahead in the bang for the buck arena from the consumers point of view but there is perhaps less money to be made on the hardware itself for the manufacturer.. which is why UA chose the cheap sharc dsp. They'll make a killing on the hardware itself in just a year or two (they already are).

Basically they are riding entirely on their plugin quality (which is extremely high, there is no denying that). Once the competition catches up (if they ever will).. it'll be much harder for them to sell underpowered dongles.. actually, extremely effective dongles. AFAIK the UAD platform is the only one that has never been hacked/cracked. That's a pretty solid protection right there. Which is why they can make all em famous officially licensed and endorsed plugins.

Damn.. I really, REALLY like their stuff but I.. must.. resist.. the.. uad2.. temptation! Aaargggghhhhhhh! Pay day!

Fail..

Cheers!
bManic

[Marando]

Originally Posted by Ermz

The DSP thing is heading toward byebye land until these companies start putting some serious processing grunt into their chips. [..]

I think there is one road for UAD to follow.. it's hybrid. Allow the CPU to assist the DSP's, like SSL is doing with the Duende.

Keep the DSP platform for people that still like the extra DSP power and keep it becuase it's a pretty crack proof dongle.

[hugol]

Originally Posted by bmanic

Bingo! This is exactly what some of us have been saying since the UAD1 days. The card is a dongle. It is their copy protection. Anybody thinking that they are actually getting a DSP "bargain" and a powerhouse is dreaming. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad that the UAD2 got once again all the "OMG!! Itzzz superz powerfulz! Greatz!!!" hype upon release. Good thing they released the Fatso Jr. this early so people can actually see how underpowered it is, even the Quad.

Yep I agree. The underpowered cards are holding them back from letting loose on really great emulations IMHO which should be their forte. The newer emulations are great, but already fairly pricey for plug-ins and the fact is you get woefully few instances on what is pretty expensive DSP hardware. The Quad still offers some worthwhile co-processing, but it's ridiculously overpriced and probably should have been the baseline offering IMO.

SSL are managing to ship the Duende at a great price now. UAD are taking the biscuit still shipping the Quad at such a premium which has 4 very similar DSP chips albeit at 20% lower clock speed ...and SSL don't have the extensive after-sales plugin offerings that UAD have, so you'd think they'd be keener to get people on the platform.

Personally I'd like to see them going to town on the emulations. So either go hybrid or whatever, or price the cards far more attractively. UAD aren't stupid though and they managed to do amazingly well on the rather cr*p UAD-1 card, but let's just hope they're not counting on history repeating itself.

[arimaka]

To me.... UAD-2 makes much more sense economically than TDM.
I do think that Graphics cards from NVIDIA and ATI are the way to go in the future.... Apple already has Open CL technology that can potentially run AU's on these... Let's hope someone starts to get that going a la Nebula.

[Mr.HOLMES]

I see I am not the only one who thinks it deserves better emualtions of the old classic stuff as they have today.

For me there are 3 posibele choices.

1. I wait till nebula is AU and go on with it.

2. I wait till UAD is back on TOP again.

3. I buy Softube / Waves CLA / EMI stuff and jump off the DSP factory.

I repeat myself I do not need million instances in a mix it is pretty alright if an 1176 takes some power of my UAD Quad CARD. If it sounds awsome and I need more power I would buy a second Quad card no Problem with that ... if something works outstanding and has sonics near to the real deal I am in the game to spend money.

But at this point here I am not willed to spend more money on UAD till the thing sounds at minimum as goood as Softube and or Waves CLA/JJP...

Again I do not need another EQ by UAD we have so much EQs which all does not sound like HW in the HF range.... another problem waht not have been solved by any comapny except Nebula.

But now think!!
Nebula is a cheap thing comapred to UAD Waves or any other bigger plug in developper.

The reason for me why Nebula is doing its stuff for the sound to get the best out of it and other companies does not stay on top is easy to explain.
And yes this takes some serious CPU Power. In the bigger comapnies someone off the marketing department steps in and says to the developper... "Sorry it must be possible to open 200 instances of this plug in".....

Waht is totaly BS I do not need so much instances I need good sound what comes near to the real deal as it can get today.
When UAD is getting this solved I am back in the game to spend money on thier DSP Farm but at the moment I am as a user in really ****in PAD Situation....

Going on with DSP or NATIVE?

[gundam]

I'm totally with bmanic, holmes and steff3. Yet, I'm kind of eager to hear the uad massive passive emu against the nebula counterpart. And if the two of them sound very very close, you all know how fairly priced is nebula compared to the uad platform.

Never wondered why UA gives you so many coupons? You've already paid for those when you purchased the card(s) in the first place. Clever marketing, I must say.

[danger]

my problem is the same with the uad2 cards, insanely expensive, i would rather pay more for the plugs but the cards should be at least cut the half price, there is no reason to be that expensive. in this way i would go for native, the quality this year is going to amaze us all.
another way is what SSL chose, hope they sort out the driver soon, very promising platform, they have something for the NAMM.

[Silver Sonya]

People's ideas of "insanely expensive" blow my mind.

The sense of entitlement is unbridled!

- c